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theresaavey
Guest
Why does the evil one have control over things? And why didn’t God revoke power given to him when he was an angel?
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lily20
Guest
I think it’s a test, for us, the battle of good and evil. We have a choice always, do we choose good or evil?
Yeah, why would a loving God let Satan into the world? I don’t know, but I’m trying to stay very far away from his snare. The more I pray, the more snares I see and it’s quite overwhelming. Our culture is so burdened with sinful, acceptable behaviors. I only wish we lived in more pure times, so that being good would be easier.
Lily
Yeah, why would a loving God let Satan into the world? I don’t know, but I’m trying to stay very far away from his snare. The more I pray, the more snares I see and it’s quite overwhelming. Our culture is so burdened with sinful, acceptable behaviors. I only wish we lived in more pure times, so that being good would be easier.
Lily
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Nick1022
Guest
The evil one, satan, the devil, is an angel. A fallen angel. Angels were created by God as pure spirits and given a free will out of love. They are pure spirit and have no body but definitely have the ability to accept or reject God in freedom. The way I heard it explained (I am no theologian) was that the devil decided definitively against serving God when he heard of the plan of creation and that God was going to make a being (Man) that could serve him in body and soul and image His love with its’ bodies. In other words, put simply, it was jealousy and pride that caused the devil to decide against serving God definitively. The talk I heard also said that when an angel makes a decision, it is (more) definite than a mortal because they have a greater intelligence and knowledge of these realities.
The question then becomes, why would God allow angels to choose against him and fall. Well I dunno… I am not God…We probably can never answer this question until we meet him face to face we pray. Love can only exist in freedom and truth. I guess God loves us enough to allow us (and the Angels) to enslave ourselves by our own free choice. My understanding is that the choice of a an angel (a pure spirit) is a much more binding and definitive than the choices we make as humans.
I think your question points to a reality that both angels and humans are beings that were created and will live on for eternity. God will not simply un-create us. Why does God allow the immoral humans to continue using their gifts in the world? I think the answer to this question is the same answer to the question of why God doesn’t revoke the power that was given to Satan when he was created as an angel. Also, the powers of an angel are not bodily but spiritual so they probably don’t diminish over time like our bodily powers (muscles, brain memory, etc.).
Great Question… the more I write the more I realize I don’t know the answer!
Thanks, Nick
weightofthewood.blogspot.com
The question then becomes, why would God allow angels to choose against him and fall. Well I dunno… I am not God…We probably can never answer this question until we meet him face to face we pray. Love can only exist in freedom and truth. I guess God loves us enough to allow us (and the Angels) to enslave ourselves by our own free choice. My understanding is that the choice of a an angel (a pure spirit) is a much more binding and definitive than the choices we make as humans.
I think your question points to a reality that both angels and humans are beings that were created and will live on for eternity. God will not simply un-create us. Why does God allow the immoral humans to continue using their gifts in the world? I think the answer to this question is the same answer to the question of why God doesn’t revoke the power that was given to Satan when he was created as an angel. Also, the powers of an angel are not bodily but spiritual so they probably don’t diminish over time like our bodily powers (muscles, brain memory, etc.).
Great Question… the more I write the more I realize I don’t know the answer!
Thanks, Nick
weightofthewood.blogspot.com
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theresaavey
Guest
Thanks for trying
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R_C
Guest
The Catechism of the Catholic Church holds a summary of the teachings of the Church on these matters. It’s not easy to sum them up for us. Which is why a group of very wise theologians came together and developed the Catechism and re-developed it again in its most recent version.
The Church has even developed an even more compact teaching, the Compendium.
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bzkoss236
Guest
The same can be said for Man. Why would God allow man to choose against him and fall?
Even though we are not God, by His actions we can make some assumptions. One being the nature of Love itself. True Love is selfless, giving, and caring. These things cannot be accomplished if one is in control. Consider you have a robot with artificial intelligence. If you program the robot to pretty much think for itself except that it is not allowed to defy you and has to love you. Is this robot really caring, selfless, and giving? Or think of one of those stuff toys that say things like “I love you”, or even the ones where you can program it to say your specific name, “I love you, Nick”, does this toy really love you?
No, it isn’t real Love. Real Love comes by choice, the choice to freely give of yourself and want what is best for another despite their actions towards you. This is what God does for us, and what we should do in return. All He asks is that we Love Him. And we are to show that we Love him by following and obeying His will.
So, God gave us, and the angels, free will to choose to Love him. 1/3 of which chose to defy Him instead, out of jealousy and pride. And because God Loves us, he gives us what we want, even if that is not what He wants for us. Consider a relationship between two friends, one a guy, the other a woman. Say the guy really Loves the woman, and wishes in his heart that she would marry him, but she does not Love him back. She has eyes for another man, but because the first guy truly Loves her, he lets her choose the other guy instead because it is what she wants.
I don’t know if this rambling helps at all, but that’s what I’ve got to contribute to the conversation…
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thistle
Guest
What does Satan have control over?
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AlanFromWichita
Guest
I agree satan has no direct control. Influence, by means of lying, tempting, and accusing, but the actual “work” I think has to be done by people who are thus influenced. Right?
Alan
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thistle
Guest
I agree.
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fred_conty
Guest
Bzkos, you mentioned"The same can be said for Man. Why would God allow man to choose against him and fall?"
Because living as human beings temptations will naturally occur. When we are born, we are fresh and innocent, created pure appart for original sin. As we grow, there are judgements that of necessity that happen. For example, there is a five dollar bill sitting in plain view on someone’s table with noone in sight. The thought occurs, should I or shouldn’t I? Or because we deal with one another everyday, conflicts occur in one way or another. The temptation is to grab power and authority rather than use charity.
So we really cannot live as human beings without there being natural temptations out of which come virture or vice which we must chose. Just being human, we are thrown into situations every day where we must make choices for good or for bad. That is just plain being human and cannot be prevented or sidestepped. To live means to chose.
Why does then God use Satan if we have enough of our own temptations and trials?
To reward you for your faithfulness to his will. It could be in this world, but most of it will be in the next. It is another way for God to love us. Of course the devil sees this as opportunity to tear us from his love and get even.
Jesus said to his apostles that he was going home to prepare them a place. That place is what we are building right here on earth with his grace. Each time we decide for good, and each time we receive the sacraments, we increase in sanctifying grace tho we never see this increase within us. It is there, the increase. At our life’s end, that degree of sanctifying grace, which we increase by our good works following his will, will be the degree of our blessedness and place in heaven next to him.
Just a few thoughts.
Because living as human beings temptations will naturally occur. When we are born, we are fresh and innocent, created pure appart for original sin. As we grow, there are judgements that of necessity that happen. For example, there is a five dollar bill sitting in plain view on someone’s table with noone in sight. The thought occurs, should I or shouldn’t I? Or because we deal with one another everyday, conflicts occur in one way or another. The temptation is to grab power and authority rather than use charity.
So we really cannot live as human beings without there being natural temptations out of which come virture or vice which we must chose. Just being human, we are thrown into situations every day where we must make choices for good or for bad. That is just plain being human and cannot be prevented or sidestepped. To live means to chose.
Why does then God use Satan if we have enough of our own temptations and trials?
To reward you for your faithfulness to his will. It could be in this world, but most of it will be in the next. It is another way for God to love us. Of course the devil sees this as opportunity to tear us from his love and get even.
Jesus said to his apostles that he was going home to prepare them a place. That place is what we are building right here on earth with his grace. Each time we decide for good, and each time we receive the sacraments, we increase in sanctifying grace tho we never see this increase within us. It is there, the increase. At our life’s end, that degree of sanctifying grace, which we increase by our good works following his will, will be the degree of our blessedness and place in heaven next to him.
Just a few thoughts.
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