Edited Title: Is Bingo in a parish immoral?

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puzzleannie said:
you are the one who is linking bingo to the scandals in the Church so I am asking for documentation of a direct link

driving the money changers from the temple has nothing whatever in any way shape or form with bingo or any other type of gambling.
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Yes, I am linking scandals with bingo, I think that bingo is a scandal, I am not however attacking the church as or the priests thereof, just the action which I see as being bad. If you have read something into what I said and are implying that I have slander the Church, then that is your thoughts which is working overtime.I think I have a very valid point and if you do not agree with it then so be it, however you have accuse me of what you are doing, that is slander. But, I also believe that if you are like luke-warm water, that is neither hot nor cold, then you will be spew out of God’s mouth. How can anyone say that bingo (a game of chance) is okay and this is a separte issue from the verse which I have quoted. It says all those not just the money changers.

Driving the money changer from the temple has everthing to do with bingo. It was not just the money changer he drove out but all of those who were engaged in selling and buying there.

I hope this clarifies my positions, statements, and thoughts.
 
Are you also objecting to the “donation” box for votive candles or the market day forms for the school or selling pancake breakfast? What about when they sell carnations in the vestibule to support unwed mothers?

Also, I think I’ve seen money change hands during the Lenten study series, like when everyone buys the bible study book that goes with that series of lectures. Our parish sells candles for your advent wreath each year, as a convenience.

That votive candle box is even in the church itself, not just on the grounds somewhere.
 
Pug said:
Are you also objecting to the “donation” box for votive candles or the market day forms for the school or selling pancake breakfast? What about when they sell carnations in the vestibule to support unwed mothers?

Also, I think I’ve seen money change hands during the Lenten study series, like when everyone buys the bible study book that goes with that series of lectures. Our parish sells candles for your advent wreath each year, as a convenience.

That votive candle box is even in the church itself, not just on the grounds somewhere.
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No. I did not post that. That sounded more like a statement then a question. Are you implying what I quoted that Jesus said. If so then you are not much of a christian, for no christian would go against Christ. You certaintly can go against my opions and I will be happy to debate them, however, if you are going against the written word of God, you are in serious trouble. But I do consider it an honor for you to attack me with your accusation.
 
donalddon5 said:
No. I did not post that. That sounded more like a statement then a question. Are you implying what I quoted that Jesus said. If so then you are not much of a christian, for no christian would go against Christ. You certaintly can go against my opions and I will be happy to debate them, however, if you are going against the written word of God, you are in serious trouble. But I do consider it an honor for you to attack me with your accusation.
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I asked if you viewed various things as falling under Jesus’ words, and you have answered “no”, I think. I wished to know what you believed. The reason I asked is because you talked of buying and selling, which caused me to think of other instances of things that could be seen as buying and selling. So I thought it was worth asking so that I understood how you interpreted “buying and selling” so that I could better understand what it was specifically that you were concerned about. That was not intended to be an accusation. The only reason I mentioned that the votive candle box was actually in the church itself was because somewhere on this thread people were mentioning that the bingo was not in the church itself, but only on church grounds, so I thought that might be relevant, given the drifts in the thread.

Why are those things (votive candles, pancakes, bible study books, flowers) not selling to you, but selling a bingo card is selling?
 
Pug said:
I asked if you viewed various things as falling under Jesus’ words, and you have answered “no”, I think. I wished to know what you believed. The reason I asked is because you talked of buying and selling, which caused me to think of other instances of things that could be seen as buying and selling. So I thought it was worth asking so that I understood how you interpreted “buying and selling” so that I could better understand what it was specifically that you were concerned about. That was not intended to be an accusation. The only reason I mentioned that the votive candle box was actually in the church itself was because somewhere on this thread people were mentioning that the bingo was not in the church itself, but only on church grounds, so I thought that might be relevant, given the drifts in the thread.

Why are those things (votive candles, pancakes, bible study books, flowers) not selling to you, but selling a bingo card is selling?
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Thankyou for clarifying that, this will be a debate after all.
My answer is simple. those things do not work on a person psyche negatively but may even help in affirming one’s belief. I am not a psychologist and can not fully explain that. However, I believe that bingo is the same as gambling and it works on a person mind to keep trying in order to win that lucky jackpott, this creates a habit which keeps a person coming back. For instance, a person in a earlier post reply something about a budweiser banner at a church function, an alcoholic who happen to be catholic see this and thus fore goes and purchase a 12 pack of budweiser without the conscious that hey the church said it is okay, therefore God said it is okay and does so. Is there a fine line in your statement, you betcha there is. And I think that point which crosses over the line between heaven and hell is at the point of instituting bingo and saying that hey it is okay because we are God’s children. God’s children are properly punish and her sins are shown to the world if they choose to not obey God for a great length of time. I think that if these parishes keep letting this trend continue then it shall be so. Even if not, I would like to adore the church as if it is(and it should be) Christ himself or Saint Mary herself. My sins are great indeed, I do not need to see it in a church which I hold on a pedlestool, It is much difficult to brag about her if she is acting as a whore (gambleling casino). which I know she is not.
 
donalddon5 said:
My answer is simple. those things do not work on a person psyche negatively but may even help in affirming one’s belief. I am not a psychologist and can not fully explain that. However, I believe that bingo is the same as gambling and it works on a person mind to keep trying in order to win that lucky jackpott, this creates a habit which keeps a person coming back.
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I understand you to be saying that you see bingo as not being spiritually good for many of the parishioners or visitors. This is a valid reason to not want bingo at the parish. We haven’t had bingo in our parish, but we do have raffles every so often. The prizes are things like dinner out with the pastor or a basket of soap or a toy for children, etc. I’ve participated in these sorts of raffles. Often, if the wrong person wins the prize, they quietly give it to someone who can use the prize. I haven’t noticed this to cause a harm to people. It seems to be used as a way to solicit donations from businesses (they donate the soap or the toy) and to get parishioners to socialize a bit.

But bingo can get intense, playing many cards, roaming from bingo hall to bingo hall, losing entire paychecks. Myself, I detest bingo as it seems to be run in some places. I used to know a bingo addict. It did give her a circle of friends, but, at what cost to her? Maybe that is just my mind being small, though. I don’t like intensive gambling as a concept. It seems to cause human misery. I acknowledge, though, that this is my opinion. To be clear, the Church does not condemn wagering in itself. It becomes a sin in certain conditions.

I also see that the presence of bingo could be an impediment for some who might wish to become Catholic. I grew up Methodist…
 
As a Christian, albeit a protestant one, I always felt it was unseemly to gamble on church premises. I always hate to see those signs up. Somehow, it just doesn’t seem right. My church, a small one, has various fund raisers during the year-car washes, bake sales, and the like. If they started bingo or any other kind of gambling, I would leave and find another church. Its just that simple…
 
Pug said:
I understand you to be saying that you see bingo as not being spiritually good for many of the parishioners or visitors. This is a valid reason to not want bingo at the parish. We haven’t had bingo in our parish, but we do have raffles every so often. The prizes are things like dinner out with the pastor or a basket of soap or a toy for children, etc. I’ve participated in these sorts of raffles. Often, if the wrong person wins the prize, they quietly give it to someone who can use the prize. I haven’t noticed this to cause a harm to people. It seems to be used as a way to solicit donations from businesses (they donate the soap or the toy) and to get parishioners to socialize a bit.

But bingo can get intense, playing many cards, roaming from bingo hall to bingo hall, losing entire paychecks. Myself, I detest bingo as it seems to be run in some places. I used to know a bingo addict. It did give her a circle of friends, but, at what cost to her? Maybe that is just my mind being small, though. I don’t like intensive gambling as a concept. It seems to cause human misery. I acknowledge, though, that this is my opinion. To be clear, the Church does not condemn wagering in itself. It becomes a sin in certain conditions.

I also see that the presence of bingo could be an impediment for some who might wish to become Catholic. I grew up Methodist…
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I have been to a few raffle’s myself as a youngster and see it as a valid fund raiser for a particular political party. As far as having to get a ticket in order to get a priest to come to your home. Well that would seem an insult to me. I much prefer you to ask: and if my congregation was so large as too make it unreasonable for you to see it as a possibility then I certaintly would hope that you would consider it an honor to have a Deacon in your present. I sure was honor to know a particular deacon that spent his spare time caring for the elderly in old folks home. His name is Deacon Earl and I certaintly would be much honor if you honor him in replace of me, if that was the condition. As far as businesess are concerned, if that is the best they can do for your church then the hell with them. I can not see anyone playing the church for a sucker which is implied here. If they do not want to give it thier all then encourange them to give it to a charity of there choose, even if it is not Roman Catholic…For all good things are of God… As far as socialization, well I think that a lot of Catholic Saints(especailly during the early years) wanted to be a hermit, encourage your congregation to do the same and maybe they will not be seeking the world approval. Prayer will be much rewarded in this case than action. Just my opion.
 
roanoker said:
As a Christian, albeit a protestant one, I always felt it was unseemly to gamble on church premises. I always hate to see those signs up. Somehow, it just doesn’t seem right. My church, a small one, has various fund raisers during the year-car washes, bake sales, and the like. If they started bingo or any other kind of gambling, I would leave and find another church. Its just that simple…
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YES, I agree with you on the unseemly part, just not the find another church part. I can argue and fight all I want but I can not denied my experiences or visions when it comes to the proper church which is entitle the “Kingdom of God”. If I am slander and hated here then so be it. I was shown the way and shall stay. God Bless You, my enemy.
 
donalddon5 said:
As far as having to get a ticket in order to get a priest to come to your home. Well that would seem an insult to me.
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I understand. I think you misunderstood. It was for the priest to take you out to dinner at a steakhouse. He chose to donate that as one of the prizes for that particular raffle - going out to eat (not having to cook). Our priest will come to dinner at your house if you invite him. No ticket is needed for that. The deacon could be invited as well, though he is married, so I assume it would be polite to ask his wife as well.

I don’t think everyone is called to be a hermit. Married life is a good thing. Married people are not hermits. So not everyone is called to be a hermit.
 
…Frankly I consider gambling to be in the same class as smoking…better to stand by an open blazing fireplace and inhale then smoke cigerettes etc…Just because gambling is not in the good book by name doesnt make it fair…gambling has always been encouraged to the poor working class by the rulling class…for it subjugates the poor even more. I never played for money as a kid nor smoked…thought they both were …well…not right! As poor kids we used to play using bottle caps found in the streets…no one was hurt…spending money on horses,numbers,sports events is not Christian nor intelligent in my humble opinion!..as PT Barnum used to smirk and murmur…'theirs one born every minute" (huh,bet I will get shot down for that one…tick tick tick…)
 
Pug said:
I understand. I think you misunderstood. It was for the priest to take you out to dinner at a steakhouse. He chose to donate that as one of the prizes for that particular raffle - going out to eat (not having to cook). Our priest will come to dinner at your house if you invite him. No ticket is needed for that. The deacon could be invited as well, though he is married, so I assume it would be polite to ask his wife as well.

I don’t think everyone is called to be a hermit. Married life is a good thing. Married people are not hermits. So not everyone is called to be a hermit.
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Okay, fine And yes I agree that would be polite to ask the deacon’s wife as well(after all they are one).

I agree not everyone is called to be a hermit, I meant that as a jest in my argument(such as: listen to the silence and you will hear the voice of God(Carmel comes to mind)), I find it hard to just be quiet most of the time as you can probably can tell by my threads.
But married; you go to far my friend!!!
 
Nino said:
…Frankly I consider gambling to be in the same class as smoking…better to stand by an open blazing fireplace and inhale then smoke cigerettes etc…Just because gambling is not in the good book by name doesnt make it fair…gambling has always been encouraged to the poor working class by the rulling class…for it subjugates the poor even more. I never played for money as a kid nor smoked…thought they both were …well…not right! As poor kids we used to play using bottle caps found in the streets…no one was hurt…spending money on horses,numbers,sports events is not Christian nor intelligent in my humble opinion!..as PT Barnum used to smirk and murmur…'theirs one born every minute" (huh,bet I will get shot down for that one…tick tick tick…)
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I can not disagree with most of you statements that is for sure, but I have played for money as a kid and smoked like a chimney, and perhaps that is how I end up drinking too much as an adult. Who knows?
 
This is my final argument. Is it okay to play bingo at a parish, just because the Church Authority has allow or at least does not protest.
My thoughts are the following: It is like divorces, although sometimes given (Matthew 19:8) it is not allowed in God’s eye but Moses did allow it. Even thou 1 corinthians 7:10, 11 restore the original law some parts of the church still allow for divorce and some people still will say that Moses allowed it and use this as justification. It is not justified, the individual is just doing as he pleases, instead of suffering as Christ suffer in complete obidence to the Father.
If you wish to give money to the church then by all means do it in love. If the church has to reward your psyche for it through addiction, then it is not given in love but attain through trickery.I am not even a Roman Catholic and I give money to various Catholic organizations out of total love for that organization and do not expect nothing in return, although, I do hope for prayer. How much more should you give as a Roman Catholic, if you need bingo, then I am sorry but you would seem to me as not loving the Church but using her for your own personal pleasure. Instead of pleasing God, you have chosen self pleasure.

Here is an interesting article you can read from a Finacial section: finance.yahoo.com/focus-retirement/article/103862/Inside-the-Mind-of-the-Older-Investor?mod=retirement-post-spending

As in abortion, Yes, you have choice just like Adam and Eve did, but woe to the one
who makes a wrong decision.
 
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