Discerning Burning call to the Diaconate

[salvereginadude]

Honestly, right now, I feel that the Lord is calling me to the diaconate. I’ve been thinking about it for a long time, and it only became certain in my mind after a permanent deacon taught last week’s RCIA lesson and told us a little about what life being a deacon is like. One thing he said continues to stick out in my mind. He said he thought that he could serve God greater not being behind a Roman collar. I totally understand what he’s saying. I’ve been agonizing recently because I have been thinking that I have a call to the priesthood. I’ve heard it said that when you’re so in love with the Mass and with the Church that you can never stop thinking about them that this is one of the signs you are called to the holy priesthood. But my friends are very important to me. And I could never imagine giving them up being dedicated totally to God. Even though the diaconate is part of the Sacrament of Holy Orders, it is not so binding as the priesthood is. In a way, it’s more compromising. Another thing the deacon said about the diaconate was that it is a bridge between the priesthood and the laity. This seemed perfect for me! Because the Mass and the Church are literally always on my mind!

But besides discerning whether I have a valid vocation, what can I do? What are the preliminaries for becoming a deacon? Do deacons have to go to seminary? If so for how long? I’m rather curious about the process for becoming a deacon because right now I’m a junior in high school, and my grades aren’t that great at all. So really, I can’t begin to think about anything before I bring my grades up. But, because of this new and recent desire to become a deacon, should I be looking for a seminary or a regular college? Can I go to both at the same time?

Please, your insight and knowledge would be greatly appreciated! Thanks!

 

[ChristIsTheWay]

Honestly, right now, I feel that the Lord is calling me to the diaconate.

**That is excellent news! **

I’ve been thinking about it for a long time, and it only became certain in my mind after a permanent deacon taught last week’s RCIA lesson and told us a little about what life being a deacon is like.

Sometimes God tells us His plan for our life in unexpected ways.

One thing he said continues to stick out in my mind. He said he thought that he could serve God greater not being behind a Roman collar.

I’m not sure what he means by that, but if God has called you to be deacon, then He has decided that for you.

I totally understand what he’s saying. I’ve been agonizing recently because I have been thinking that I have a call to the priesthood. I’ve heard it said that when you’re so in love with the Mass and with the Church that you can never stop thinking about them that this is one of the signs you are called to the holy priesthood. But my friends are very important to me. And I could never imagine giving them up being dedicated totally to God.

Priests aren’t required to give up their friends. Well, not diocesan priests, anyways. Nor would a religious priest, depending on the order and where they send him to serve. Having friends, like other priests, old friends, new friends, friends at your parish, etc, are all part of a priest’s life.

Even though the diaconate is part of the Sacrament of Holy Orders, it is not so binding as the priesthood is.

I wouldn’t be so sure about that. Since you’ve been discerning for the priesthood as well, I’m guessing you’re single. That means you may end up in a more full-time service to the Church than the typical married deacon. It is, I’m guessing, a permanent vocation just like the priesthood is. Could someone verify that?

In a way, it’s more compromising. Another thing the deacon said about the diaconate was that it is a bridge between the priesthood and the laity. This seemed perfect for me! Because the Mass and the Church are literally always on my mind!

I don’t know any deacons, so I can’t really comment on that.

But besides discerning whether I have a valid vocation, what can I do? What are the preliminaries for becoming a deacon?

Contact your diocese’s vocation office. I think this varies from diocese to diocese.

Do deacons have to go to seminary? If so for how long?

That will probably vary from diocese to diocese. I know of one seminary that offers a diaconate formation program. But in my diocese we send our prospective deacons first through our 3 year ELM program, followed by another year of training after that. I think that last year is more of an internship than anything else, but I am not certain. Again, you should contact your diocese for more information.

I’m rather curious about the process for becoming a deacon because right now I’m a junior in high school, and my grades aren’t that great at all.

You’ll need to contact your diocese, however, the general age requirement is 35 years old to be ordained a deacon. But that varies from diocese to diocese. In terms of your grades, for the priesthood you usually are required to have a GPA of 2.0 to 2.5 to be admitted to seminary. I’d imagine it is the same for the diaconate.

So really, I can’t begin to think about anything before I bring my grades up. But, because of this new and recent desire to become a deacon, should I be looking for a seminary or a regular college? Can I go to both at the same time?

At your age, I strongly recommend you contact your VD and discuss it with him. But like my bishop says, giving seminary a try for a year or two is no loss to yourself. You can discern your vocation better, and if you decide not to enter holy orders, you’ll still end up with better direction and spiritual maturity in your life.

 

[puzzleannie]

. I’ve heard it said that when you’re so in love with the Mass and with the Church that you can never stop thinking about them that this is one of the signs you are called to the holy priesthood. But my friends are very important to me. And I could never imagine giving them up being dedicated totally to God. Even though the diaconate is part of the Sacrament of Holy Orders, it is not so binding as the priesthood is. In a way, it’s more compromising. s!

Everyone is called to leave their friends and family and follow Christ. No one in any state in life may hold their friends and family higher than God. Every one in every state in life is called to be dedicated totally to God. One’s vocation determines how that dedication is lived out in daily life.

So making a vocation decision based on making reservations in one’s self-giving is not valid. A married person gives himself to God through his self-giving to his spouse and his care for his family. A single person gives himself to God through those he serves in his career, family relationships and friendships. A priest gives himself to God in his identification with Christ. The manner of self-giving is different but the reality is not.

The diaconate IS as binding as the priesthood. It is conferred through the sacrament of Holy Orders. It is a commitment for life. If an unmarried deacon is ordained he may not marry. If a married man is ordained a deacon he may not remarry if his wife dies. The deacon is under obedience to the bishop just as a priest is.

You need some more information than one talk on the role and life of a deacon. You also need some more information on the priestly vocation. The place to begin is through your diocesan vocations office, who has discernment tests and programs for people just like you. You will not be allowed to enter a seminary or formation program in any case until at least a couple of years after entering the Church through RCIA. That is the Church in its wisdom testing and confirming your conversion.

You will probably not be allowed to enter the formation program for the permanent diaconate program until you have completed your college education, and have met an age requirement. You have plenty of time to get the facts and go through the normal vocations discernment process.

Know that there are armies of Catholics praying for you as you undergo this discernment.

 

[chicago]

But besides discerning whether I have a valid vocation, what can I do? What are the preliminaries for becoming a deacon? Do deacons have to go to seminary? If so for how long? I’m rather curious about the process for becoming a deacon because right now I’m a junior in high school, and my grades aren’t that great at all. So really, I can’t begin to think about anything before I bring my grades up. But, because of this new and recent desire to become a deacon, should I be looking for a seminary or a regular college? Can I go to both at the same time?

Some college seminaries essentially are doing “both at the same time”. In fact, at certain college seminaries (St. Joseph’s in Chicago is one) your courses and degree come from the larger university (in this case Loyola).

We need to make a couple distinctions here, however. Every priest is first ordained a transitional deacon. So they have to do through the numerous years of training, education, and formation just like any other priest would. It is unusual (though not necessarily inappropriate) for a man to study just to go to the level of deacon and then stop. Most of the “permanent deacons” enter at a somewhat older age (each diocese has it’s own requirements and minimum age) and the manner of training is typically done a little differently; taking into account that these are adult family men who have work and lives.

But if you go to a university and hope to some day enter a deaconal formation program, it would be helpful to talk to people from the diocese about what courses might be worth taking to give you a little bit of a foot up. Basically, certain things in philosophy and maybe some theology or biblical studies/languages.

Please, your insight and knowledge would be greatly appreciated! Thanks!

You’re Welcome!

 

[decn2b]

a college degree is not required in most dioceses for the permanent diaconate. there is almost always an minimum age requirement it varies but 35 is common. new converts usually have to wait some time prior to entrance. if you are not married and become a deacon then you will live a life of celebacy each diocese has its own program and it varies but the age requirement is pretty common. if god wants you and you follow him then it is what is for you.

 

[mdstanzel]

I want to start my own tread dealing with my calling. I have no doubt that God is calling me to the clergy. I spent my first year in the seminary and have found my self in a very bazar situation with my wife in RCIA, son in RCIC, and 2 littles ones to be baptized next month. Our new has already started the paper work to get our marriage con-validated.

The movement of the Bishops to clean up the mess has helped begin the healing process from a life long painful story that caused me to flea from God’s calling even though I’ve been drawn there over and over. I’ve never been happy settling for my, though interesting and challenging engineering/planning/GIS, career. It’s empty and meaninless to me even though it pays well. But my wife agrees and we are working toward a deeper envolvement in the Church [Catholic] - maybe teaching or whereever the Lord will lead us.

I want to follow through this time. But this I’ll have to settle for the diaconate - even though its difficult to convey this idea to someone that doesn’t understand the calling.

Any advice?

 

[darryld]

I am in my third year of Diaconate formation. I thought it might be helpful to talk a little about my experience.

First, the requirements - these do vary slightly from place to place:
-male

• at least 35 years old, must be younger than 65 at ordination
• may be either single or married - if married, wife must give her consent

I attended an open vocational meeting in my Archdiosese (Louisville, KY) and picked up an application to the Diaconate. After submitting the application, I went through a series of interviews. The first was with a deacon on the vocation committee. He asked me about my prayer life, my spiritual journey, etc. My wife and I met individually with a psychologist for an evaluation. I was required to submit a complete transcript of my grades. (I attended college briefly but did not complete - that did not hinder me). The Archdiosese performed a thorough background check with the police. My wife and I met with two deacon couples for a group and then separate talk. (They want to insure that the spouse completely understands what she is getting into as well) Finally, we had an informal interview with the Archbishop. The complete selection process took approx. 6 months.

Our formation is a four year program. The first year is a year of discernment. We met one Saturday a month and received overviews of many different subjects, but little in-depth information. There is a service requirement - 25 hours, that must be completed during the first year. They require that we meet with a “mentor couple” monthly. They require that we choose a spiritual director. They require that we pray the “Liturgy of the Hours” daily.

Our second and third years are classroom years. We must complete eight different college level courses over these two years, classes in liturgy, catechesis, canon law, homilitics, social justice, etc. My wife must attend the classes with me, but she can choose not to write the papers. Our fourth year mostly consists of a hospital ministry. My ordination will be in August 2008 if everything is completed.

I have found the experience to be very challenging at times. I have also found it very rewarding. I hope this has helped you. Good luck and God bless.

 

[mdstanzel]

diakonos - Hear I am Lord, send me

Late night posts are not good for me. So this is an edited version of my message:

I spent my first year in the seminary and have found my self in a very bazaar situation with my wife in RCIA, son in RCIC, and 2 little ones to be baptized next month. Our new has already started the paper work to get our marriage con-validated.

The Bishops movement to clean up the sex scandal mess has helped begin the healing process after a long painful experience that has caused much grief in my life. I fled from God’s calling after my spiritual director attempted improper thing on me while in my sleep on a weekend sailing event. Although he did not get anywhere (I think) it slowly fragmented me over a period of time. I flunked my finals a couple (few?) of weeks later. But instead of providing me much needed counseling, I got the cold shoulder. I didn’t do anything inappropriate [their words] and instead they accepted my resignation too quickly. What were they thinking?

Years later, the priest is on “the list” of bad boys and I wish that were enough. However, the diocese offered to pay for the therapy or counseling last month. However, I waited this long, so I plan to wait until my family crosses over to Catholicism. The situation is already painfully humiliating enough without hurting my family’s faith. I’m overwhelmed with the joy of my wife’s conversion, but I don’t want to push her. Before, it was not possible with her father being an elder and her two oldest brothers being preachers, and the rest of the family deacons and active in the “restoration” movement. When they find out it will not be easy and may include anti-Catholic tongue lashings. They are good people and extended lots of courtesy, though critical of any religion or non-religion that does not conform to their own belief. I belief you could say almost brainwashed with false ideas about other beliefs. She was educated and primed to convert. She was and is still not materialist, unlike many catholic women that I knew growing up. She was the best catholic woman I ever met, all I had to do was get her to convert. But it had to be gentle. There is so much that I’m not saying that would clear this up. My I’d have to write a short book.

I’ve been constantly drawn to the priesthood since high school. My error was mainly being human without a good support system. My wife’s faith has helped me understand the other side and its errors. But it’s time to get pulled back into the fold, walking a straight path. I’ve never been happy settling for my enjoyable career in engineering/planning/GIS because I knew all along that was leading me to a priestly life. I would have taken vows of poverty along with obedience and chastity. In some ways our life reflects a vow of poverty since I serve the public and my wife stays home with a home daycare. I believe that if she were raised Catholic, she would be a nun now. She’s truly a beautiful. I feel a little guilty with the blessings God’s given me.

I want to follow through with God’s calling this time. But this I’ll have to settle for the diaconate a noble and respectable office. I feel I have way too much wasted talent that could be used in serving God. The diaconate is an ordained office that sounds very appealing (1 Timothy 3:8-13 and Philippians 1:1). My wife seems open to the idea and after a while I will begin the process with her support.

 

[Formosus]

-For the original poster (my life experiance is not great enough to provide any insight on the previous poster’s psot ).

Why do you feel called to the Diaconate at such a young age rather then the priesthood? What are your motivations? Is it because you are unwilling to make all the sacrifices neccessary God may be calling you to make and take a route which you view is a sort of compromise? The deacon is not this compromise role your thinking it is. Perhaps instead of looking for an easier way out you should instead focus on what God wants of you. You are only in high school so you have plenty of time to discern that. Also, why be the bridge between the laity and the priest, when you could be the bride between the laity and Christ instead (assuming it is God’s will of course) . I will suggest the same thign many others have, speak with your diocesen vocations director.
-p.s. hope I didn’t come off sounding harsh or anything , didn’t mean to.

 

[InTheWilderness]

As a junior in high school, it is wonderful that you are giving these things serious thought. I wish I had.

Don’t let your friends hold you back. When I was a junior, the idea of losing my friends to serve the Church would have been unthinkable. However, you will likely begin losing some of them just with the moves to college. Your best friends you will probably have for life, no matter what path you take. Also, there will be new friends after high school.

I was a junior not long ago. Many things are changing in your life now and in the next years. It may take some time to sort all of this out.

If you think God is calling you to ministry in the Church, then it is possible that you should be a priest or a deacon. However, what specifically makes you think being a deacon is for you?

Ultimately, those called to be a permanent deacon are called to take up another vocation on the way. Many are called to the vocation of marriage. Some may be celibate lay people.

If you think your primary vocation is to serve the Church, then perhaps you need to look into the religious life and priesthood.

It sounds to me like you are in that early stage of discernment where you have an idea of the general direction, but do not yet know the final destination. I think the advice I received from a priest could apply in this case. Remember that God isn’t going anywhere, He will be waiting for you when you are ready. Vocations are eternal callings from God. If you are called today, you will still be called tomorrow.

I would offer to remember you in my prayers, but I am quite forgetful about that. I will offer to pray for all of those discerning a call to vocations. That I will not forget, since I myself am beginning the first part of that journey, and still do not know where it may lead.

 

[mdstanzel]

-For the original poster (my life experiance is not great enough to provide any insight on the previous poster’s psot ).

Why do you feel called to the Diaconate at such a young age rather then the priesthood? What are your motivations? Is it because you are unwilling to make all the sacrifices neccessary God may be calling you to make and take a route which you view is a sort of compromise? The deacon is not this compromise role your thinking it is. Perhaps instead of looking for an easier way out you should instead focus on what God wants of you. You are only in high school so you have plenty of time to discern that. Also, why be the bridge between the laity and the priest, when you could be the bride between the laity and Christ instead (assuming it is God’s will of course) . I will suggest the same thign many others have, speak with your diocesen vocations director.
-p.s. hope I didn’t come off sounding harsh or anything , didn’t mean to.

Formosus: Maybe you misunderstand my position as well as my age. I apologies if I didn’t make that clear. I went to the seminary back in 1979-80 at the age of 18 [do the math if you like]. I was very naive back then. Had I received better guidance from the diocese, I’d probably be a priest right now and not on this thread. But that’s not the point anymore. If Rome would let me follow through with the priesthood, I’d do it. And if there were ever a wife who could handle being the first to restore married priests, she’d be the ideal candidate. She avoids materialism, attention and is very submissive in a way that is very inspiring. She’s a real jewel and that’s why I grabbed hold of her. We’re considering becoming part of the Lay Franciscan Order at our parish [her idea-don’t know the details]. But since that’s not probable because I’m married with three beautiful children I might as well focus on what God will let me do. I could still take vow celibacy. Byzantine Catholic in another country seems to be my only choice at this stage, but it is not likely going to happen.

My current status provides only one route - the diaconate. I’m a humble servant for the Lord and I’d serve cleaning the bathrooms as a deacon if it is God’s will. Too many people reduce the value of the vocation to the diaconate - almost as bad as they reduce the value of the vocation to married life. Everyone has a mother and a father ( Google the “Domestic Church”. Deacons serve a very important role in the Church. It’s very wrong to shun or treat Deacons like substandard priests. Each office serves a purpose and people do not realize the tremendous sacrifices that deacons go through with being split between the full-time jobs, family and church. If you make their full-time job at the parish, that issue is reduced down to much the level as a lay protestant pastor. It’s not only plausible, it actually exists. But I do not desire to question the wisdom of the Church. The real issue here is “Not my will be done, but Your Will be done”. We should never seek to change anything on our own.

The diaconate was instituted at the time of the early church and reinstituted with second Vatican Counsel. My goodness they come complete with holy orders too. One must undergo Deacon Formation to be “ORDAINED” a deacon. Deacons are important or the Church is answering God’s calling to allow married men to the priesthood very slowly. I don’t know. I think it very good to maintain celibacy for the priesthood. But I’m open minded that I wouldn’t treat a married priest less than an unmarried priest. However, I’d open my door quicker for a celibate priest in that there is an extra blessing that follows God’s celibates. [This is just my incomplete thought.]

In the event of my wife’s death, I would pursue the priesthood with the Vatican’s permission. However, my 3 little children still need me and so I’d me in my 60’s by the time my youngest reached the age of 18. Parenthood continues and I could do that as a priest.

One of my big issues now is to guide the son I belief would make a wonderful priest. I see priest written all over my oldest boy (12). He is unusually inspired for his age. He shows a passion about the church that makes us (me and the wife) feel very proud. If I submit to the lower diaconate, I still receive the sacrament of holy orders with the intension of continuing upward if it is God’s will and my children see an example to follow. We have two potential priest and one potential nun. You never know but you have to keep that door open for everyone’s sake.

 

[mdstanzel]

:whacky: Sorry guys. I got confused with one of my posts on a differnt thread.

You should re-think this. Priest’s get to do all the kewl stuff. They say the mass. And that’s what I should have done and that may be what you should do. If you don’t you’ll end up like me, saddened to the point of wishing you could undo even wonderful things - like a dream wife and three beautiful children. It’s sort of like marrying the sister of the woman you truly love [this analogy needs a lot of work].

Well, God trumps spouse anyday. But we all have responsibilities even after we aknowledge and correct our mistakes. My mistake was not fullfilling His first wish for me -to become a priest. However, he still blessed me with a wonderful family. But the “voice” still calls me, so I try to live out my priestly life as a father of the domestic church. But my abilities are much more expansive. We must all seek to fullfill the vocations that we are called to and currently in and not what we should have done. But that doesn’t mean that the yearning won’t stop. It sort of a burden that stays with you and you must suffer it in silence.

If you have the calling, what will you do when the calling doesn’t stop. In my case I will seek the diaconate, since that’s my only choice. When you do not submit to God’s calling you will still yearn for it. You will probably not be happy with the diaconate if you’re being called to the priesthood. If you are called to the diaconate you will live similar to a priest anyway and that just doesn’t make sense. Let me give you a practical example. I design complex civil engineering projects with my 189 semester hours in Math, Science, Engineering, etc. I graduated with Honors. But I can’t get an engineering license until I take a hand full of courses and 4 additinal years of experience. You be like me - miserable, making less and knowing more that the actual licensed and sometimes in-trianing engineers.

If grades are a hinderance, I empathise. I was a poor student early on in life, but after a few years of learning how to study and four years of active duty military, I eventually became a “star” student with all kinds of awards and fancy chords. But you’ll probably be allowed to take remedial course at the seminary as I did. Now I’m juggling all kinds of stuff. You can do it. Trust me on this. I had at least two college professors complain that I wasn’t college material. That turns out to be a real joke now. Anyhow, you could look into the monastic religious life too.

Age will solve the friends issue. As you mature, you’ll see that they have to move on too. There’s an old saying, “you can’t go back home”.

 

[mdstanzel]

And another thought about the Roman Collar. Don’t fool yourself. The laity should be treating Deacons with at least the same respect as they currently treat the Priest. With that in mind, that should tell you how little respect we really give our priests, who should recieve much more respect than they currently recieve.

Accoding to Cannon Law and various information boards, Deacons are supposed to wear the Roman Collar too. But there are approved reasons like job requirements that may “get them off the hook” or “out of the collar”. I personally don’t believe that Bishops should instruct Deacons not to wear collars. They should encourage it minimally and up something on the priest, not take away from the diaconate. After all they do receive the sacraments of Holy Orders. And the laity need to transform to the teachings of the Church on this point.

 

[Brendan]

Accoding to Cannon Law and various information boards, Deacons are supposed to wear the Roman Collar too. But there are approved reasons like job requirements that may “get them off the hook” or “out of the collar”.

I’m in my 3rd year towards the Diaconate ( but currently on sabbatical, as we just had the birth of our 5th child)

The Deacon is more that a bridge between the laity and the priesthood, as the Deacon IS A CLERIC. There should be no doubt in anyone’s mind of the clerical nature of the Diaconate.

The Deacon is a cleric who lives and works among the laity and is a sign of the clerical aspect of our Church to the laity.

That said, here is my experience in the Archdiocese of Detroit.

3 years ago, my wife and I attended an informational meeting at a parish. There we recieved information on the application process and what is expected educationally.

Our process was very similar to Darryld’s, with the possible exception that ours was about a year long application process.

During that process, we were expected to attended classes at the local seminary (at our own expense) and to complete any pre-requisite courses, again at our own expense (my Engineering degree was a little short in Philosophy and Rhetoric )

After the pre-reqs are complete, and if one is accepted, a canidate can choose either the Master’s route or a diploma route ( BA level work w/o the degree). Even though I already have a Bachelors and could have gone towards the MA, I elected to go the diploma route due to the easier course work ( I’ve got 5 kids at home. the oldest is 8)

Here is the program

aodonline.org/SHMS/Academic+Programs+13375/Permanent+Diaconate+6001/Permanent+Diaconate+Program.htm

In addition, there is also a Formation Day once each month (2nd Saturday) where we go over topics specifically related to the Diaconate) and Summer Ministry assignments, such as doing projects at a soup kitchen, or hospital
ursing home ministry, or prison vistitation. Those will vary each summer during formation. The last summer is spend doing parish work with an active deacon.

I hope that helps.

I hope that helps.

 

[mdstanzel]

Brendan,
So far you’ve corroborated everything I’ve discovered so far. I am very aware that deacons are clerics. But some members of the laity do not seem to realize this. Vatican Counsel II is taking root slowly. I say this because I found another thread that illustrates the issues associated with the shortages of priests and deacons wearing the collar. Apparently, there are some bishops that do not let their deacons wear the collar.

I appreciate your issue with being an engineer and now having to learn “philosophy and rhetoric”. I started in the seminary and 2 universities later ended up taking about 185 semester hours including: philosophy, religion, math (minor), engineer, computer science, physics, chemistry, biology, geology, geography (B.S.), history, etc. I decided as an early engineering student that engineering was too limited in the scope of the degree requirements. So I’m probably more of a professional student than an E.I.T. (the long route).

My wife is amazed at you and your wife having 5 children under the age of 8. I have no idea why, because she’s the baby of 8 children in her family. I’m only 1 of 3 and I really wanted a large family of my own. But I guess I can’t have it all. God’s will be done.

Good luck. Have a Blessed Advent and a Merry Christmas.