Eliminating Birth Defects

[taylorc]

I’ve heard a lot of people say that the desire to eliminate birth defects like Down Syndrome through abortion. I wondered if abortion was the only aspect of this that makes people who advocate for those with birth defects upset. If it was discovered that taking a vitamin like folic acid before conception could reduce the chance of DS for example by 99.9% would they be opposed to that also? Would they consider it eugenics for doctors to encourage all fertile women to take the vitamins?

 

[surritter]

I’m not quite clear on the question, but I can say that folks who want to eliminate birth defects by doing abortions aren’t doing squat to fight birth defects! They are fighting births, period. Their perspective is quite skewed, because the defect is already in the baby in the womb. All they get is a skewed statistic on defects per live births – one that is replaced by another statistic in the tragic abortion column.

 

[ljubim]

I’ve heard a lot of people say that the desire to eliminate birth defects like Down Syndrome through abortion. I wondered if abortion was the only aspect of this that makes people who advocate for those with birth defects upset. If it was discovered that taking a vitamin like folic acid before conception could reduce the chance of DS for example by 99.9% would they be opposed to that also? Would they consider it eugenics for doctors to encourage all fertile women to take the vitamins?

That’s ridiculous. Killing the baby is so much different than giving him vitamins. Come on

 

[surritter]

Now I get the question. It’s akin to saying: to solve your headache problem, I could decapitate you, or give you an aspirin. Geeeeesh.

 

[taylorc]

That’s ridiculous. Killing the baby is so much different than giving him vitamins. Come on

I agree, but for the pro-choice people who are repulsed that 90% of Down Syndrome fetuses are aborted after diagnosis it must be relevant. They don’t have a problem with abortion, just the abortion of 90% of the community. They don’t want to see down syndrome disappear. If we find out that taking vitamin b 12 pre-conception could prevent down syndrome at conception with near 100% success, would anyone be oppossed to encouraging all women of childbearing to take it. I take Folic acid already because I think reducing the chance of my child having a birth defect is a good thing.

 

[surritter]

Can you supply a quote or statistic about this? I thought the whole pro-choice movement was about the “choice” of a woman. So if she chooses to abort her baby because of Down’s or because of an already-large family, or for any frivolous reason, then those folks should stand up for her right to choose, yes?

I’m not doubting you – it would be a sign of some semblance of a heart.

 

[kage_ar]

Can you supply a quote or statistic about this? I thought the whole pro-choice movement was about the “choice” of a woman. So if she chooses to abort her baby because of Down’s or because of an already-large family, or for any frivolous reason, then those folks should stand up for her right to choose, yes?

I’m not doubting you – it would be a sign of some semblance of a heart.

I would also love to see the source for that stat.

From my experience, genetic abnormality or disability is one of the favorite reasons the pro-abortion people tout as reason to abort - from cleft palate to dwarfism to downs, they don’t want the world to be burdened with us undesireables.

 

[taylorc]

Can you supply a quote or statistic about this? I thought the whole pro-choice movement was about the “choice” of a woman. So if she chooses to abort her baby because of Down’s or because of an already-large family, or for any frivolous reason, then those folks should stand up for her right to choose, yes?

I’m not doubting you – it would be a sign of some semblance of a heart.

It’s not about statistics. I have no idea what percentage of the pro-choice crowd is against terminating downs pregnancy, but recently there has been a flood of media articles about the high rate of terminations for DS(I think the one I read was in the Weekly Standard). In most of them, there are people who say they are totally pro-choice(usually parents of DS children or people who work for a DS organization) but are sad about the 90% abortion rate because DS is an important part of society and they would hate to see it dissappear. Since they don’t have a problem with abortion, I take it they have a problem with elimating birth defects from society. I wonder what they would think if something as simple as a vitamin could prevent DS.

 

[apricot_yogurt]

No problem with taking folic acid, as it can cut down the risk of neural tube defects. Not sure how it could help Down’s syndrome, as that is a chromosonal “abnormality”.
I have a son with Down’s.He doesn’t need curing. What needs curing is the mindset that certain people are less valuable than others.

 

[taylorc]

No problem with taking folic acid, as it can cut down the risk of neural tube defects. Not sure how it could help Down’s syndrome, as that is a chromosonal “abnormality”.
I have a son with Down’s.He doesn’t need curing. What needs curing is the mindset that certain people are less valuable than others.

It doesn’t cure DS. It can prevent it before conception:
news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/health/2955409.stm

But what if they discovered that another vitamin could prevent it before conception 99.9% of the time. Would the people who don’t have a problem with abortion, but the fact that it reduces births with DS also have a problem with encouraging women of child bearing age of taking the vitamin?

 

[ljubim]

Ok, so you’re saying, would people who like abortion (but not the abortion of everybody), support the mom taking vitamins to help have a healthy baby?

I would think in idea yes… but the only think abortion advocates advocate is, well, abortion. They really couldn’t care less about anything else, no matter what they say, they won’t act on it.

I (pro-lifer) definitely support the mom taking vitamins to help her baby. A lot of conditions come naturally, but so many are preventable. Just like the mom should stop drinking and smoking, she should take the next step to make the womb healthier for her baby.

If you’re talking about some kind of program to promote the vitamins… I’d bet money that it would never go through. Nobody wants to acknowledge that the baby is a baby. What nut-cases. Just look at the deaths at Ft Hood, the guy isn’t being charged with murder of the baby too. So much for justice, they’re just scared to death of setting a precendent. Oh please

 

[DOShea]

Just look at the deaths at Ft Hood, the guy isn’t being charged with murder of the baby too. So much for justice, they’re just scared to death of setting a precendent.

Sorry, this is off-topic, but to correct a misunderstanding.

It’s not that the authorities aren’t charging the Ft. Hood suspect with the death of the unborn baby, they cannot charge him. He is being tried under the Uniform Code of Military Justice, which, under a President Bush Executive Order, could file such a charge. But that Exec. Order is no longer in effect.

Please see this topic for an explanation.

 

[St_Francis]

I’ve heard a lot of people say that the desire to eliminate birth defects like Down Syndrome through abortion. I wondered if abortion was the only aspect of this that makes people who advocate for those with birth defects upset. If it was discovered that taking a vitamin like folic acid before conception could reduce the chance of DS for example by 99.9% would they be opposed to that also? Would they consider it eugenics for doctors to encourage all fertile women to take the vitamins?

I should think that if DS could be eliminated by the taking of vitamins before conception, that people would be for that. The argument of those who believe that people with DS should not be aborted is that DS people do contribute to society, just in a different way, so should not be aborted *just because *they have the chromosomal abnormality. (Of course, pro-lifers believe that no one should be aborted, but you have brought in two groups of people who are against abortion of DS babies, so it’s a little confusing.)

I do not think that anyone would discourage taking vitamins to reduce the possibility of their child’s having DS.

 

[crazzeto]

Abortion doesn’t eliminate birth defects, it kills babies.

 

[surritter]

Abortion doesn’t eliminate birth defects, it kills babies.

That’s right – but in the warped mind of the pro-choice crowd, abortion can be “good” because it makes the statistics recorded about birth defects look better.

 

[beafedor]

I’ve heard a lot of people say that the desire to eliminate birth defects like Down Syndrome through abortion. I wondered if abortion was the only aspect of this that makes people who advocate for those with birth defects upset. If it was discovered that taking a vitamin like folic acid before conception could reduce the chance of DS for example by 99.9% would they be opposed to that also? Would they consider it eugenics for doctors to encourage all fertile women to take the vitamins?

First of all, I have a problem with the expression “birth defects”. Birth is one event in our life, a ‘defect’ such as DS is present from conception and can’t be cured. As Crazetto rightly said, abortion doesn’t cure, it kills a baby human. Now taking vitamins, yes of course let’s encourage women to do so. And also exercise, eat healthier and rest as much as possible, in other words taking care of themselves. Not that it would prevent a genetic disorder but it would bring the focus on having a healthy pregnancy and bringing it to term instead of focusing on the baby’s “defects” . Nurturing life instead of destroying it. And it does help with labor and delivery.

Obstetricians do advocate prenatal vitamins but they want women to use a certain brand because they have a contract with the lab I guess. So they give us samples and a prescription. A lot of women don’t use them because they are so expensive and are not covered by their insurance company. Prenatal vitamins with folic acid, vitamin D and calcium… are all available over the counter in all pharmacies, store brand. Prenatal vitamins with folic acid store brand= 20 bucks for 300 caplets versus the very expensive prescription ones not covered by your insurance that your doc wants you to buy. Plus the pharmacies often have a buy one get one free sale on these products.

 

[nordskoven]

reuters.com/article/healthNews/idUSTRE5A153120091103

Macrobid and Bactrim are implicated in birth defects. Sulfonamide and Nitrofurantoin antibiotics are easily replaced by other antibiotics with no link to birth defects. Check with your doctor.

 

[bgic]

No problem with taking folic acid, as it can cut down the risk of neural tube defects. Not sure how it could help Down’s syndrome, as that is a chromosonal “abnormality”.
I have a son with Down’s.He doesn’t need curing. What needs curing is the mindset that certain people are less valuable than others.

I am the parent of a child with Down syndrome as well.

 

[Bluegoat]

I am not sure about the original question. I have never heard of anyone that does not advocate things like reccomending folic acid to women. It is in fact reccomended to women of childbearing age routinly, even if they don’t plan to become pregnant.

I don’t know about the US, but here common foods like flour are routinly fortified with folic acid, just like salk is routinly iodized. People take this quite seriously.

I think the reasons stats for abortion of DS babies are going up is complex, and not really all about pro-choice vs pro-life. Part of it is that tests for DS are more readily available. As well, it used to be that they were only recommended to higher risk people. But because numerous people have sued doctors after having a DS baby and not being offered the tests, they tend to be offered to all. If it isn’t, the insurance company will not support the doctor, and esp in the US, the insurance companies are the ones who really decide health policy, based on money issues.

As well, I think there is a psychological issue. In my province, the recommendation for receiving the genetic testing has recently changed, so that there is a positive recommendation that all get it. (Before, it was available but only recommended for specific situations.) It tests only for DS and spina bifida and related problems.

But most people do not know much about any of these, and they rather assume that if they are being told it is best to test for them, they must be really terrible. And of course many do the testing simply because it is recommended, like many other prenatal procedures. Then they are left with the results and must figure out what to do with them.

So it feeds off itself - because it is recommended (based on monetary/legal considerations), people assume it is important and necessary. Tfey become more and more afraid of not getting the tests, or what to do about them. And knowledge of the real meaning of these disorders becomes less and less because it is seen less and less.

 

[estesbob]

I’ve heard a lot of people say that the desire to eliminate birth defects like Down Syndrome through abortion. I wondered if abortion was the only aspect of this that makes people who advocate for those with birth defects upset. If it was discovered that taking a vitamin like folic acid before conception could reduce the chance of DS for example by 99.9% would they be opposed to that also? Would they consider it eugenics for doctors to encourage all fertile women to take the vitamins?

They are not eliminating birht defects-they are elminating people who have birth defects.