Divorce is not an option...unless

[Corinne3]

To me, adultery is total emotional abuse, and this is reason for an annullment. Every Priest I have ever spoken to has told me this. However, courts don’t seem to think so today. Sadly. If you’re not being beaten, they don’t care about infidelity. What a world.

I think raising kids knowing Jesus Christ is the most important thing, whether it be Catholic or otherwise. That is what I meant by the OP being ridiculous to think not raising kids Catholic would be reason for divorce.

My husband just since his infidelity has become highly verbally abusive at times. Like saying “shut the hell up and get out of my face”…or calling me a ***** at times. This is so crushing…I think it just is evidence that he is living in deep deep sin. It has taken away all his kindness. He sadly has taught my teen son to be verbally abusive to me now too where he says “shut the f up” at times to me, his mom!!! where I almost am immune to it. My husband says nothing ever to my son about this,allowing this total and complete disrespect of me!!!c I hope my husband moves out soon, I do not want to be treated like this any longer. My heart is crushed.

 

[sanctamaria17]

Thank you all for your (name removed by moderator)ut.

But, what about St. Rita of Cascia?

She was physically and emotionally abused, and cheated on.

In the end her patient and forgiving attitude converted her husband.

St. Rita lived in a time when divorce was not an option for women. She really had no other option than to make the best of it.

And what if the abuse became so severe he killed you before your patient and forgiving attitude converted him? No, it’s not OK to enable his behavior. It’s a right and just thing not to take abuse. Is it not a spiritual work of mercy to admonish the sinner? Is it not the right thing for your children to be safe?

Also, if your kids told a teacher or some other adult they trusted (priest, youth minister, friends’ parents, extended family) and the law finds that they are in a dangerous situation and that you did little to protect them, you both could probably lose custody and be charged with endangerment.

It’s one thing to take on martyrdom for yourself. It’s inexcusable to force your children to do the same.

 

[gretahope]

Thank you all for your (name removed by moderator)ut.

But, what about St. Rita of Cascia?

She was physically and emotionally abused, and cheated on.

In the end her patient and forgiving attitude converted her husband.

Adrienne, are you bringing these issues up here b/c you’re in this type of situation yourself, or just hypothetically speaking? I’m a little concerned…

I think it’s disturbing that a woman would say she’d put up with being beaten, cheated on by her H…and yet wouldn’t put up with her H not allowing her to raise her kids Catholic. Kids watching their mom being beaten is OK, but they must go to Catholic church or I’m leaving"…

 

[Corinne3]

Adrienne, are you bringing these issues up here b/c you’re in this type of situation yourself, or just hypothetically speaking? I’m a little concerned…

I think it’s disturbing that a woman would say she’d put up with being beaten, cheated on by her H…and yet wouldn’t put up with her H not allowing her to raise her kids Catholic. Kids watching their mom being beaten is OK, but they must go to Catholic church or I’m leaving"…

I agree with you gretahope! exactly.

I watched the wonderful movie about St. Rita of Cascia and I do not recall her being abused by her husband at all. He loved her. It was HIS family I believe that did not like her, and took their kids away. Maybe I am wrong, or forgetful, but this is what I gathered.

She was unaccepted, tormented by her in laws family.

 

[jmcrae]

Hi. Id like to share my view on divorce and hear others opinions. I do not mean to offend anyone.

I don{t think divorce is an option. ever. Unless, he beats my children or wont let me raise them as Catholics, or anything harmful to the children. Or if he doesnt want kids.

He could cheat on me, beat me, verbally and emotionally abuse me. I wouldnt divorce. Good times and the bad right? He might repent…

What are your views???

I think that if it’s physically dangerous for you in your own home, you need to leave. A legal separation would certainly be appropriate, in a case like that. Even a divorce would be appropriate in a case like that, because it wouldn’t actually end the marriage, as such, but it would allow for you to get a job and be able to keep the money you earn for your own needs, rather than splitting it with him.

 

[cecilia97]

I second this. I had a friend who put up with her husband’s physical and emotional abuse for years. You think that didn’t screw up their children?

She finally did leave him when he started hitting them, too. But she would have spared them even that one punch–and a lifetime of anger issues and emotional problems–if she had left the first time he hit HER.

I’ve never understood why women feel they’re being selfless martyrs when they stay in an abusive situation “for the children’s sake.” The best thing you can do for your children is to drop an abusive spouse ASAP. Children learn by example.

Miz

Amen. I’d try counseling (pastoral or secular) and then drop the abuser if that didn’t work. It IS abusive to children to keep them in a situation where they see abuse. The kids ARE traumatized. Plus, we learn how to be married by watching our parents’ marriage. Keeping a son in an abusive household could just be creating another, future abusive spouse. Keeping a daughter in such a household could be creating a future abused wife.

 

[cecilia97]

Adrienne, A seperation is an option if you don’t want to get a divorce.

Your husband needs ANGER MANAGEMENT COUNSELING. He is taking his angy out on you.

You must feel the need to be punished so you also need counseling. I once met a woman whose husband would beat her up and she would just cry and say she deserved it eventhough she didn’t do nothing wrong.

In the State of Calif. if you were my neighbor I would call the cops if I saw your husband beating you up and your kids screaming for help. The cops will come and take him away to jail and you can cry all you want and say it was your fault but they will still take him away to jail to show him that it is against Calif. law to beat up a spouse…male/or female. That law became effective in 1999.

You need to get separated before he kills you by accident. Then your kids will be abused by your husband because you will not be around to be his punching bag.

Abusers don’t stop their bad tempers… unless they get professional help. You also need help because I suspect that you are also abusing your kids verbally and being mean to them.

I was born into an abusive home and my dad would beat up on my Mom and my Mom would take out her anger on us kids. We all left home as teenagers to get away from both of them.
My dad is dead now and I never cry for him. My old Mom still thinks she can verbally abuse us.
I feel sorry for her because she will die being a mean person.

A separation isn’t always an option. Some states do not have a “legal separation” which protects property and finances. Separation sometimes amounts to civil divorce…the Church just reminds us that civil divorce does not end a sacramental marriage.

I’ve lived this. Sometimes civil divorce is the option you’re left with. The CCC makes room for this option in paragraph 1649.

 

[cecilia97]

The Catechism says:

If you’re a Christian, once you’re married you’re married for good no matter what (except death). As Jesus said, if a man divorces his wife and marries another, he commits adultery.

We’re not talking about remarriage here, though. We are talking about civil divorce ONLY. One can civilly divorce one’s spouse and still live chastely as though sacramentally married to that person.

 

[LaLucia]

I was thinking more in terms of just running off to go live with a relative and leave the husband home alone so he can see that she may really want to leave him for good.

When I was a kid my mom said to us kids that we were going to move out of the house and leave my dad because she was tired of his abuse.

My 5yr.old brother asked mom if daddy could also come with us. My Mom looked at him and changed her mind about moving. But she did call the cops on him and the cops had a serious talk with our dad. We had peace for many years after that. But then our Dad would abuse our mom when they would go out alone to parties. I was a teenager at that time and I would tell Mom not to go with him but she always did and would come home crying that dad abused her.
I would just get angry at her because I couldn’t protect her from our dad if he would try to hit her at home. I would have called the cops on him if I had seen him hitting her.
My dad had a lousy mean abusive personality. He would always call us kids stupid.
I lived in fear of him physically beating me up when I was a teenager so I got married to get away from both of them.

Looking back… I think that if my mom left my dad for good that she would have found another abusive husband. She always seemed attracted to abusive men as the years past as she got older eventhough she was married to my dad. She is mentally ill and needs therapy.
She is not really a Catholic. She was raised in another Christian religion.

I grew up mentally ill. People may say to me…“Snap out of it”! My answer is “I would if I could.”

I just want to say that mentally healthy people will never understand what it is like be mentally ill.

 

[JimG]

I was thinking more in terms of just running off to go live with a relative and leave the husband home alone so he can see that she may really want to leave him for good.

When I was a kid my mom said to us kids that we were going to move out of the house and leave my dad because she was tired of his abuse.

My 5yr.old brother asked mom if daddy could also come with us. My Mom looked at him and changed her mind about moving. But she did call the cops on him and the cops had a serious talk with our dad. We had peace for many years after that. But then our Dad would abuse our mom when they would go out alone to parties. I was a teenager at that time and I would tell Mom not to go with him but she always did and would come home crying that dad abused her.
I would just get angry at her because I couldn’t protect her from our dad if he would try to hit her at home. I would have called the cops on him if I had seen him hitting her.
My dad had a lousy mean abusive personality. He would always call us kids stupid.
I lived in fear of him physically beating me up when I was a teenager so I got married to get away from both of them.

**Looking back… I think that if my mom left my dad for good that she would have found another abusive husband. She always seemed attracted to abusive men **as the years past as she got older eventhough she was married to my dad. She is mentally ill and needs therapy.
She is not really a Catholic. She was raised in another Christian religion.

I grew up mentally ill. People may say to me…“Snap out of it”! My answer is “I would if I could.”

I just want to say that mentally healthy people will never understand what it is like be mentally ill.

The bolded part of your post shows what may often be an unrecognized root of the problem. The best way to avoid emotional and physical abuse and infidelity is not to marry men who would do such things.

 

[mjs1987]

I dont like thinking of marriage in terms of what constitutes grounds for divorce. Such a defeatist attitude toward marriage allows people to forgo doing due diligence in finding a spouse because if things go bad there is always divorce as an option. If people took more time to discover who they were marrying instead of being impulsive about marriage then we wouldnt have to worry as much about divorces because there wouldnt be as many.

 

[cecilia97]

The bolded part of your post shows what may often be an unrecognized root of the problem. The best way to avoid emotional and physical abuse and infidelity is not to marry men who would do such things.

…and not to grow up in a family where you see abuse every day, which can lead you to marry such a man. This is a cyclical and self-perpetuating problem.

 

[vsedriver]

I filed for divorce last week. My husband of 22 yrs walked out on me and our two teenage sons in May. I had no choice but to file. It’s the only way I can protect my kids and provide a home for them. He gave no reason beyond he didn’t love me anymore and didn’t want to be married anymore. We celebrated our anniversary with an evening out, he gave me a beautiful necklace and two weeks later left. I begged him to go to counseling with me. I told him if I was the problem I’d change and that I truly loved him.

He made up his mind and has refused all efforts from anyone in the family to try and work things out.

How can anyone just walk away without at least trying counseling?

 

[cecilia97]

I filed for divorce last week. My husband of 22 yrs walked out on me and our two teenage sons in May. I had no choice but to file. It’s the only way I can protect my kids and provide a home for them. He gave no reason beyond he didn’t love me anymore and didn’t want to be married anymore. We celebrated our anniversary with an evening out, he gave me a beautiful necklace and two weeks later left. I begged him to go to counseling with me. I told him if I was the problem I’d change and that I truly loved him.

He made up his mind and has refused all efforts from anyone in the family to try and work things out.

How can anyone just walk away without at least trying counseling?

I don’t know, vsedriver, but it happens. My ex “tried” counseling but was really just going through the motions, perhaps to make himself feel better about leaving, like he had “tried” everything.

I’m sorry for your loss and pain. This is not easy but you can get through it. Someone on CAF told me, 5 years ago, to pray pray pray, stay focused on God and my duties, and to keep my heart soft so I wouldn’t be eaten up by grudges and remorse. I’m 90% of the way there and content with that. I still pray.

And yes, sometimes you really do have to file to protect yourself, your health, your family, and your livelihood.

God bless you,

 

[EasterJoy]

…He made up his mind and has refused all efforts from anyone in the family to try and work things out.

How can anyone just walk away without at least trying counseling?

If he tries counselling, maybe you would work things out and he wouldn’t leave, and he doesn’t think he wants that. He thinks that not “being in love” is a permanent condition, so that if you did work things out it would be kind of like he was being trapped.

IOW, he’s afraid of success, because he doesn’t imagine it would truly be a success.

You might get him to go to counselling if it were in terms of family counselling: that is, figuring out how the family unit can continue to exist if the marriage doesn’t. That is something he might want to succeed at and would agree to. Perhaps in the course of that process, he will reconsider his decision that your marriage cannot be saved.

 

[EasterJoy]

Thank you all for your (name removed by moderator)ut.

But, what about St. Rita of Cascia?

She was physically and emotionally abused, and cheated on.

In the end her patient and forgiving attitude converted her husband.

Jesus said, “If it be your will, let this cup pass. Yet not my will, but yours be done” and taught us to pray “lead us not into temptation, but deliver us from evil.” That God can use suffering to his glory when it cannot be alleviated does not mean that it is not allowed to alleviate suffering, or to ask to have it taken away. Christianity does not require masochism.

St. Rita was forced into marriage, as well. Her story does not mean it is OK for parents to force daughters to marry violent men when the daughter wants to join a convent, instead, as St. Rita did. St. Rita’s parents couldn’t go before God and say, “See? You made a saint of her. We did the right thing!” Daughters who refuse such a marriage and enter to the convent are NOT runnning from grace! Neither is a woman who gets out of an abusive marriage running from grace, just because God gave graces to a woman who put herself in His hands when she could not get out.

 

[Ailina]

Hi. Id like to share my view on divorce and hear others opinions. I do not mean to offend anyone.

I don{t think divorce is an option. ever. Unless, he beats my children or wont let me raise them as Catholics, or anything harmful to the children. Or if he doesnt want kids.

He could cheat on me, beat me, verbally and emotionally abuse me. I wouldnt divorce. Good times and the bad right? He might repent…

What are your views???

Right, and if your husband cheats and beats and abuses you, that will in no way affect your children? Because they will just see the “love” between you two and carry that kind of “love” into their own marital relationships. Thus will the cycle continue, where boys will grow to think that is how they are supposed to treat their wives (cheat, beat and abuse); and daughters will grow up to think that this is love (beat, cheat and abuse). Because God expects wives to be door mats to be trampled and abused, and that is the way Christ treats his Church so it’s okay.

Btw, in no fault divorce states and provinces, your husband can go ahead and divorce you, and you will not be able to stop it.

 

[EasterJoy]

Right, and if your husband cheats and beats and abuses you, that will in no way affect your children? Because they will just see the “love” between you two and carry that kind of “love” into their own marital relationships. Thus will the cycle continue, where boys will grow to think that is how they are supposed to treat their wives (cheat, beat and abuse); and daughters will grow up to think that this is love (beat, cheat and abuse). Because God expects wives to be door mats to be trampled and abused, and that is the way Christ treats his Church so it’s okay.

Btw, in no fault divorce states and provinces, your husband can go ahead and divorce you, and you will not be able to stop it.

I think the OP is saying she wouldn’t initiate a divorce, not that she could prevent abandonment or keep herself from being forced into a divorce, but otherwise I think you’re right.

You cannot abuse a child’s mother or father without abusing the child. I think this is true even if the child is “kept unaware” of the abuse by not hearing or seeing it directly. The parents are so much a part of a child’s world that the child suffers even if they simply don’t take care of themselves or their marriage, let alone if they are mistreated to the point of abuse by another party.

On that same count, though, eventual repair of the relationship is to be preferred over divorce, if that is a realistic possibility. That doesn’t mean the couple doesn’t separate for a time, though, even when that heightens the chance of divorce. Stopping the offending behavior is a positive and necessary good, for the welfare of the child.

 

[odile53]

Umm, isn’t it required by the Fifth Commandment to take reasonable due care of our bodies? That would seem to mean to move oneself out of harm’s way if there were no legitimate purpose for being there. To my way of thinking, there is a huge difference between trusting in the Lord and tempting the Lord to protect one who is clearly in danger when that person is unwilling to take the most rudimentary responsibility for their own well-being and safety.

Quite frequently an abuser had traits or showed signs at the time the marriage was contracted that would prevent that person from validly contracting marriage. And by the way, an annulment is only necessary if one wishes to remarry. And that is a whole separate issue that I will touch on later in this post–I can’t imagine why someone escaping from an abusive marriage would be hasty to enter another marriage, even given economic hardship. There are all sorts of things to assist people in tough economic times. They aren’t handouts, either: You’ve already paid for them with your taxes that you earned in better times.

The funny thing (odd, I should say, as opposed to amusing,) is that the annulment process frequently requires statements from witnesses, people who knew the couple at the time of the marriage. This might be very useful in pursuing an annulment: Other people frequently see traits in people that someone who is closely involved can’t see. This in itself might swing the process favorably to having an annulment approved. How many times have you observed couples, wondering precisely what it is that she sees in him (or vice versa?) Things such as: he’s an impossibly controlling and hostile person, or she’s so incredibly vain that you wouldn’t be able to picture her going through the sacrifices of parenthood. Observations such as that on the part of witnesses may be all that is needed to demonstrate that a spouse had no intention on fulfilling the requirements of marriage at the time of the wedding.

Divorcing an abusive spouse, as has been noted by previous posters, may be the only way of protecting one’s own life while sparing one’s children from the trauma of living in an abusive home. It may, in fact, be removing the occasion of sin from the abuser.

A very dear friend of mine was beaten into a coma by her (now ex) husband. Her parish priest counseled her to remove herself from the situation immediately on her discharge from the hospital, citing, perhaps out of context, St. Paul’s exhortation concerning being yoked with unbelievers: “You were called to live in peace.” She recovered from her injuries, took legal action, and hasn’t looked back. While she has not found anyone new (and isn’t even looking,) she has a happy, peaceful, and productive life. Groveling submission to a degrading situation is NOT what Paul was describing when he exhorted wives to submit themselves to their husbands! Sad experience demonstrated this to my friend. By the way, acquaintances of theirs from the time of the wedding submitted affidavits concerning their knowledge of his behavior that were instrumental in getting the annulment granted.

I might add, when considering annulment, that surviving an abusive relationship ought to be followed by intensive counseling, both pastoral and professional, before even considering the possibility of dating, let alone marrying, again. Why people end up in abusive relationships in the first place frequently means that they themselves have some psychologic issues that need to be addressed. If not, the next spouse they find might be even worse than Mr. Wrong # 1.

 

[EasterJoy]

Divorcing an abusive spouse, as has been noted by previous posters, may be the only way of protecting one’s own life while sparing one’s children from the trauma of living in an abusive home. It may, in fact, be removing the occasion of sin from the abuser…

To complete the thought: We’re not saying that abuse is more tolerable if there are no children. We’re only saying that staying with an abusive spouse can be expected to harm any children of the marriage, not benefit them, even if the children are never made into direct targets. The only way the children would be used as a reason to keep trying to live in the same house where there is strife is when there isn’t any actual abuse going on. One would hope that a married couple without children would try to make it work, though, even without children as extra beneficiaries of their sacrifices. When in doubt, try to make sure that it can’t work. When there is no doubt, there is no sin in admitting it, even if it means spouses in a valid marriage have to live separate and celibate lives. Sometimes the “or worse” means being married and continuing to take care of the other as justice dictates, even after you realize that the spouse’s habitual sin means that you can’t live peaceably in the same house.

As you pointed out, removing yourself as a near occasion of sin for your spouse can be the most loving option available.

I might add, when considering annulment, that surviving an abusive relationship ought to be followed by intensive counseling, both pastoral and professional, before even considering the possibility of dating, let alone marrying, again. Why people end up in abusive relationships in the first place frequently means that they themselves have some psychologic issues that need to be addressed. If not, the next spouse they find might be even worse than Mr. Wrong # 1.

I think that everyone, religious or not, would benefit from talking with a professional third party about what happened during any failed attempt at marriage or even a serious relationship that just as easily as not could have lead to marriage, for just that reason. If you don’t learn to understand your own history, or even your family history, you are very likely to repeat it, even when you don’t want to.

The psychologists like to say that the definition of a dysfuntional family is: “Any family with more than one person in it.” It is not that every marriage with faults is invalid, because every person and every marriage has its faults. Still, our chances at marital success are the best if we have some idea what our faults are, what faults in others seem attractive to us when seen in a certain light, and why.