Does God allow us to run out of time?

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Mijoy2

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I’m curious as to how many others have contimplated this thought.
There are cradle Catholics who have led a devout Catholic life all thier life. However I’d contend they are very rare indeed. I suspect most people are reverts and many are converts. Some young and many old. In my case I was 46-47 (now 48) when I made a drastic change in my faith and subsequent behavior. As I look back on my life I can recall countless times when it almost abruptly ended, accidents, foolishness etc.

We live on average (guessing here) 75-85 years or so. Many of us expire much earlier due to sickness or accident. I can’t help but think there are many many people who died abruptly while living a godless life who, eventually, given thier life circumstances (such as in my situation) would have come to know and love God.

I can’t picture a loving God thinking, “well you blew it dude, if it weren’t for that train that hit you you would have made it to my kingdom”.

What of all the people who die young who did not know God and would have, given time, learned to know and love Him?
 
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Mijoy2:
I can’t picture a loving God thinking, “well you blew it dude, if it weren’t for that train that hit you you would have made it to my kingdom”.

What of all the people who die young who did not know God and would have, given time, learned to know and love Him?
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Hey Mijoy2!

If Adam and Eve didn’t sin we would not have to die. CCC 1008 tells this: “Death is a consequence of sin. The Church’s Magisterium, as authentic interpreter of the affirmations of Scripture and Tradition, teaches that death entered the world on account of man’s sin.571 Even though man’s nature is mortal God had destined him not to die. Death was therefore contrary to the plans of God the Creator and entered the world as a consequence of sin.572 “Bodily death, from which man would have been immune had he not sinned” is thus “the last enemy” of man left to be conquered”.

Remeber that there is a battle between good and fallen angels to win our souls. (Battle
against evil, 409-10
Baptism, forgiveness of sins and battle against evil, 978-79, 1264
Christian holiness and the spiritual, 2015
consequences of original sin and spiritual, 405, 407-09
conversion and, 1426
faith and, 162, 2573
flesh, spirit and, 2516, 2819, 2846
human life as, 409, 1707
human nature and the spiritual, 2516
prayer as, 2612, 2725-51, 2846, 2849
purity and the battle to attain it, 2520-27)

God predestines no one to go to hell (CCC1337). CCC1035 says:"The teaching of the Church affirms the existence of hell and its eternity. Immediately after death the souls of those who die in a state of mortal sin descend into hell, where they suffer the punishments of hell, "eternal fire.“617 The chief punishment of hell is eternal separation from God, in whom alone man can possess the life and happiness for which he was created and for which he longs.”

This means that if a person gets hit by a train being in mortal sin, he or she will have to live forever separated by God.

It’s not our sake to “judge” God for people eventually going to hell. We must thank Him for guiding us home (I am a convert).

We live in a society. We have families and friends. Fallen away-catholics (and other fallen away christians) can have had familymembers praying for them for years to come home to CHURCH! If that’s the case, it’s no coincidence that lost sheep was found and brougth back home.

That’s why we should pray for as many as possible, so that no-one runs out of time!

(Please excuse any spellingmistakes. English is not my first language).

:blessyou:

G.G.
 
Mijoy2:L
Does God allow us to run out of time?
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Yes. Every single one of us runs out of time.

I think that’s the message of the entire chapter of Matt 25.

BTW, on a personal note, my story would be identical to yours, and I share the same gratitude and wonderment for His infinite mercy.

Peace in Christ…Salmon
 
God dose not control the circumstances that every one is subject to. A child is entrusted to parents who are responsible to raise that child to know, love and serve God. That child when grown is responsible is expected to continue to know, love and serve God. Family and friends and other interfaces with the world have an effect on this. If family, friends or parents or we our selves fail. It’s not God’s fault! IF a 17 year old is run over by a train. We think how did they live up to that point, They went to church every Sunday, treated other people with respect, would never cheat or steal. They are all choices we either make or that are made for us up to a point as children. Parents will be held accountable for what they did or did not do until the child was able to decide for themselves, an individual will be accountable for their actions after that.
 
my take on the summary of responces thus far:

So very very disturbing
 
Mijoy2,

You wrote: “my take on the summary of responces thus far: So very very disturbing”

Yes, having to take responsibility for how we live is very disturbing. Hell is disturbing. If one gambles that “oh, I think I’ll live a sinful life and take faith seriously some other time”, then one is playing a disturbing game with one’s life.

If you don’t want to be disturbed, then convince yourself that God and hell do not exist.
 
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Mijoy2:
my take on the summary of responces thus far:

So very very disturbing
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What kind of response are you expecting? Scripture tells us that it is too late to try and repent after our death, therefore we can conclude that we will at some point in our lives run out of time. This is also why Jesus tells us to be prepared.

Oscar
 
Mijoy:

The only thing that should be disturbing is the fact that we don’t take our sin at face value, thus we are never fully prepared to face God if it becomes our time to go.

We have become a society where we believe that we will always have time to get to that later. God is never that much in front of us.

The only reason why we would think we have run out of time, would be because we put things (Him) off for so long, so at the end, we never got around to Him.

The vice of procrastination.

Story
 
Allow me to attempt to qualify my “so very disturbing” comment.

What I mean is not: “gee sounds like we can’t put off God”. That wasn’t where my comment originated from.

What I meant was more along the lines of the apparent (and I emphasize apparent) unfairness and lack of logic. BTW, I know fully well God knows what He is doing and that I could never and should never second guess. However I think I am being reasonable when I attempt with all my might to understand what appears to be illogical and unfair.

What I meant was, and this is why I used myself as an example; If I were to have died in one of my many car accidents as a young adult, I ( the same “I” that I am now) would have likely (based on the doctrine of our faith) have been in a very grave situation spiritually. Who knows maybe I still am.

Can you follow my reasoning here (not sure if I am being clear) ?
This implies that there are people in hell who, if it were not by some accident or illness, WOULD have changed and thier eternal outcome would have been totally different. I was not refering to procrastinators as much as I was refering to ill-informed, the slow learners, individuals who not denied or put of God, just simply never gave Him much or any thought because of thier repective upbringing and environment.

I guess I hoped, (and maybe this was too much to hope for), is that God, knowing what was in our hearts, would lessen the accountablility of those who had the potential to change, but as of yet had not. There were no replies of that nature, this is what I found disturbing.
 
JMJ

Your desire to lessen the responsibility of those who die “before they repent” is illogical. How long would you give each of these persons? Some may take 20 years, some 50 years, some 550 years. Some who may have been born during the lifetime of Adam may still be living without repentence. Christ Himself warned us to be always ready. Adam’s sin brought us the scourge of death (temporary separation of body and soul).

To claim that God is “unfair” and/or “illogical” is blasphemy and heresy. However, you only indicated that it seemed to be thus. So, it only seems that you almost blasphemed and made a heretical statement.

I do not wish to offend you, but probably have. However, your statements indicate to me a very serious lack of realization of the relationship of man to the Infinite Creator, Who is not just good and just, but is Infinite Goodness and Justice. We may not judge God. He is beyond our comprehension. Everything God does or can do in His Infinite Power is Absolutely Good and Logical. To think or believe otherwise is within the capability of our free will, but is a sure ticket away from friendship with God and its consequences.
 
Mijoy2, you might want to consider reading The Spiritual Journey, by Marie Coombs and Francis Nemeck, OMI. This book deals extensively with the issues you are pondering, and I think it would help you find peace. I’ve mentioned it on several threads and recommend it highly. Here is a link to their web site:

lebhshomea.org/books.htm

Peace and blessings!!
 
We might also consider the possibility that some who die young, “before their time,” as some might say, might have become worse sinners late in life. Perhaps their early death was a blessing in disguise known only to God.

I also don’t discount Miljoy2’s hope that “God, knowing what was in our hearts, would lessen the accountablility of those who had the potential to change, but as of yet had not.” Only God knows perfectly what is in our heart, and His will is for our salvation. Certainly we should never delay repentance, since we are all indeed running out of time. But God, like the Father awaiting the return of the prodigal son, patiently awaits, and yearns for our return.

JimG
 
Be thankful that the average lifespan isn’t 30-40 years, like it used to be.
 
I believe 100% that God gives sufficient graces to every individual for conversion during their lifetime. Only God knows how much time a person needs, and it is up to each person to follow the graces God gives. No one is “cut off before their time,” because each person is given exactly enough time to set their ways in stone, IMO. For some this comes early, and for some it comes late.

If you had died when you were young you may have been in a bad place, but you didn’t, I believe, because God knew that you had not had sufficient time to truly accept or deny Him. It’s not given to us to know our allotted time, so we have to always be vigilant for God’s graces (sounds a lot like the “thief in the night”, doesn’t it). I, for one, put my faith in God’s judgement to know the time of everyone’s absolute (read: final) acceptance or refusal.
 
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Chaffa55:
Mijoy2, you might want to consider reading The Spiritual Journey, by Marie Coombs and Francis Nemeck, OMI. This book deals extensively with the issues you are pondering, and I think it would help you find peace. I’ve mentioned it on several threads and recommend it highly. Here is a link to their web site:

lebhshomea.org/books.htm

Peace and blessings!!
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I’ll certainly look into this, thank you.

As others have posted, I like to think God gives sufficient graces therefore everyones outcome becomes of thier own chosing. The only thing that disturbs me about this, assuming it is true, is that there are not more converts/reverts then there seem to be.

I once heard Mother Angelica address the concerns of a very upset caller who called deeply concerned about a loved ones soul following a suicide. Mother Angelica said (and I paraphrase); “we do not know what went through the persons mind in the moments prior to thier death. They may have repented in the last moment.” I believe she went on to talk of Gods mercy. I found this comforting. It seemed to imply that God may give sufficient graces even during times we cannot percieve possible. Possibly, just possibly, there was an indefinate moment, a moment that lasted long enough for the person to ponder what they did, and ask for forgiveness with divine assistance.

I just have trouble with the spiritual concepts some have of “mandatory sentences”. I hope God works in ways He maybe hasn’t fully revealed to us.

Thanks for all those who replied. Esspecially those who took the time to truly understand my question.
 
I know exactly what MiJoy2 is trying to say.

I did the same thing. I had an adulterous affair for six months. I cannot express to you how bind and evil my soul was during those six months. I filed for divorce.

One day I saw in the newspaper that The Pope repeated publicially that the divorced cannot receive The Eucharist, which I had buried in my wickedness. When I read that headline in the newspaper my life flashed before my eyes and I almost vomited realizing what I had done.

I’m back now thanks to God, the Pope and the newspaper article.

MiJoy2 is asking - what would have happened to me if I had not read the newspaper that day? We all know the technical answer, but can we know the mind of God on these questions?

Also, concerning suicide. I saw a Frontline documentary on the 1,000th person who have committed suicide by jumping off the Golden gate bridge. They interviewed a few who survived. The survivors said that the instant they jumped they realized what a mistake they had made and were extremely remorseful.

Chris G
 
MiJoy2 is asking - what would have happened to me if I had not read the newspaper that day? We all know the technical answer, but can we know the mind of God on these questions?
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Don’t trouble yourself with the “what ifs”. If you had died at that moment, you may have gone to Hell, but God knew that and helped to prevent it with the article in question. Who’s to say that those who do die suddenly aren’t given the same chance, even at the last moment?
 
"I did the same thing. I had an adulterous affair for six months. I cannot express to you how bind and evil my soul was during those six months. I filed for divorce.

One day I saw in the newspaper that The Pope repeated publicially that the divorced cannot receive The Eucharist, which I had buried in my wickedness. When I read that headline in the newspaper my life flashed before my eyes and I almost vomited realizing what I had done.

I’m back now thanks to God, the Pope and the newspaper article."

The problem is you missed an important part of this. The Pope said that those who were Divorced AND re-married could not receive Communion. Just so no one else is confused.
 
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Mijoy2:
I hope God works in ways He maybe hasn’t fully revealed to us.
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Of course God does, Mijoy! God runs after us and knocks on our doors until we open up. That happens because He loves us so much. Remember Luke 15:6-7, “…“Rejoice with me, for I have found my sheep that was lost.” 7Just so, I tell you, there will be more joy in heaven over one sinner who repents than over ninety-nine righteous persons who need no repentance.”

But your question is very complicated. Some never open their doors. Others get warning after warning from God (wake-up-call) but refuse to repent. They **all ** sure run out of time one day.

Everyone of us can run out of time if we start being lazy. God has already rescued a lot of us (converts). It is up to us to cooperate with God for the rest of our life (pray,give thanks, use the sacraments, try to live the gospel etc).

God will not force anyone to Heaven that don’t want to be there! He will respect the will to say no to be with Him forever.

About non-believers dying in accsidents: You can’t know if they are given a last chance in that moment. Only God knows their hearts (and why they don’t believe in Him). Some will still say no! They who say YES will be welcomed: "…“Rejoice with me, for I have found my sheep that was lost.” (Luke 15:6)

God Bless!

G.G.
 
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