Divine Effort

[hansard]

I wonder if God has to expend any actual effort in doing things.

Take, for example, the Big Bang. Lately, I’ve been contemplating that the Big Bang was God’s extreme effort in creating a universe out of nothing. It was the crossover between spirit and matter. It must have taken some work and planning, even by the supreme being.

I’ve been reading, in my own stupid layman’s manner, some research into the Big Bang. It’s now widely accepted as the truth, and they’re getting better and better at shaving tiny fractions of a second from the first instant of creation–working out what the temperature was at 0.00000000000000001 seconds (or something), calculating when the elements were created, and postulating when the first tiny quarks and anti-photons (or something) got their legs, after the Bang. One thing they can never explain is why there had to be a Big Bang, or what existed at that moment they call “zero point”.
Scientists spend a career on this. Good luck to them. I couldn’t do it (not smart enough).

Back to the main point: I wonder if a spiritual being can create matter on a whim, or if it requires a concentration of energy. If so, how much intensity of concentration is necessary to create a universe? Does a spirit even contain the requisite energy to create matter?
Sometimes, in a moment of reflection, I wonder if God was surprised in those first moments. I wonder if he looked and thought, “Wow. I just created matter by thinking about it.” (It’s a nice thought.)

At the end of it all, I wonder if God just “had an idea” or if he worked on it for eons before making it explode in a big…bang.

 

[Spirithound]

I wonder if God has to expend any actual effort in doing things.

Consonant with Catholic teaching on God’s attributes, I would posit that He possesses an infinite store of energy, and thus, can expend any amount of energy at any time He wants, without depleting His reserves.

My human understanding of “effort” involves some sort of discomfort and possibility of failure, neither of which I can attribute to God.

Therefore, I hypothesize that God put an infinite amount of energy into Creation, with no effort.

 

[Tietjen]

I wonder if God has to expend any actual effort in doing things.

Take, for example, the Big Bang. Lately, I’ve been contemplating that the Big Bang was God’s extreme effort in creating a universe out of nothing. It was the crossover between spirit and matter. It must have taken some work and planning, even by the supreme being.

I’ve been reading, in my own stupid layman’s manner, some research into the Big Bang. It’s now widely accepted as the truth, and they’re getting better and better at shaving tiny fractions of a second from the first instant of creation–working out what the temperature was at 0.00000000000000001 seconds (or something), calculating when the elements were created, and postulating when the first tiny quarks and anti-photons (or something) got their legs, after the Bang. One thing they can never explain is why there had to be a Big Bang, or what existed at that moment they call “zero point”.
Scientists spend a career on this. Good luck to them. I couldn’t do it (not smart enough).

Back to the main point: I wonder if a spiritual being can create matter on a whim, or if it requires a concentration of energy. If so, how much intensity of concentration is necessary to create a universe? Does a spirit even contain the requisite energy to create matter?
Sometimes, in a moment of reflection, I wonder if God was surprised in those first moments. I wonder if he looked and thought, “Wow. I just created matter by thinking about it.” (It’s a nice thought.)

At the end of it all, I wonder if God just “had an idea” or if he worked on it for eons before making it explode in a big…bang.

I don’t believe that such things are possible to conceive with our limited intellect. For example, I noticed that throughout your post you maintained God as existing inside of time:

It must have taken some work and planning, even by the supreme being.

This denotes preparation prior to the event. Since God is outside of time, why would He need preparation (time to prepare)?

… I wonder if God was surprised in those first moments.

My guess would be no, since He was & is present and unchanging during any/all events encapsulated within the realm of time.

… I wonder if God just “had an idea” or if he worked on it for eons before making it explode in a big…bang.

God is spirit and spirit simply is. “Worked” belongs to the world of the physical (past tense of “work” which denotes a trade off of some action in order to achieve a desired effect). God doesn’t have to take part in a trade off. He simply wills what He wants.

Just my thoughts though and now I have a headache.

 

[hansard]

Probably true about the infinite energy, Spirithound, but I still wonder about the “with no effort” part. “Effort” is roughly synonymous with “work”, and it’s hard to imagine God actually working on anything (as you said).

Nonetheless, I find it entrancing to think that God might have had to do some work in converting spiritual energy into physical energy and matter.

Thanks for the reply.

 

[hansard]

Tietjen, thanks for the reply.
Do we know that God exists outside of time?
I mean, he certainly seems to exist outside *our perception *of time, but is our perception the only one in town?
Scientists are engaged in the job of counting back the 0.00000000th of a second before this or that. This is strict, linear time. This is morning-afternoon-night stuff.
I’m no physicist (oh, dear–my friends must be ROFL), but didn’t Einstein speculate that the perception of time depends entirely on the viewer? That all time is relative? Sure he did.
Maybe God has a more holistic view of time.

 

[jonathanjlinn]

What is time based on? The moving of celestial bodies…all a part of creation. “time” started when these celestial bodies were placed into motion i.e. by God.

Does God perceive time? He must, assuming he is Omniscient.

But, God is the unmoved mover- He always was the same, he is unchanging, he created all from nothing as opposed to organized from chaos.

If he created all from nothing, the only source for materials would be himself.

Since God is infinite and unchanging, if any energy was required then it was already contained within himself

If God had to “store up his energy” like some sort of video game attack (this is what comes to mind when thinking of charging or pre-work, then would that violate the premise that God is unchanging.

It would be saying that God got an idea, then proceeded to organize it all, a very human perception of how God works. If God is infinite, Omniscient, Omnipotent, then he must be able to just “will it” with no need of any pre-requisite. This is the nature of God

As for spiritual beings in general. I think by definition since anything other than God is a creation, they all rely on the power given to them by God. Any created spiritual being would not be able to will creation on will alone. They would require the use of other creations in existent (energy). So God alone can create something out of nothing without any need for time. I think it’s impossible for all humans - I know at least myself - to realize the power of God. Infinite power and love remains inconceivable.

 

[JDaniel]

I wonder if God has to expend any actual effort in doing things.

Take, for example, the Big Bang. Lately, I’ve been contemplating that the Big Bang was God’s extreme effort in creating a universe out of nothing. It was the crossover between spirit and matter. It must have taken some work and planning, even by the supreme being.

I’ve been reading, in my own stupid layman’s manner, some research into the Big Bang. It’s now widely accepted as the truth, and they’re getting better and better at shaving tiny fractions of a second from the first instant of creation–working out what the temperature was at 0.00000000000000001 seconds (or something), calculating when the elements were created, and postulating when the first tiny quarks and anti-photons (or something) got their legs, after the Bang. One thing they can never explain is why there had to be a Big Bang, or what existed at that moment they call “zero point”.
Scientists spend a career on this. Good luck to them. I couldn’t do it (not smart enough).

Back to the main point: I wonder if a spiritual being can create matter on a whim, or if it requires a concentration of energy. If so, how much intensity of concentration is necessary to create a universe? Does a spirit even contain the requisite energy to create matter?
Sometimes, in a moment of reflection, I wonder if God was surprised in those first moments. I wonder if he looked and thought, “Wow. I just created matter by thinking about it.” (It’s a nice thought.)

At the end of it all, I wonder if God just “had an idea” or if he worked on it for eons before making it explode in a big…bang.

Hansard:

Let’s look at what the Church teaches with regard to Creation: “The verb “to create” does not necessarily mean to make something from nothing; this is true, also, of the equivalents of the English word in Latin, Greek, and Hebrew. But the word in all these languages does contain the idea of a productive action that, in one way or another, is more than ordinarily powerful. Thus we speak rightly of the creations of a genius in music and sculpture, or we talk of the Sovereign creating new peers of the realm. Consequently the word is properly applied in a special and distinctive way to that action, requiring the exercise of infinite power, by which God - to use the ordinary but not wholly satisfactory phrase - makes something out of nothing, or - to speak more precisely - to make something where there was absolutely nothing. This is the strict theological meaning of the word . . .” - The Teaching of the Catholic Church, Chap. VI, God the Creator, p. 181, The Macmillan Company, 1962.

Further, it must not be forgotten that the production of the Son and the Holy Spirit were also feats of infinite power, and, too, the Angels…

God bless,
jd