Evangelical (Gospel) Poverty

[mtr01]

In my next step towards spiritual growth, I’ve decided that it’s time for me to make a serious commitment to living the Gospels, especially as it relates to poverty. Growing up in the present era (Especially the “me” decade of the 80’s) this was a topic that I had a vague (to say the least) understanding of. After all, it is contrary to the message promoted non-stop in our secular world (that we can judge our hapiness and success by our material possessions and our “being on top”). I decided to start this thread as a discussion on the topic, and to see how many others have embraced the Gospel notion of poverty.

In order to help my understanding and progress I found a remarkable little book by Fr. Thomas Dubay titled “Happy Are You Poor”. In it he makes some very interesting points that I thought I’d relate here to see what everyone thought (also because it brought to mind some of the “interesting” responses I remembered from an old poll on this forum asking whether or not the US was a greedy nation). Anyhow, this is what Fr. Dubay has to say…

…Any branch of study abounds in marvels. Surrounding us on all sides, they may serve to underscore our poverty problems: Can we rightly give up the slendors of creation? Is it right to be poor when the message of the universe, and therefore presumably of its Author, is wealth? Who are we to be skimpy when he is bountiful? Why limit our use of his handiwork when he places almost no boundaries to what he has made for our admiration and delight? Why be a petty, small, negativistic ascetic when creation itself proclaims the grand, the great, the munificent, the delightful? One may be inclined to give a pat answer to these questions, namely, that the negative and the ascetic are indeed narrow. Self-denial may be seen as well-intentioned, but as unhealthy nontheless.

Not so. There are men and women who cannot, or at least do not, get themselves to think seriously and at some length about Gospel poverty because they choos to consider God as comfortable and pleasant, not awesome and just and meaning exactly what he says. These people choose – it is a choice, not a necessity – to look upon the beauties of nature and the overall “goodness of people” and then to conclude that the “woe to the rich” and " how happy are you poor ones" (Lk 6:24, 20) cannot be taken without major qualifications that strip them of their message. After all, they reason, there are many respectable, honest, rich families in good standing in the Church. What can be so dangerous about wealth? Furthermore, pleasures are good. God made them. Why all the blood and thunder about enjoying the benefits of one’s hard work, benefits implanted in God’s own handiwork? A book poverty must be onesided.

These people, thinking of religion only in terms of benevolence and harmony, cannot bring themselves to reflect on the God of supreme holiness and justice. God is always the God of heaven, never of hell. They argue that

we need not alarm ourselves, – that God is a merciful God, – that amendment is quite sufficient to atone for our offenses, – that though we have been irregular in our youth, yet that it is a thing gone by, – that we forget it, and therefore God forgets it, – that the world is, on the whole, very well-disposed toward religion, – that we should avoid enthusiasm, – that we should not be over serious, – that we should have large views on human nature, – and that we should love all men. This is indeed the creed of shallow men in every age.

John Henry Newman, *Parochial and Plain Sermons, *I, sermon 24

cont’d…

 

[mtr01]

…cont’d

Fr. Dubay than goes on to list the premises behind his treatment concerning Gospel poverty, based on revealed Truth.

Premise 1: Our destiny is literally out of this world. Eye has not seen, not ear heard; indeed, it cannot even dawn on our unaided imaginiation the unspeakable delight God has prepared for those who love him (I Cor 2:9). Nothing, absolutely nothing on the face of the earth compares with the advanced possession of God in deep prayer.

*Premise 2: *Happiness is found not in eating and drinking this or that but in personal goodness and in the peace and joy given by the Holy Spirit (Rom 14:17). We are to rejoice in the Lord always, not simply occasionally (Phil 4:4). The New Testament assumes that happiness is found not in things but in persons, and especially the Divine Persons.

*Premise 3: *We are to be head over heels in love for God. We are to be so in love that we sing to Him in our hearts always and everywhere (Eph 5:19-20). Every fiber of our being, heart, soul and mind is to become wholly love (Lk 10:27). People in love are not much concerned with things. A consumerist is not in love.

*Premise 4: *Asceticism. A genteel, soft, comfortable existence is foreign to the New Testament, because for wounded men and women it is foreign to being in love. Only those can love sincerely who are entirely purified by the word, detached from things less than God (I Pet 1:22-23). Only on condition that we crucify all self-indulgent desires can we belong to Christ Jesus (Gal 5:24). They who want no part of asceticism want no part of love.

*Premise 5: *No one can serve God and Mammon (Lk 16:13). We must make a choice, and the choice cannot be fence-straddling. The pharisees laughed at this (Lk 16:14), but they have never been noted for authenticity. The Gospel offers no comfort to those who wish to keep a foot in each of the two worlds.

*Premise 6: *Totality of pursuit. Nowhere in Scripture are we asked for much or most or quite a bit. Always it is everything. The God of revelation is never a God of fractions. It is not enough to love him with 95% of our heart, not enough to be detached from major obstacles, not enough to be merely cordial and helpful in community, not enough to be regular in prayer. No, we are to love with a whole heart, to be detached from all we possess, to enjoy a communal unity, to pray always (Mt 22:37; Lk 14:33; Jn 17:23; Lk 18:1). Biblical men and women were by no means half hearted or lukewarm.

*Premise 7: *A consuming concern for the Kingdom (Jn 4:34). Things are not the main business of life. They are means, only means. [Jesus and those who first wrote about him] tried to raise our minds from the things of the earth to those of heaven (Col 3:1-2).

*Premise 8: *We are all strangers on earth. We are nomads, pilgrims in search of our real fatherland in heaven (Heb 11:13-16). We entered the world with nothing, and we will leave it with nothing; we are therefore content with mere necessities (I Tim 6:7-8). We do not think the things of the earth important (Phil 3:19), but we await the resurrection in which we will see the value of our bodies transfigured after the manner of the risen Jesus (Phil 3:20-21).

*Premise 9: *We are brothers and sisters to our fellow pilgrims, and we spontaneously, unquestioningly share good things with them. Saint James calls dead a faith that does not share its possessions (Jas 2:14-17).

*Premise 10: *Understanding Gospel poverty perfectly requires a perfect conversion, a 180-degree switch from worldliness. One reason that it is easier for a camel to pass through the eye of a needle than it is for a rich man to enter heaven is that the latter is blinded by his clingings. Saint Paul tells the Romans (12:2) that the only way to know the perfect will of God is to undergo conversion from a worldly outlook. The sensual person cannot understand the things of the Spirit; it is nonsense to him (I Cor 2:14).

cont’d…

 

[mtr01]

…cont’d

So what do you all think? Are there others here who are trying to live the Gospel Idea of poverty? Do you accept the above premises? How has the practice of Gospel poverty enhanced your spiritual life?

For those who don’t accept them, why not? What specifically is your outlook concerning the Gospel view of poverty? What would you change?

I’m very interested in hearing what others have to say about all this. For me, it seems a little “revolutionary” as it is, as Fr. Dubay mentions, a 180-degree shift from the outlook of the world today. However, I do accept the premises laid out above and will begin the hard road of enacting the “180-degree” conversion.

 

[mercygate]

This may seem infantile to you but a good place to start is simply by cleaning out your cellar, attic, garage, and closets. Be a little ruthless.

The Confraternity of Penitents formation program in the third-year Novitiate takes you in stages through your closets: eliminating items month-by-month until you really are stripped down to the minimum suitable for your condition of life. That dress code excludes all colors except black, white, earth colors (bone, beige, greys, browns) and blue (for Our Lady). It’s a start.

 

[DaveBj]

There’s always been one problem with the “spirit of poverty”–**somebody ** has to make the money needed for the Church to finance the good works that it is supposed to do. And it takes money (capital investment) to make money. If people give everything away (like they did in Jerusalem in the early years of the Church), then they wind up living off the charity of others (like decades later, when Paul was still having to take up collections to take for the poor in Jerusalem).

DaveBj

 

[springbreeze]

Dear Mtr

I had a good job with a large income. I left that job to raise my daughter and in doing that I realised just how little we need and that what we do possess will not bring happiness nor peace. Only peace and happiness can be found in Christ Jesus, this world holds no rest or peace for the human spirit, unless it is in the Lord.

So then I started to clear out my things and give them away. I took out all of my clothes and shoes that I didn’t need and gave them away. I gave away as much as possible and what I am left with is what is necessary.

Since I have done this, if something breaks I find that that item is given me by someone I know or someone who knows someone I know. Either that or I’ll find the item in the second hand stores or jumble sales I am involved with. God always provides and I have learnt to trust in His Providence to give to me what is needed.

There is no possession on earth that will not place shackles upon me. Once you acquire things in life they begin to bind you and life becomes a striving to aquire more and more. I am glad to be free of that vicious cycle.

I am poor, but that is relative to my country, in world terms I am still rich and therefore should give to those less fortunate than myself. Whatever I have I am willing to share and that is what is key. Not just possessions, but people must not be mean with themsleves or with their time. If I have lots of time then I should give of that time to help others who have less time, who may need my help or my talents.

Christian poverty to me is a reducing to simplicity whereby the soul is free of the shackles of worldly materialism and by Christ Jesus a soul is then able to lose and not grieve for it, to gain and be thankful for it and to share what is gained. To own is to be a prisoner and to be a prisoner of the world is as far from Christ Jesus as a soul can get.

Once a soul is free of all this ‘clutter’ it can then raise itself to God with no other thoughts in mind and heart but that of the spiritual and of love.

God Bless you and much love and peace to you

Teresa

 

[JKirkLVNV]

In the same vein, is it wrong to collect things? I collect old “Catholicana,” antique Catholic stuff, esp. crucifixes. I love the image of Christ crucified, as it is a depiction of the most loving Act in or out of Time and History. I love to see how different cultures visually interpret that in their art. I have, like 50, and sometimes I look at them and I feel fortunate to have them and at other times I look at them and think, “ya know, I could sell these and give the money to the Church and that might be more pleasing to God.”

 

[mtr01]

DaveBj:

There’s always been one problem with the “spirit of poverty”–**somebody **has to make the money needed for the Church to finance the good works that it is supposed to do. And it takes money (capital investment) to make money. If people give everything away (like they did in Jerusalem in the early years of the Church), then they wind up living off the charity of others (like decades later, when Paul was still having to take up collections to take for the poor in Jerusalem).

DaveBj

Actually you see this type of thing over and over again in the lives of the Saints. However, this is not exactly what I was talking about. The idea behind Gospel poverty is more of a “sparing - sharing” lifestyle. The idea is to be content with the basic necessities of life and to share our superfluidities. It’s not destitution. In other words, when one recognizes the poverty in 3rd and 4th world countries as a tragedies, but still sits back comfortably snacking on junk food, watching their big-screen TV home theater, and with a closet full of the most stylish clothes, (half of which aren’t worn), what exactly are we saying by our actions. If we a truly to love our brothers and sisters as ourselves, we should genuinely want them to share in the good things we have. If not, where do our loyalties really lie, in heaven or on earth?

One way to think of it is this: If we as Christians are supposed to be witnesses for Christ in the world, are we living a lifestyle that our Lord himself would not have any part of? If we are, it stands to reason that we should probably change our ways of thinking about things.

 

[mtr01]

springbreeze:

Christian poverty to me is a reducing to simplicity whereby the soul is free of the shackles of worldly materialism and by Christ Jesus a soul is then able to lose and not grieve for it, to gain and be thankful for it and to share what is gained. To own is to be a prisoner and to be a prisoner of the world is as far from Christ Jesus as a soul can get.

Once a soul is free of all this ‘clutter’ it can then raise itself to God with no other thoughts in mind and heart but that of the spiritual and of love.

God Bless you and much love and peace to you

Teresa

Teresa, once again a post of yours has cut right to my heart. You are a living witness to the exact type of lifestyle that I was trying to describe, and am attempting to live.

My mind and soul have been clouded for a long time, and I finally feel that by our Lord’s grace, I have been able to recognize the truth in the Gospel message, as described in your post. Thank you so much for your witness!

 

[puzzleannie]

Everybody in favor of Teresa setting up her own blog to share her unique and beautiful insights, vote here now. Have you noticed her replies are always brief, to the point, from the heart, authentic and never fail to touch you. She never rambles on with her own opinions, never judges. she must have 1 corinthians 13 very close to her heart.

 

[puzzleannie]

mtr01:

In my next step towards spiritual growth, I’ve decided that it’s time for me to make a serious commitment to living the Gospels, especially as it relates to poverty. cont’d…

you can’t go wrong with any of Fr Dubay’s books, but one thing he counsels about, in Authenticity, Seeking Spiritual Direction, and other works on spirituality is assuming for yourself a strict mortification or discipline without the guidance and permission of a your spiritual director, because it can cause more harm than good.

 

[mtr01]

JKirkLVNV:

In the same vein, is it wrong to collect things? I collect old “Catholicana,” antique Catholic stuff, esp. crucifixes. I love the image of Christ crucified, as it is a depiction of the most loving Act in or out of Time and History. I love to see how different cultures visually interpret that in their art. I have, like 50, and sometimes I look at them and I feel fortunate to have them and at other times I look at them and think, “ya know, I could sell these and give the money to the Church and that might be more pleasing to God.”

I suspect that the last sentence of your post might truly be the answer for you. If this is an issue you are concerned about, I would approach the Lord in prayer about it.

I am struggling with many of these same issues right now, and I’m attempting to address them prayerfully. My initial reaction has to do with your attachment to the items in your collection. For example, if someone you knew needed on of these items more than you (for whatever reason) would you have any reservations in giving it to that person? Going back to your last sentence, would you be willing to sell part or all of your collection to help someone in need? If not, then you probably have an unhealthy attachment.

I have also been made aware of several Vatican statements that instruct the faithfull to not only give to the less priveledged not only out of our superfluidity, but also out of our need. One way to think about this is in relation to the Tsunami tragedy. I think it’s safe to say that the vast majority of us here have given what we could “afford to give”. I put that in quotes, because I think that it means to almost every one of us “what we could afford and not give up our comfortable lifestyle or luxuries”. To put it into perspective, how many gave up eating out at restaurants for a week, or even fasted and then gave what we would have spent? How many cancelled that shopping trip to the mall in order to give what we would have spent? How many actually sold something that wasn’t a necessity in order to give aid?

These are all issues that I am currently struggling with, as I see how selfish I really am with many of the things I have. After all they are really just things – means to an end, not an end in and of themselves. The problem is, if we make ends out of means, then we really are of this world and serving mammon. As for me, I am doing my best to try to serve no one but our Lord.

 

[mtr01]

puzzleannie:

you can’t go wrong with any of Fr Dubay’s books, but one thing he counsels about, in Authenticity, Seeking Spiritual Direction, and other works on spirituality is assuming for yourself a strict mortification or discipline without the guidance and permission of a your spiritual director, because it can cause more harm than good.

Thank you for reminding me of this important point, Annie. Right now I am discerning what the idea of Gospel poverty means for my life (I think it’s different for everyone). Spiritual direction must play a large part in this process.

 

[JKirkLVNV]

mtr01:

I suspect that the last sentence of your post might truly be the answer for you. If this is an issue you are concerned about, I would approach the Lord in prayer about it.

I am struggling with many of these same issues right now, and I’m attempting to address them prayerfully. My initial reaction has to do with your attachment to the items in your collection. For example, if someone you knew needed on of these items more than you (for whatever reason) would you have any reservations in giving it to that person? Going back to your last sentence, would you be willing to sell part or all of your collection to help someone in need? If not, then you probably have an unhealthy attachment.

I have also been made aware of several Vatican statements that instruct the faithfull to not only give to the less priveledged not only out of our superfluidity, but also out of our need. One way to think about this is in relation to the Tsunami tragedy. I think it’s safe to say that the vast majority of us here have given what we could “afford to give”. I put that in quotes, because I think that it means to almost every one of us “what we could afford and not give up our comfortable lifestyle or luxuries”. To put it into perspective, how many gave up eating out at restaurants for a week, or even fasted and then gave what we would have spent? How many cancelled that shopping trip to the mall in order to give what we would have spent? How many actually sold something that wasn’t a necessity in order to give aid?

These are all issues that I am currently struggling with, as I see how selfish I really am with many of the things I have. After all they are really just things – means to an end, not an end in and of themselves. The problem is, if we make ends out of means, then we really are of this world and serving mammon. As for me, I am doing my best to try to serve no one but our Lord.

Yes, I can honestly say that if someone needed my crosses more than I did, I would give one or all of them up. I would sell them if someone needed help and that was the only way I could help. One of my heroes is the Bishop in Les Miserables. I’m talking about just owning them, having things. I can help the poor while I have those, I don’t have them instead of helping the poor. I’m asking about the propriety before God of just having stuff, I guess is what I’m trying to say.

 

[mtr01]

JKirkLVNV:

Yes, I can honestly say that if someone needed my crosses more than I did, I would give one or all of them up. I would sell them if someone needed help and that was the only way I could help. One of my heroes is the Bishop in Les Miserables. I’m talking about just owning them, having things. I can help the poor while I have those, I don’t have them instead of helping the poor. I’m asking about the propriety before God of just having stuff, I guess is what I’m trying to say.

My guess, and that’s really all it is right now, is that as long as they are means to an end (bringing you closer to God), and not ends in and of themselves, then there’s nothing wrong with having them.