Does the church REALLY teach baptism of "desire" and baptism by "blood"?

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dostoyevskyfan

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I understand that some Traditional Catholics are divided on this issue. I’m looking for arguments FOR and AGAINST. Some claim the church has never infallibly taught either. Others believe the contrary.

This came up because I asked if a Catholic convert still in RCIA, who has not yet received a water baptism, would go to hell if he/she died before officially joining the church. The answer I received was “No.” because of “baptism of desire”. But if baptism of desire is just a myth, then the prospective convert would go to hell.

Thank you for your (name removed by moderator)ut.
 
CCC 1281
Those who die for the faith, those who are catechumens, and all those who, without knowing of the Church but acting under the inspiration of grace, seek God sincerely and strive to fulfill his will, can be saved even if they have not been baptized (cf. LG 16).

LUMEN GENTIUM 16. Finally, those who have not yet received the Gospel are related in various ways to the people of God.(18*) In the first place we must recall the people to whom the testament and the promises were given and from whom Christ was born according to the flesh.(125) On account of their fathers this people remains most dear to God, for God does not repent of the gifts He makes nor of the calls He issues.(126) But the plan of salvation also includes those who acknowledge the Creator. In the first place amongst these there are the Mohammedans, who, professing to hold the faith of Abraham, along with us adore the one and merciful God, who on the last day will judge mankind. Nor is God far distant from those who in shadows and images seek the unknown God, for it is He who gives to all men life and breath and all things,(127) and as Saviour wills that all men be saved.(128) Those also can attain to salvation who through no fault of their own do not know the Gospel of Christ or His Church, yet sincerely seek God and moved by grace strive by their deeds to do His will as it is known to them through the dictates of conscience.(19*) Nor does Divine Providence deny the helps necessary for salvation to those who, without blame on their part, have not yet arrived at an explicit knowledge of God and with His grace strive to live a good life. Whatever good or truth is found amongst them is looked upon by the Church as a preparation for the Gospel.(20*) She knows that it is given by Him who enlightens all men so that they may finally have life. But often men, deceived by the Evil One, have become vain in their reasonings and have exchanged the truth of God for a lie, serving the creature rather than the Creator.(129) Or some there are who, living and dying in this world without God, are exposed to final despair. Wherefore to promote the glory of God and procure the salvation of all of these, and mindful of the command of the Lord, “Preach the Gospel to every creature”,(130) the Church fosters the missions with care and attention.
 
A dear friend of mine who happens to be a diocesan Franciscan friar in Halifax told me that I have experienced a baptism by desire. He used the phrase only just today, and he is a very orthodox person, full of heartfelt and manly solemnity; that is, he is not given to silly pronunciations and ridiculous statements of questionable theology! This Franciscan was speaking and said this to me in the presence of a Birmingham Oratorian, who certainly offered no qualms to the statement. How could two very ‘conservative’/orthodox Roman Catholics give such an explanation (of my conversion) in jest?

The real test would be whether they said it to me in front of many people, or officially. Either way, I believe an Oratorian would not be so quick to agree on something that is wrong.

Christ is said to baptise with the Spirit (whereas John did so with water) in Luke’s Gospel… well, why not? An emergency situation that resulted in the sudden death of an unbaptised catechumen would receive some dispensation from God, I believe. He is the Lord of Mercy, Truth, Justice, and the very essence of Being… I think He is more concerned with real beliefs, concrete actions, and rightful convictions than with such petty details. You never really know what Baptism truly does to the fabric of the Universe, though… 😊
 
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