Denying the Crucifixion

[swariffin]

Hi

There is no secular historic evidence for the assertion that Jesus existed prior to Mohammad and Islam. It is only because of Quran that we believe Jesus and Mary existed.

Thanks

Good, there is no secular historic evidence that Quran was dictated by the angel of Gabriel too. I know the story (although I don’t believe it) because the muslims are keep talking about it.

 

[swariffin]

My question was a rhetorical one. I simply wanted to remind dear paarsurey that there would have been no Christians (believers in Christ) before Mohammad if Christ had not existed.

And there would be no Jesus and Mary ever written in Quran

 

[Lilyflower]

My question was a rhetorical one. I simply wanted to remind dear paarsurey that there would have been no Christians (believers in Christ) before Mohammad if Christ had not existed.

Sorry I misunderstood you

Blessings

 

[inJESUS]

The OP asked a specific question. Gnostics believed as Muslims, or actually Muhammad adopted gnostic teachings…as clear as the sun.

 

[Angelos]

Sorry I misunderstood you

Blessings

No problem!

Blessings back.

 

[Angelos]

The OP asked a specific question. Gnostics believed as Muslims, or actually Muhammad adopted gnostic teachings…as clear as the sun.

However, Gnostics had theological reasons and a well-developed system of thought while denying the crucifixion unlike the Koran.

 

[inJESUS]

However, Gnostics had theological reasons and a well-developed system of thought while denying the crucifixion unlike the Koran.

indeed, that is why there is no Muslim who understands what the Quran is talking about, so you find people saying it was someone else, others saying he was crucified but did not die, and others say there was no crucifixion at all…fact is, to understand the Quranic aya, they must understand the gnostic interpretation, not their sheikh’s imagination

 

[Angelos]

indeed, that is why there is no Muslim who understands what the Quran is talking about, so you find people saying it was someone else, others saying he was crucified but did not die, and others say there was no crucifixion at all…fact is, to understand the Quranic aya, they must understand the gnostic interpretation, not their sheikh’s imagination

Surah 4: 157. And because of their saying: We slew the Messiah, Jesus son of Mary, Allah’s messenger - they slew him not nor crucified him, but it appeared so unto them; and lo! those who disagree concerning it are in doubt thereof; they have no knowledge thereof save pursuit of a conjecture; they slew him not for certain.

I have discovered two problems with this verse:

1) The Koran claims that those who disagree concerning Jesus’ death are in doubt thereof, but forgets to say who disagrees from whom. Thus, it is possible to presume that this verse condemns Muslims for following a conjecture because Muslims disagree from Jews and Christians concerning Jesus’ crucifixion.

2) This verse contends that disagreements always indicate lack of knowledge. This supposition backfires and leads us to the conclusion that Muslim scholars know nothing about Jesus’ crucifixion because they can never reach a consensus on this issue due to the lack of a detailed narrative and adequate information in the Koran.

 

[inJESUS]

Indeed Angelos, the only people who are in doubt about it and follow conjectures are the Muslims themselves.