Do the branches of Islam equate to the branches of Christianity

[PacoG]

I was listening to a right wing talk show host rant about how the revolutions in Libya and Egypt replaced pro-Western secular regimes with Islamic fundamentalist-run governments that would unite with Iran to attack the United States.

Ok…assuming arguendo that these were fundamentalist takeovers in those countries, isn’t there still a huge difference between the worldview of fundamentalist Sunnis and the worldview of fundamentalist Shi’ites in Iran?

From what I’ve read and heard, the viewpoints are as different as those of ultra-traditionalist Catholics (for example the Society of St. Pius X) and fundamentalist Protestants (i.e. Pat Robertson and his crue).

If for example, if a Protestant fundamentalists would take power in Guatemala (i.e. General Rios-Mont), it would not necessarily be welcomed by a SSPX-friendly regime in Chile (for the sake of argument, of course).

Is there similar mistrust among between the two main factions of Muslims? If I understand the religious differences are basically the same…Scripure+Tradition+Interpretation (Shia) vs. Sola Scritpura (Sunni).

Does my question make sense?

 

[Matthew_Holford]

I was listening to a right wing talk show host rant about how the revolutions in Libya and Egypt replaced pro-Western secular regimes with Islamic fundamentalist-run governments that would unite with Iran to attack the United States.

Ok…assuming arguendo that these were fundamentalist takeovers in those countries, isn’t there still a huge difference between the worldview of fundamentalist Sunnis and the worldview of fundamentalist Shi’ites in Iran?

From what I’ve read and heard, the viewpoints are as different as those of ultra-traditionalist Catholics (for example the Society of St. Pius X) and fundamentalist Protestants (i.e. Pat Robertson and his crue).

If for example, if a Protestant fundamentalists would take power in Guatemala (i.e. General Rios-Mont), it would not necessarily be welcomed by a SSPX-friendly regime in Chile (for the sake of argument, of course).

Is there similar mistrust among between the two main factions of Muslims? If I understand the religious differences are basically the same…Scripure+Tradition+Interpretation (Shia) vs. Sola Scritpura (Sunni).

Does my question make sense?

It sounds as if what you heard was polemical. Neither Egypt nor Libya are being governed by Islamic fundamentalists.

I don’t believe that you can simply equate different schools of Islam with the various churches and ecclesial communities of Christianity.

There are considerable disagreements between the two main schools of Islam: Shi’a and Sunni. There are often violent disputes between adherents of these different schools, e.g. Bahrain, Iraq.

 

[Calgar]

There are often violent disputes between adherents of these different schools.

Understatement.

 

[PacoG]

It sounds as if what you heard was polemical. Neither Egypt nor Libya are being governed by Islamic fundamentalists.

I don’t believe that you can simply equate different schools of Islam with the various churches and ecclesial communities of Christianity.

There are considerable disagreements between the two main schools of Islam: Shi’a and Sunni. There are often violent disputes between adherents of these different schools, e.g. Bahrain, Iraq.

Actually, my knowledge is based on lectures that I covered when I was a journalism student at the University of Texas at Austin in the early 90s. The person who made the analogy between the the way Shi’a and Sunni view things to the way Catholics and Protestants view things was a distinguished professor at the UT Lyndon B. Johnson Graduate School of Public Affairs with a background in Middle Eastern diplomacy.

In fact, John Allen discussed the similarities between Catholicism and Shi’a Islam in an August 17, 2007, column:

On the other hand, Iranian author Vali Nasr in his 2006 book The Shia Revival ticks off an impressive string of parallels between Shi’a and Catholicism: a strong emphasis on clerical authority; an approach to the Qur’an accenting both scripture and tradition; a deep mystical streak; devotion to a holy family (in the case of Shi’ites, the blood relatives of Muhammad) and to saints (the Twelve Imams); a theology of sacrifice and atonement through the death of Hussein, the son of Muhammad’s cousin Ali, who was martyred in Karbala, Iraq, in 680; belief in free will (as opposed to the Sunni doctrine of pre-destination); holy days, pilgrimages, and healing shrines; intercessory prayer; and strongly emotional forms of popular devotion, especially the festival of Ashoura commemorating Hussein’s death.

ncronline.org/blogs/all-things-catholic/catholic-shia-connection-another-latin-mass-note

So, the lecturing about the analogy aside, please address my main question…is the “they are gang up against us” fear really unjustified.

 

[PacoG]

It sounds as if what you heard was polemical. Neither Egypt nor Libya are being governed by Islamic fundamentalists.

Ok. I assumed that you know what the phrase “assuming arguendo” means. Forgive me for presuming that everyone else uses the language that we lawyers use.

“Assuming arguendo” means to assume the truth for the sake of argument. In other words, it is a hypothetical question. So, for example, if I say “assuming arguendo that dogs are reptiles” I am not saying that dogs are reptiles nor am I changing the reality that Rover is a mammal. I am posing a hypothetical.

Do you understand now? Maybe now you can move on to address my question.

 

[Sam_777]

isn’t there still a huge difference between the worldview of fundamentalist Sunnis and the worldview of fundamentalist Shi’ites in Iran?

Yes, there is, probably you wouldn’t find a union between the two sects on attacking someone…

Is there similar mistrust among between the two main factions of Muslims? If I understand the religious differences are basically the same…Scripure+Tradition+Interpretation (Shia) vs. Sola Scritpura (Sunni).

Both Sunni & Shia are “Scripture+Tradition+Interpretation” but with different sources.

 

[Frank_Hagen]

Revelation 19:10
[10] And I fell at his feet to worship him. And he said unto me, See thou do it not: I am thy fellowservant, and of thy brethren that have the testimony of Jesus: worship God: for the testimony of Jesus is the spirit of prophecy.

The only way that the branches of Islam could equate to the branches of Christianity is if Mohammed prophesied of Jesus.

All of the prophets prophesied of the coming Messiah which was Christ.
To those who see it he is as:
Abraham: our righteousness
Isaac: the Child of promise given
Jacob: He in whom God is well pleased
Samson: our Strength
Solomon: our Wisdom
David: the Son of David
Nehemiah: the King’s Cupbearer
Jeremiah: known before He was in His mother’s womb
And as for a branch: the Branch that comes from Jesse and the Branch of righteousness that would build the temple and bear the glory as Zechariah prophesied.

Those are just a few prophesies. None are of Mohammed.
To answer I have to say no.

 

[Marybeloved]

From what I’ve read and heard, the viewpoints are as different as those of ultra-traditionalist Catholics (for example the Society of St. Pius X) and fundamentalist Protestants (i.e. Pat Robertson and his crue).

Just wanted to say that Pat Robertson is not a fundamentalist Protestant but an evangelical- There’s a difference.

Peace!

 

[Matthew_Holford]

Is there similar mistrust among between the two main factions of Muslims?

Yes, of course, there is.

I still say that comparing Shi’ites and Sunnis with Catholics and Protestants is oversimplying things too much.

 

[Peace_of_cake]

Is there similar mistrust among between the two main factions of Muslims? If I understand the religious differences are basically the same…Scripure+Tradition+Interpretation (Shia) vs. Sola Scritpura (Sunni).

Does my question make sense?

Things are really complex and too onerous. I would recommend Esposito’s book Islam and Development as a good place to start. Noah Feldman is worth a youtube search too. Basically the traditional ulama (clergy if you will) have been pushed to the peripharies and political (not religious) motivated groups have filled the vacuum using Islam as a tool for solidarity.

 

[arabic_catholic]

what I know is (since I was a salfi sunni myself) that Sunnis have four major groups , the differences between them are very few and not important , I would say it’s like the different between the rites in the church

for example what is the possition of your hand while you are praying , or how a person divorce his wife

however there is sect from sunnis developed the years called sufi which is very popular her in america , this type of islam embrace traditions (with small t) and ignore many of mohammed sayings and teachings , this type of islam have many false teachings according the the sunnies , such as asking prayers of the saints , or even having shrine and visit it , they celebrate the birth of mohameed and singing is popular in their mettings , This sect is influence by Christianity in general who by force left it . however , they themselves are divided to many schools of thoughts

Than the Salfi movement begin in the 18th and 19th century , which is calling muslims to go back to the quran and mohamed sayings , which is ‘’ True Islam’’ in their mind . This movement is the Fundamental islam , because they stick with the teachings of the early muslims generations .

this movement grow and wipe out the salfies whom their practices contradict what mohamed says .

however , suffi islam is growing in the west because of it’s ’ Peaceful Tone’ , which can’t fool any Salfi!

salfies believe you can’t ask any dead to pray for you , because that is shirk (worshiping person beside God)

Salfies are planning to re-establish the calaphat , which is kind like the papcy with more political rights . so the calipha is Mohammed on earth , because the word comes from claiphat rasul allah ‘’ the successor of the prophet of God’’

This is the Sunni islam

but Shia islam is different , they believe that mohamed have given the succession to ali and the 12 immam who success him , interestingly enough mohamed did say that , but sunnies intrepted differently

the hadith is : Surely Islam will always remain mighty till there are twelve caliphs in it. All of them will be of the Quraish

because sunnies used power to kill and destroy shiasim from very early time , for example mohamed grand son al hussain was killed by the calipha forces , and many of their immams were poisen and killed

they believe that the last imam (almahdy) went to a cave , and despire , and he will come again in the last days , and Jesus will pray behind him (it’s a sign that al mahdy is even mightier than Christ himself!)

and this is believed both by sunnits and shia , however sunnies believe the mahdy is not the shia one but another one

and sunnies belive this mahdy will defet the Christians and Jews and will protect islam .

Shia pray to saints , and visit their shrines , that’s why as a salfi we used to say they are infidels

Sunnis and shia hate each other , not even close to the level is protestant - catholic thing . I mean I have many protstant friends and we pray together , and sometimes we will use the internet to teach muslims about christ together

but salfies really hate shia , they believe they are jews in the cloth of islam !! and maybe they love christians more than shia , because shia believe that the friends of mohamed were not his friends but they betry him when he died and did not work by his saying to give the succession to Ali (the cousin of mohamed)

and they (shia ) still work with muta marrige (one day marrige ) while the sunnies don’t follow their prophet order to do such marrige because Oman the second Caliphate cancel it

Than you have newer groups , like the Quranic (Quran only ) which they believe all of us are muslims , and they destroy classical islam , and you have ahmadieas ,a sect made by some muslim in india who couldn’t defand his religion by the classical commtertor on Jesus , so he created a theory that Jesus was crucified( which is against the classic islam ) but didn’t die , but he went to india and died their , and he believe (the one who made this sect) that he is the Mahdi and christ but not Jesus , and this sect is very peaceful and don’t believe in jihad

so this is what I know about some differences , but you need to excuse me , for I am from Salfi sunni background and maybe there are more about shia and sufi from their side too