Debating CoC preacher about Infant Baptism

[NotWorthy]

With eleven pages in this thread, maybe somebody has mentioned that in his early works, Alexander Campbell advocated infant baptism.

Amber

That’s good to know, amber. Where did you get this information?

 

[Jack_Bauer]

That’s good to know, amber. Where did you get this information?

Sorry, but Amber is wrong. Alexander Campbell’s background was in the Presbyterian Church where infant baptisms took place. However, if you read this focusmagazine.org/tdoy/articles/campbellwalkerdebate.htm you’ll see that he did not believe in infant baptism. It’s one of the many reasons he formed the Disciples of Christ, which ultimately gave birth to the Church of Christ in 1906, which opposed musical instruments for one.

 

[jcrichton]

(sorry, must edit queries and replies) Now you’ve said there is only one baptism and you’ve said there are different baptisms… apostalic succession, which would be the Catholic or Orthodox churches, so I was correct in my assertion that
Cathoilics view my baptism is invalid… Didn’t you mention a few posts ago that no one should judge to whom or when the Holy Spirit should come? …I baptize you in the name of the Father, the Son, and the Holy Spirit… "

There’s but One Baptism! The Church Teaches that that Baptism is Sacramental; yet, there are bodies that deny this… hence, their “symbolic” Baptism has no merit… if your personal Baptism has been made as described by you (Father, Son, and Holy Spirit) the intent of the persons involved showed that it was a Sacramental Baptism… hence, it is only One Baptism!

…judgment about the Holy Spirit: the Catholic Church believes that non-Catholics Christians are part of Christ’s Body; it is not always so from the other side of the divide where Christians reject Full Communion with the Body while seeking to connvert Catholics to Christianity!

…Jesus never said there had to be an apostle present or a seccessor to an apostle. However, I do find Scripture that tells me that Jesus is present not only during communion time, but whenever Christians gather to worship Him.
Matthew 18:20 For where two or three are gathered together in my name, there am I in the midst of them.

…and I have no problem with Scriptures… however, what does it really mean? …there’s a similar passage where Jesus states that “everything that you ask in My Name the Father will Grant it…” everything? …anything?

Gathering in Christ name means abiding in Him (St. John 15:1-10); when we pick and choose what we accept about Jesus’ Word or when we spin Scriptures… “Believe” or “gather” are mere words (St. John 14, 15, 16, and 6)!

So you assert there is no salvation outside the Catholic Church… If an atheist is shipwrecked and alone on an island with a Bible, can they come to Christ and salvation by reading it?

No, I did not assert just quite that; the Fullness of Faith is found only in the Church Founded by Christ, yet, she asserts that there are Christians found outside of her fold–she refers to them as “separated brothers.”

…as for your type: it is not that Scriptures alone cannot offer Salvation; the fact is that man does not willingly submit his will to God’s; that has been our problem from Creation and it is the reason why Christ Founded His Church… here’s my counter scene: put 100 Christians on that island with 101 Bibles and see how many will join me on a “Catholic” boat!

First of all, only a fool would reject something only because it was taught by a denomination they disagree with. If that was true no Protestant would believe in Jesus, his ministry, His death and resurrection, or the ministry and writings of the apostles.

…I think you missed the part about “selective;” many non-Catholics do not believe that the Bible was compiled by the Church.

…again, as an example: Yahweh vs. Jehovah!

Still part of church history, a tradition which you so adamantly insist has equal authority as Scripture. Are you saying traditions can vary from early Church practices?

…the preaching of the Gospel incorporated only the Old Testament Writings till the Holy Spirit Inspired the New Testament Writing; various NT Books demonstrate a Church in development; from the battles of the Apostles till today the Church has been fighting heresies and placing Doctrine into text; and… had the Church remained unchanged we would still be gathering on Sabbath Day in Jewish synagogues and practicing the Mosaic traditions (no New Testament/Bible).

…as point of thought, why is it that none of the anti-infant/children Baptism proponents have no problems with St. Paul?

How can doctrine evolve? …how can the message of Christ and meanings of the New Testament letters change? …Ecclesiastes 1:9…

Perhaps I chose the wrong term… but the fact is that understanding has changed and it changed according to Christ’s Design (I will send you another Paraclete that will bring you the total Truth and will remind you of the things I said…); it was St. Peter that declared that the New Testament Writings were also Sacred Scriptures and it was St. Paul that defined the Rock as Jesus traveling with the Hebrews… those of the Way became known as Christians and as the Church grew, guided by the Holy Spirit, new offices were created (Bishops, Presbyters, Deacons…)

…What I meant was why try to redefine wine as grape juice? I agree that trying to explain away Scripture when it doesn’t fit your theology is wrong, like this verse:

23:9 And call no man your father upon the earth: for one is your Father, which is in heaven.

I think that the issue was that those whose belief determine that any alcoholic veberage is sin ignore Scriptures when it reveals that Jesus turned water into wine (not grape juice)–which could be hiding a deeper agenda as the Church Believes as the Apostles, in the Sacramental Bread and Wine: the Body and Blood of our Lord!

…I do not follow the meaning of verse 23:9–are you asking why we call Priests Fathers?

Maran atha!

Angel

PS: Same here, good to find you here; things were good here not even the storm did much more than cause 14 hours of energy blackout!

 

[amber_lux]

you’ll see that he did not believe in infant baptism.

You missed the “in his early works” part of my answer.

He was challenged on the issue of paedobaptism. Based on the results of his study, he changed his mind, and later wrote articles against paedobaptism.

Amber

 

[Jack_Bauer]

You missed the “in his early works” part of my answer.

He was challenged on the issue of paedobaptism. Based on the results of his study, he changed his mind, and later wrote articles against paedobaptism.

Amber

That does make more sense. My background is Church of Christ (CoC)

If your interested you can check the following website out, with many other links of former CoC Christians:

coctocatholic.com/index.php?sid=a1c4bf64bdf8e14d20b66a99a2d915ef

 

[Jack_Bauer]

You missed the “in his early works” part of my answer.

He was challenged on the issue of paedobaptism. Based on the results of his study, he changed his mind, and later wrote articles against paedobaptism.

Amber

That does make more sense. My background is Church of Christ (CoC)

If your interested you can check the following website out, with many other links of former CoC Christians:

coctocatholic.com