Does God give people handicaps?

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Zatzat said:
Who would care? NOTHING could make a person happier in heaven…seems like a relatively pointless exercise.

…and that is my question…how does that make any sense???
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The angels are purely spirits, they have no bodies and though created are not part of the material world.

Visible creation is purely material, animals and plants do not have spiritual souls.

Man is the **unique **meeting of these two realities-- man is the only creature with a spiritual soul. Man is the only spirit also to possess material bodies. God created us for this purpose.

Simply put, Man is not Man without his body. Our souls were never meant to be separated from our bodies. We are not angels. Our bodily resurrection makes us completely who God created us to be. Our souls were meant to animate a body. That is why we will receive a glorified body in the General Resurrection.

In the Beatific Vision we may be authentically happy without our body, but we are not fully persons without our body. God willed Man to be the point at which the invisible spiritual world and the visible material world meet. He fulfills His Will and his divine plan by restoring our bodies in the Resurrection.
 
1ke said:
Man is the **unique **meeting of these two realities-- man is the only creature with a spiritual soul. Man is the only spirit also to possess material bodies. God created us for this purpose.

Simply put, Man is not Man without his body.
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  1. It sounds like man will be less than happy in heaven without his body…a complete contradiction of what Christians believe heaven to be.
  2. ’ man is not man’ without his body…surely that includes the beneficial bacteria that exist within our stomach and colons that are absolutely essential to proper digestion…do those bacteriums get into heaven with our bodies when Jesus returns?
 
Yorkshireman said:
From Communion and Stewardship:
Human Persons Created in the Image of God

(The July 2004 Vatican Statement on Creation and Evolution)
While there is little consensus among scientists about how the origin of this first microscopic life is to be explained, there is general agreement among them that the first organism dwelt on this planet about 3.5-4 billion years ago. Since it has been demonstrated that all living organisms on earth are genetically related, it is virtually certain that all living organisms have descended from this first organism. bringyou.to/apologetics/p80.htm
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Thanks for the link you provided. I have been doing additional research and the end is drawing near; sad that people who call themselves Christians do not believe the account in Genesis IMHO. Reminds me of when Jesus wept over Jerusalem; that is how my heart feels.
 
Zatzat said:
  1. It sounds like man will be less than happy in heaven without his body…a complete contradiction of what Christians believe heaven to be.
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Not at all.
Zatzat said:
  1. ’ man is not man’ without his body…surely that includes the beneficial bacteria that exist within our stomach and colons that are absolutely essential to proper digestion…do those bacteriums get into heaven with our bodies when Jesus returns?
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a) No, that does not follow. We will receive glorified bodies-- recall Jesus’s glorified body was substantially different from his mortal body. We will have material bodies but they will not be like our current bodies. As St. Paul says, we do not yet fully know what we will be.

b) “Heaven” is what we commonly call the Beatific Vision. The Beatific Vision is not confined to one “place.” In fact, pure spirits do not have parts nor occupy space. Therefore, “heaven” is not necessarily a place we will “be” but rather a state of being. It is seeing God “as he is, face to face.” At the General Resurrection we will receive glorified bodies and God will remake all of Creation, as per Scripture. That does not negate the fact that we will also be in the Beatific Vision, the presence of God, in a way in which we are not today.

c) your statement about bacterium ‘getting into heaven’ is nonsensical and shows a lack of understanding regarding what heaven is and is not.
 
Zatzat said:
I’m intimately familiar with the story of the resurrection. I’m quite certain my question will not be answered by reading from newadvent, else my question would have been answered many years ago.
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So, you have studied Aquinas?

What did you find from this section of the Summa?
 
Yorkshireman said:
If a woman is born without a uterus and as a result can’t have children how much was God involved in her unfortunate state? Does he actively decide, “That woman shall have no uterus,” or does he just allow these things just happen?

The thing is I don’t want to believe in a god that knowingly/deliberately allows people to have handicaps.

If he didn’t know that someone was going to be born with a handicap and just lets nature take its course then for me all that stuff people are given about how their handicap is a test for them or their parents is nonsense.

If God didn’t know someone was going to be handicapped how can he have intended the handicap - the handicap he didn’t know about - to be a test?
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No…
 
The point stands, if one is in a perfect state of being in heaven, getting a glorified body will add nothing to the experience and you’ve yet to show me how it is anything but a pointless exercise.

Unless someone can point out how anything is added by receiving these bodies…
 
Zatzat said:
The point stands, if one is in a perfect state of being in heaven, getting a glorified body will add nothing to the experience and you’ve yet to show me how it is anything but a pointless exercise.

Unless someone can point out how anything is added by receiving these bodies…
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Have you read the portion of the Summa that I linked for you?
 
kage_ar said:
If Aquinas does not give you an adequate answer, none of us can either.
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My question wasn’t addressed in the summa on resurrection. If I missed it, please someone cut and paste Aquina’s response in this thread.
 
Zatzat said:
My question wasn’t addressed in the summa on resurrection. If I missed it, please someone cut and paste Aquina’s response in this thread.
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You do not seem interested in honest discussion or answers. I will leave you with someone who wants to argue.
 
Zatzat said:
The point stands, if one is in a perfect state of being in heaven, getting a glorified body will add nothing to the experience and you’ve yet to show me how it is anything but a pointless exercise.

Unless someone can point out how anything is added by receiving these bodies…
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It seems you mistakenly believe beatitude enjoys no degrees. You fundamentally misunderstand what beatitude is, and what the Church teaches about it. The Church does not teach what you propose here.

In the resurrection, we will indeed receive joy from being reunited with our bodies, will will indeed have enjoyment in the renewed Creation God gives us. We will be in direct contact with the divine intellect. We will see things as they really are. But, we certainly retain our intellect and our will and our human nature-- they will be perfected, not removed.
 
kage_ar said:
You do not seem interested in honest discussion or answers. I will leave you with someone who wants to argue.
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Actually, what I wanted was for you to do was cut and paste the portion where Aquinas answers my question. I didn’t see it, so either I missed it or Aquinas doesn’t answer my question.
 
1ke said:
It seems you mistakenly believe beatitude enjoys no degrees. You fundamentally misunderstand what beatitude is, and what the Church teaches about it. The Church does not teach what you propose here.

In the resurrection, we will indeed receive joy from being reunited with our bodies, will will indeed have enjoyment in the renewed Creation God gives us. We will be in direct contact with the divine intellect. We will see things as they really are. But, we certainly retain our intellect and our will and our human nature-- they will be perfected, not removed.
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Thank you.

Now I understand.

Heaven won’t be as good without the bodies that the souls came from.

Once they receive their bodies, heaven will become more joyous and heaven will be even better.
 
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