Do you take Bible literally?

[edwest2]

Did not Jesus endure the cross, a very messy business indeed, for the joy that was to come? There’s no need to be so literalistic.

There’s no difficulty at all–only in the way you are interpreting these verses. Moses wasn’t interested in how every blade of grass came into being–he was trying to tell us that God created the heavens and the earth and all they contain in an orderly fashion and for our benefit. Picking it apart and making more of than was intended is what gets people tied into knots and the scientific community skeptical about religion. God wants us to know how to get to heaven in his Word, not how the heavens go, which is a matter of natural inquiry and not important to the salvation of mankind.

Moses was not telling us anything, it was the Holy Spirit of God. See 2 Peter 1:21.

bible.cc/2_peter/1-21.htm

Why was Jesus born? Why was His sacrifice necessary? The Bible tells us but there are those who seek to hide or obscure the truth.

Peace,
Ed

 

[grannymh]

Doesn’t the Catholic Church say somewhere…maybe in the catechism…that normally the literal sense IS the way that scripture should be taken UNLESS it can be proved that another sense was intended?

To match up the Catechism with Scripture, check out the footnotes. Read and meditate on the whole Scripture chapter in addition to the cited verse(s). Those who have the book, can check out the Index of Citations.

One of the purposes of the Catholic Church is to teach Divine Revelation through the declared and proclaimed doctrines. It is so easy to start with a doctrine, itself, to find the truth. When using the Catechism of the Catholic Church, Second Edition, one needs to start with the first paragraphs which explain how to use the book. Then go to the Table of Contents in order to understand the book’s structure. The glossary and the index in the back are essential.

Link to Catechism. scborromeo.org/ccc.htm

 

[bextah]

Then how do you explain how light could have been created on the first day “Let there be light.”] when the sun, moon, and stars weren’t created until the fourth day?

And there was nobody around to record it until the 6th day!

 

[bextah]

I beg to disagree. I don’t think you can compare how we make things with how God does His creating. There’s really no comparison. He is the Almighty. He can do anything. He creates – makes things out of nothing – so why can’t He do it right the first time? But didn’t He say, in His Word, that when He originally created the earth, it was so beautiful that the angels shouted for joy? He tells Job, “Where wast thou when I laid the foundations of the earth… When the morning stars sang together, and all the sons of God shouted for joy?”

I don’t know where the problems lie if we take the Genesis account literally. I can’t see any. On the other hand, when we say the “days” are really epochs, we are confronted with some impossible situations. For example, how could the plants have survived without sunshine? Now, insects were made on the sixth day, how could some plants continue to exist for ages without their insect partners (bees, wasps, butterflies, moths)? If we say the creation days were thousands of years in length we are faced with the conclusion that most plants would have to live this period of time without producing seed. That’s an impossibility.

So where do the dinosaurs fit?

We understand now about the relationship between plants / insects / animals, but maybe at the dawn of creation it didn’t work that way? Who is to say what is impossible for God?

Maybe everything existed and thrived initially simply because God willed it so, and then maybe he established relationships between his plant, animal and insect creations so they would need to rely on each other and work together to have the best possible existence?

Maybe these symbiotic relationships were created in a day, or developed over a thousand years. Maybe these relationships were formed and developed to help us to understand that every living thing is essential for the survival of another, and our love, understanding and respect of this is how we honour what He made.

Amazing relationships in nature confirm this for me all the time - like the actions of the spiders in Pakistan after the floods in 2010, they cocooned trees with their webs because the water took so long to recede - but these spun webs caught the mosquitoes that came due to the stagnant water that was left, so the potential threat of malaria was significantly less than predicted. I think before this, some people may have said it was impossible for some spiders to have a positive impact on the health of flood victims… God wasn’t one of them

This part of the Bible was written by people without that scientific knowledge of the importance of bees to flowers or even the location of the sun in relation to Earth - they wrote within their limits, and quite beautifully I think, but not literally.

 

[edwest2]

The Bible, the entire Bible, was written by men under the inspiration of the Holy Spirit.

bible.cc/2_peter/1-21.htm

God, not they, determined how and what should be told to the people. Regardless of how much more knowledegable some people think we are in the 21st Century, the exact same sins committed 2,000 years ago are still being committed today.

And God could have written about how in ages past there were creatures that were more animal than man, but over these great ages they gradually changed and became men like you are today. No need to explain DNA, chemistry, etc.

Peace,
Ed

 

[A_Gift]

It can be interpreted that way, but really there’s no need for it. The days and nights are not literal 24 hr days but epochs, as the original Hebrew indicates. And in the process of forming anything there is going to be what appears to be chaos because that’s the nature of making anything. I speak from personal experience when we demolished a rundown part of our 100 year old house to replace it with new construction. What a mess! But it was “organized confusion” not random–there was purpose in everything we had to do until we had the new house section completed. So, there doesn’t have to be such an elaborate explanation for the creation of the universe and the earth nor is God’s authority in question if the planet was not yet inhabitable for humans until it was made ready. This is why the Catholic Church doesn’t interpret every word of the Bible literalistically–because it is not the right way to do it and because it creates more problems than it solves–having to invent all sorts of convoluted explanations for what doesn’t need to be explained.

Pardon me for putting in some, what I pray is some stimulating thought. The Hebrew actually indicates a literal six days; not the other way around. If it just used the word “day”, then you could be correct,but when a number is in front or behind - (Hebrew is read from right to left), then it becomes very specific and if that were not enough - God made sure we got the picture by stating as an example in Genesis 1 “So the ***evening and the morning were the first day.” ***

Here you have another problem and an obvious solution if you believe the Bible is the Word of God; i never met a Christian who did not take the Genesis account as a literal six days; at least that I am aware of because of this simple logic, rational thinking and the plain Word of Paul in Romans 5:12—> "12 Therefore, just as through one man sin entered the world, and death through sin, and thus death spread to all men. If evolution were true, then Romans 5:12 is wrong because many many people, plants and animals would have died over “millions” of years. Remember the curse was not just on man, but on plants and animals and the entire creation. So if one believes that there is no conflict with Genesis1-2 and evolution, then that is plain evidence of an unregenerate soul or at best a very weak newborn in Christ who would eventually be illuminated by the Holy Spirit of Truth to this obvious problem and change there position based on the knowledge gained by a simple reading of Romans and Genesis.

You are wrong when you say it does not present a problem or put God’s authority in question; it is God’s word and it is either true or not and there is only one correct interpretation and it is so clear that I am astounded that it has crept into the church. Before “Origin of the Species” this was not a big issue at all; not till recent history - past 200 years that it has become a virus within churches.

I hope this has illuminated your understanding and remember we all use a 7 day calendar; just as the rest of the world does - do you think this is by accident or perhaps by design? I’ll go with design and the designer is God who is blessed forever!

 

[A_Gift]

The Bible, the entire Bible, was written by men under the inspiration of the Holy Spirit.

bible.cc/2_peter/1-21.htm

God, not they, determined how and what should be told to the people. Regardless of how much more knowledegable some people think we are in the 21st Century, the exact same sins committed 2,000 years ago are still being committed today.

And God could have written about how in ages past there were creatures that were more animal than man, but over these great ages they gradually changed and became men like you are today. No need to explain DNA, chemistry, etc.

Peace,
Ed

Romans 5:12 - it does matter and it was a literal 6 days no matter how one slices it.

 

[Bev17243]

Pardon me for putting in some, what I pray is some stimulating thought. The Hebrew actually indicates a literal six days; not the other way around. If it just used the word “day”, then you could be correct,but when a number is in front or behind - (Hebrew is read from right to left), then it becomes very specific and if that were not enough - God made sure we got the picture by stating as an example in Genesis 1 “So the ***evening and the morning were the first day.” ***

Here you have another problem and an obvious solution if you believe the Bible is the Word of God; i never met a Christian who did not take the Genesis account as a literal six days; at least that I am aware of because of this simple logic, rational thinking and the plain Word of Paul in Romans 5:12—> "12 Therefore, just as through one man sin entered the world, and death through sin, and thus death spread to all men. If evolution were true, then Romans 5:12 is wrong because many many people, plants and animals would have died over “millions” of years. Remember the curse was not just on man, but on plants and animals and the entire creation. So if one believes that there is no conflict with Genesis1-2 and evolution, then that is plain evidence of an unregenerate soul or at best a very weak newborn in Christ who would eventually be illuminated by the Holy Spirit of Truth to this obvious problem and change there position based on the knowledge gained by a simple reading of Romans and Genesis.

You are wrong when you say it does not present a problem or put God’s authority in question; it is God’s word and it is either true or not and there is only one correct interpretation and it is so clear that I am astounded that it has crept into the church. Before “Origin of the Species” this was not a big issue at all; not till recent history - past 200 years that it has become a virus within churches.

I hope this has illuminated your understanding and remember we all use a 7 day calendar; just as the rest of the world does - do you think this is by accident or perhaps by design? I’ll go with design and the designer is God who is blessed forever!

 

[gw3961]

Pardon me for putting in some, what I pray is some stimulating thought. The Hebrew actually indicates a literal six days; not the other way around. If it just used the word “day”, then you could be correct,but when a number is in front or behind - (Hebrew is read from right to left), then it becomes very specific and if that were not enough - God made sure we got the picture by stating as an example in Genesis 1 “So the ***evening and the morning were the first day.” ***

Here you have another problem and an obvious solution if you believe the Bible is the Word of God; i never met a Christian who did not take the Genesis account as a literal six days; at least that I am aware of because of this simple logic, rational thinking and the plain Word of Paul in Romans 5:12—> "12 Therefore, just as through one man sin entered the world, and death through sin, and thus death spread to all men. If evolution were true, then Romans 5:12 is wrong because many many people, plants and animals would have died over “millions” of years. Remember the curse was not just on man, but on plants and animals and the entire creation. So if one believes that there is no conflict with Genesis1-2 and evolution, then that is plain evidence of an unregenerate soul or at best a very weak newborn in Christ who would eventually be illuminated by the Holy Spirit of Truth to this obvious problem and change there position based on the knowledge gained by a simple reading of Romans and Genesis.

You are wrong when you say it does not present a problem or put God’s authority in question; it is God’s word and it is either true or not and there is only one correct interpretation and it is so clear that I am astounded that it has crept into the church. Before “Origin of the Species” this was not a big issue at all; not till recent history - past 200 years that it has become a virus within churches.

I hope this has illuminated your understanding and remember we all use a 7 day calendar; just as the rest of the world does - do you think this is by accident or perhaps by design? I’ll go with design and the designer is God who is blessed forever!

There is a widely held misconception that evolution somehow “kills god”. however, it is perfectly plausible for one to be a devout Christian and hold evolution to be true. Even at Darwin’s time, the waves that were cause by the “origin of species” were short lived and confined mainly to Britain. the rest of the world, upon the discovery and research of the fossil record, quickly accepted that the world must be older than they previous thought. this realization, however, did not have the devastating effects on the Christian faith that modern society tends to think.

All the hype surrounding evolution stems from the rise of fundamental Christianity and biblical literalism in the American South. before this new type of Christianity entered the scene, it was widely accepted that when the Bible seemed to contradict itself, a deeper allegorical meaning was present. This is the case with the creation narratives, as made clear by modern science. Before the 20th century, Biblical literalism was very uncommon and it has by no means ever been the norm of belief for the Christian church.

 

[onlyvoice]

So where do the dinosaurs fit?

As I said before, Genesis does not say when the heavens and the earth were originally created. In other words, the Bible is silent on the age of the universe. For all we know the earth could be billions of years old.

What we do know from God’s revelation is that when He originally created the earth, the angels sang and shouted for joy. Now, why would they have acted that way? The only logical explanation is that what the angels saw was an earth of great beauty.

Now, what was there on earth (remember that the earth is just an orb composed mainly of rock and soil and by itself should look drab and ordinary) that made it so beautiful to behold? Was there flora and fauna? But what is there in nature that we find so beautiful today? Don’t the many different life forms on earth “dress up” the earth, so to speak, and beautifies it? Would the fauna have included dinosaurs? Why not?

We understand now about the relationship between plants / insects / animals, but maybe at the dawn of creation it didn’t work that way? Who is to say what is impossible for God?

Maybe everything existed and thrived initially simply because God willed it so, and then maybe he established relationships between his plant, animal and insect creations so they would need to rely on each other and work together to have the best possible existence?

We are dealing with a God of law and order. Are you saying God did not put into effect the physical laws that govern His creation initially and only got this going after millions of years have passed?

Maybe these symbiotic relationships were created in a day, or developed over a thousand years. Maybe these relationships were formed and developed to help us to understand that every living thing is essential for the survival of another, and our love, understanding and respect of this is how we honour what He made.

The revelation says plainly that these are literal days and nights. Why not just trust God on His word and so avoid resorting to all these speculations on what could have happened?

This part of the Bible was written by people without that scientific knowledge of the importance of bees to flowers or even the location of the sun in relation to Earth - they wrote within their limits, and quite beautifully I think, but not literally.

I believe you’re very wrong here. Even your church would not agree with you. The writers merely penned the words. The words came from the Holy Spirit. In other words, God is the real author of Genesis, not Moses.

Here’s from the online Catholic Encyclopedia:

The Bible not only contains the word of God; it is the word of God. The primary author is the Holy Ghost, or, as it is commonly expressed, the human authors wrote under the influence of Divine inspiration. It was declared by the Vatican Council (Sess. III, c. ii) that… They (Scriptures) are sacred and canonical “because, having been written by inspiration of the Holy Ghost, that have God for their author, and as such have been handed down to the Church”.

“If you do not believe his [Moses’] writings,” Jesus asks you this, “how shall you believe my words?” (John 5:47).

Yes, indeed! How shall you believe Him – the Author of Moses’ writings – if you do not believe what Moses wrote?

 

[onlyvoice]

There is a widely held misconception that evolution somehow “kills god”. however, it is perfectly plausible for one to be a devout Christian and hold evolution to be true. Even at Darwin’s time, the waves that were cause by the “origin of species” were short lived and confined mainly to Britain. the rest of the world, upon the discovery and research of the fossil record, quickly accepted that the world must be older than they previous thought. this realization, however, did not have the devastating effects on the Christian faith that modern society tends to think.

All the hype surrounding evolution stems from the rise of fundamental Christianity and biblical literalism in the American South. before this new type of Christianity entered the scene, it was widely accepted that when the Bible seemed to contradict itself, a deeper allegorical meaning was present. This is the case with the creation narratives, as made clear by modern science. Before the 20th century, Biblical literalism was very uncommon and it has by no means ever been the norm of belief for the Christian church.

No, you cannot be a true Christian and at the same time a believer of evolution, not even so called theistic evolution. The Bible says plainly that God created all life on earth instantaneously by fiat. Evolution denies this.

When we start believing in evolution we start to question God’s revelation. We start to entertain doubts on the truthfulness of God’s word. People today, because of the teachings on evolution, either believe the Bible does not mean quite what it says – and therefore that God does not mean quite what He says; or people are led to disbelieve the Bible entirely and deny the existence of God completely. The theory of evolution in fact provides the atheist with an explanation of a creation without a Creator.

But we do not have to believe in it. There is no excuse for believing in evolution because there is no evidence whereby it may be proved. Instead of believing in such an absurd theory, we should put our trust in God’s revelation. It is there that we find the truth of origins.

 

[CalCatholic]

There is a widely held misconception that evolution somehow “kills god”. however, it is perfectly plausible for one to be a devout Christian and hold evolution to be true. Even at Darwin’s time, the waves that were cause by the “origin of species” were short lived and confined mainly to Britain. the rest of the world, upon the discovery and research of the fossil record, quickly accepted that the world must be older than they previous thought. this realization, however, did not have the devastating effects on the Christian faith that modern society tends to think.

All the hype surrounding evolution stems from the rise of fundamental Christianity and biblical literalism in the American South. before this new type of Christianity entered the scene, it was widely accepted that when the Bible seemed to contradict itself, a deeper allegorical meaning was present. This is the case with the creation narratives, as made clear by modern science. Before the 20th century, Biblical literalism was very uncommon and it has by no means ever been the norm of belief for the Christian church.

Exactly

 

[A_Gift]

There is a widely held misconception that evolution somehow “kills god”. however, it is perfectly plausible for one to be a devout Christian and hold evolution to be true. Even at Darwin’s time, the waves that were cause by the “origin of species” were short lived and confined mainly to Britain. the rest of the world, upon the discovery and research of the fossil record, quickly accepted that the world must be older than they previous thought. this realization, however, did not have the devastating effects on the Christian faith that modern society tends to think.

All the hype surrounding evolution stems from the rise of fundamental Christianity and biblical literalism in the American South. before this new type of Christianity entered the scene, it was widely accepted that when the Bible seemed to contradict itself, a deeper allegorical meaning was present. This is the case with the creation narratives, as made clear by modern science. Before the 20th century, Biblical literalism was very uncommon and it has by no means ever been the norm of belief for the Christian church.

The only people who believe the Bible contradicts itself are non-Christians and God said that a natural man, which is a non-believer, cannot - repeat cannot understand the Word of God. 1 Corinthians 2:14 So God is telling the truth here or He is a liar - there is no gray area. Hebrews 6:18 states that it is IMPOSSIBLE for God to lie and the Bible is the WORD of GOD Almighty. In the same way, God made it very clear to the Christian that He made all that He created in six days and Romans 5:12 eliminates the possibility of man evolving from a lower form of an animal and furthermore He made man in His image or likeness. The key being that God made MAN.

The only way it can be plausible is if the Bible is wrong, which it is not, but men intentionally will not admit there limits and therefore lie by half truths as shown by half-lifes…LOL.

I trust God and suggest people learn the lesson that Job and His friends learned - read job and perhaps you will be enlightened by the Holy Spirit if God should allow and I pray He will if you Ask, Seek and Knock with an earnest heart of wanting to know the truth.

As far as science- take a look at the dating methods used and you will find that when Mt St, Helens erupted and took down half the mountain, that using those same unreliable methods would have dated it in various years from thousands to ten’s of thousands to millions.

The primary dating methods can’t even explain the existence of coal; by their theory it can’t exist, but it does and in abundance. God built age into the universe from our perspective; Adam was never and infant and the tress and flowers in the garden were already mature and producing food and seed when He created.

I believe God has a great sense of humor in my opinion making the wisdom of man and especially the weathermen and geologist laughable. God was there; man was not and therefore I put my trust in the one who cannot lie and was there verses the one who can do nothing but lie - man who was not there.

 

[grannymh]

All the hype surrounding evolution stems from the rise of fundamental Christianity and biblical literalism in the American South. before this new type of Christianity entered the scene, it was widely accepted that when the Bible seemed to contradict itself, a deeper allegorical meaning was present. This is the case with the creation narratives, as made clear by modern science. Before the 20th century, Biblical literalism was very uncommon and it has by no means ever been the norm of belief for the Christian church.

Catholicism holds that the creation narrative of two sole parents of humanity, Adam and Eve, refers to a real event and not an allegorical one.

 

[Michael_Francis]

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