Did God create the abyss?

[Wafflenator]

I don’t know if “abyss” has a specific meaning in philosophy, so let’s define it as emptiness and the space between things.

 

[Aloysium]

The emptiness between things can be thought of as that which defines them. No space, no individual things. It is not so much empty, but filled with light going in every which direction. Space and time can be understood as being dimensions of one thing in which events occur, and which describes the gravitational relationship between the objects it contains. That’s my :twocents:

Oh yes, it is part of creation. God is its creator.

 

[Binto]

As long as it’s not “nothing”, I’d say it’s valid that “the abyss” is a part of creation, especially if you’re talking about the space between things. I think you can scientifically define it as a vacuum of electromagnetic energy and radiation with a few hydrogen atoms sprinkled every few meters. My $0.02 as well!

 

[CeelosDeznos]

I don’t know if “abyss” has a specific meaning in philosophy, so let’s define it as emptiness and the space between things.

In Hebrew cosmology and Scripture, the “abyss” refers to the ancient belief that the universe consisted mainly of water. In this Mesopatamian “science,” the model of creation had no vacuum of space. Instead water surrounded the world, and if one went “too deep” into the seas or ocean, one could pass down beyond the foundation “pillars” which held up the land, and enter the “abyss” of waters.

These “waters” even surrounded the “firmament” of heaven, which was believed to be a metallic like structure of enormous size upon which the sun and moon and stars had been affixed by God. This dome had “flood gates” that allowed the waters from the abyss to come to the earth in the form of rain or snow.

This explains why God is spoken of as having to divide the “waters from the waters” in Genesis 1:6. It is also the reason the flood of Noah is spoken of in the terms such as “the windows of the heavens were opened.” (Genesis 7:11) And it is why St. Peter described the model of creation in the following terms: “An earth formed out of water and through water.” (2 Peter 3:5) The water of the abyss was believed to be a “soup” which contained all the elements from which God created the world, even life. (Psalm 18:16) These are the “waters” of which God’s Spirit moved over.–Genesis 1:2.

There are connections not only to life in the “abyss,” but death as well. Jewish tradition saw it as bottomless, a gateway to Sheol. It’s gateway is guarded by an angel in the book of Revelation.–Revelation 9:11.

Of course, there is no such thing as the abyss in physical terms. Instead of water, there is a vacuum of space surrounding the earth, and one cannot enter it by traveling through the oceans, nor does the land of earth sit on pillars.

But this was the best “science of the day,” so to speak, and one might say that just as the cosmos is the creation of God, the “abyss” of ancient description is but a part of God’s making. However, there is no clue from Scripture that the “abyss” has a beginning or end. It is just there, even before God begins working to create as described in Genesis. It may have been viewed as eternal as God, as God is also spoken of as dwelling atop the waters and giving commands at Psalm 29:3.

 

[grannymh]

I don’t know if “abyss” has a specific meaning in philosophy, so let’s define it as emptiness and the space between things.

Because your thread title refers to God …
Please, which Scripture quote are you using?

The source for philosophy is universal.

 

[Wafflenator]

So sin is an absence of goodness, an absence of knowledge of God. That is not knowledge in the Platonist sense that we do evil because we don’t know better, but knowledge in the sense of intimacy. At least that was my impression reading the New Testament.

If abyss is what gives shape to matter, then we would not say that abyss relates to matter the way that sin relates to virtue. Yes?

In that case, would it be acceptable to refer to abyss as a creature?

 

[e_c]

Google “prime matter.”

 

[Richca]

I don’t know if “abyss” has a specific meaning in philosophy, so let’s define it as emptiness and the space between things.

In Holy Scripture, abyss is a place and a part of God’s creation. For whatever exists ‘outside’ of God is something created by him. The bible begins with “In the beginning God created the heavens and the earth.” This includes everything that exists outside of God or that is not God, namely, the whole universe of creatures which includes the angels and the whole corporeal world.

 

[thinkandmull]

In Hebrew cosmology and Scripture, the “abyss” refers to the ancient belief that the universe consisted mainly of water. In this Mesopatamian “science,” the model of creation had no vacuum of space. Instead water surrounded the world, and if one went “too deep” into the seas or ocean, one could pass down beyond the foundation “pillars” which held up the land, and enter the “abyss” of waters.

These “waters” even surrounded the “firmament” of heaven, which was believed to be a metallic like structure of enormous size upon which the sun and moon and stars had been affixed by God. This dome had “flood gates” that allowed the waters from the abyss to come to the earth in the form of rain or snow.

This explains why God is spoken of as having to divide the “waters from the waters” in Genesis 1:6. It is also the reason the flood of Noah is spoken of in the terms such as “the windows of the heavens were opened.” (Genesis 7:11) And it is why St. Peter described the model of creation in the following terms: “An earth formed out of water and through water.” (2 Peter 3:5) The water of the abyss was believed to be a “soup” which contained all the elements from which God created the world, even life. (Psalm 18:16) These are the “waters” of which God’s Spirit moved over.–Genesis 1:2.

There are connections not only to life in the “abyss,” but death as well. Jewish tradition saw it as bottomless, a gateway to Sheol. It’s gateway is guarded by an angel in the book of Revelation.–Revelation 9:11.

Of course, there is no such thing as the abyss in physical terms. Instead of water, there is a vacuum of space surrounding the earth, and one cannot enter it by traveling through the oceans, nor does the land of earth sit on pillars.

But this was the best “science of the day,” so to speak, and one might say that just as the cosmos is the creation of God, the “abyss” of ancient description is but a part of God’s making. However, there is no clue from Scripture that the “abyss” has a beginning or end. It is just there, even before God begins working to create as described in Genesis. It may have been viewed as eternal as God, as God is also spoken of as dwelling atop the waters and giving commands at Psalm 29:3.

I understand the “from the water” but not 'through the water". What did Peter mean?