DC Archbishop Sues Mayor Muriel Bowser For ‘Arbitrary, Unscientific And Discriminatory’ Restrictions Ahead Of Christmas

  • Thread starter Thread starter mdgspencer
  • Start date Start date
Status
Not open for further replies.
This is where I have an issue with lock downs. If you are going to mandate a lock down, the only essential things needed are front line type groups. You cant pick and choice one over the other.
 
Of course these restriction have been harsher on churches since March, just discrimination…

Abortion clinics and marijuana stores were open.
 
This is where I have an issue with lock downs. If you are going to mandate a lock down, the only essential things needed are front line type groups. You cant pick and choice one over the other.
One thing I found weird was that ice cream shops were open where I am, but not opticians. If my glasses break, I need an optician. I can live without ice cream.
 
When the first restrictions were applied in my jurisdiction, the rules were expressed in very simple terms. It meant that a cathedral and a small church were both limited to the same numbers. Over time, and when the pandemic was much better under control (not yet the case in USA), more nuanced rules were implemented.

I trust the bishop has tried discussion. What reasons have been provided by the authorities for not adjusting rules to take account of venue size or for other apparent inconsistencies?
 
Here in NY Cuomo has already been smacked down by the US Supreme Court twice because his restrictions have been harsher for religious groups. There seems to be a pattern.
 
Here in NY Cuomo has already been smacked down by the US Supreme Court twice because his restrictions have been harsher for religious groups. There seems to be a pattern.
That such matters aren’t resolved through sensible discussion seems astounding. That a governor would intentionally risk the ire of a material proportion of the community for no good reason seems astounding.
 
Last edited:
Good! Go get 'em Cardinal Gregory. Makes me like him better already.

Most of the mayors of DC have been less than competent in my opinion/ experience. Mayor Barry, for all his faults, was actually one of the better ones…that says a lot about the average holder of the office. The only other one I admired was Mayor Williams. Mayor Bowser has not impressed me with her handling of the pandemic, the riots, or anything to be honest.

Oh, and this is one instance where it really helps to have an African-American archbishop doing the suing.
 
Last edited:
So far, these lawsuits have been successful when they have shown a disproportionate strictness based on perceived lack of need to accommodate religion.
 
When the first restrictions were applied in my jurisdiction, the rules were expressed in very simple terms. It meant that a cathedral and a small church were both limited to the same numbers.
Which by definition means that those rules were arbitrary and capricious.
 
Which by definition means that those rules were arbitrary and capricious.
The intention I believe was to be simple, clear and effective. So the rules were not nuanced and carefully tuned to each circumstance. The health authorities were reacting to the urgency of the circumstances, not being vindictive or intentionally harsher towards religious groups. Perhaps in the US motivations are different.
 
The intention I believe was to be simple, clear and effective.
“Limited to X% of capacity” is every bit as simple and clear as “no more than Y number”, and is much more effective in reducing transmission.
So the rules were not nuanced and carefully tuned to each circumstance.
Which means that they wouldn’t be effective. Pulling arbitrary head count caps out of some rear end is exactly the wrong thing to do; such capriciousness smacks of totalitarianism and and merely generates widespread contempt for legitimate governmental regulations.
The health authorities were reacting to the urgency of the circumstances, not being vindictive or intentionally harsher towards religious groups…
Recent history indicates otherwise, and not just in the US.
 
Last edited:
In the US, most politicians see going to church as an optional activity, because they themselves either don’t practice any religion or else practice one that doesn’t place a big value on actually attending a church.

It’s basically short-sighted cluelessness and the courts fortunately are there to correct the short-sightedness, stupidity, and in some cases, bias, of our elected leaders, many of whom on the local and state level are at least borderline incompetent as I have already said in the thread.
 
Last edited:
Recent history indicates otherwise
Presumably you have reasons for adopting such a negative interpretation. I can’t help but think there is some correlation between that predisposition and the poor response to the pandemic, and the terrible toll it has taken, in the USA.
 
In the US, most politicians see going to church as an optional activity,
I’d say that’s fairly universal, although it’s the health authorities here crafting the rules by and large. The mass attendance obligation is a discipline. Our bishops dispensed all but priests early on. They’ve just recently lifted the dispensation because the rules have been eased to the point where with some effort, people should be able to get to a mass.

For us at least the rules were crafted to be rapidly put together, easily understood, easily implemented and easily checked and enforced. Of course there’s been grumbling when that leads to inconsistencies and so on, but the authorities are broadly supported and no one is promoting a theory that there are anti-religion forces at work. I’ve only come across that idea on CAF. The idea that there might be some incompetence in government circles is embraced here too. But it has not caused a rush of court cases!
 
A feature of the US governance system is that private persons and entities are expected to file a court case to protect their rights. For the most part, they don’t have a ministry or an agency to complain to or that looks after their interests. Even when they do have some agency to complain to, they often have to go through some kind of quasi-judicial complaint process with that agency in order to make themselves heard.

In the US, filing a lawsuit is often the only way to get the attention of the government, or anyone else, to sit down and talk to you. “Discussion” is usually not going to work unless your lawyer sent a lawyer letter or filed a suit first. This is also why the US has way more lawyers than most other countries. The lawyers are in part serving a regulatory function that is served in many other countries by agencies and ministries.

Most legal cases settle after the parties have discussed. The law encourages settlements of that sort. But if you don’t sue, the other party is not just going to magnanimously hand you a settlement.
 
Last edited:
A feature of the US governance system is that private persons and entities are expected to file a court case to protect their rights.
That makes for an expensive system!
For the most part, they don’t have a ministry or an agency to complain to or that looks after their interests.
That’s understandable. I’d be surprised if an archbishop found it impossible to communicate with the local authorities other than by filing suit! There’s always the media and usually informal processes - they simply require some goodwill.
In the US, filing a lawsuit is often the only way to get the attention of the government, or anyone else, to sit down and talk to you.
Remember we’re not talking about individuals wanting to discuss the matter with the authorities, but leaders who represent very large constituencies.
Most legal cases settle after the parties have discussed.
I guess my premise is that having to invoke a legal process as the first step does not seem to be a good model. Good for lawyers though.
 
Status
Not open for further replies.
Back
Top