Exorcisms and other non-Catholic religions

[CallMeJFK]

My girlfriend asked me this question the other day, and I didn’t quite know how to answer it. She says that other religions (for example, Islam) are able to successfully perform exorcisms on possessed individuals. How does one determine which religion is “right” if multiple religions possess the ability to do this?

 

[1voice]

My girlfriend asked me this question the other day, and I didn’t quite know how to answer it. She says that other religions (for example, Islam) are able to successfully perform exorcisms on possessed individuals. How does one determine which religion is “right” if multiple religions possess the ability to do this?

There are counterfeits of everything that God provides…

There is a book “The Beautiful Side of Evil” by Johanna Michaelson … It describes her experience with counterfeit healing. It looks good … but always ends up real bad.

 

[CallMeJFK]

But how can one be so sure that Islam and other non-Catholic religions are evil counterfeits? Sure, they may be missing some of the elements that compose the Catholic churchs, but they contain many of the same truths.

 

[Sufjon]

But how can one be so sure that Islam and other non-Catholic religions are evil counterfeits? Sure, they may be missing some of the elements that compose the Catholic churchs, but they contain many of the same truths.

My sense is that if I belonged to a religion where exorcism was a relatively well known subject, I would find that in itself to be good cause to wonder if I was in the right place to start with. I would seek a faith that didn’t have that problem on such a common basis as to have formal exorcists and the like.

Your friend
Sufjon

 

[1voice]

But how can one be so sure that Islam and other non-Catholic religions are evil counterfeits? Sure, they may be missing some of the elements that compose the Catholic churchs, but they contain many of the same truths.

My experience has shown / proved to me that Jesus is the way the truth and the life. The one truth that is most important is that Jesus died for each and every one of us. It is an historic fact that Jesus lived. Jesus said several things that made absolutely no sense unless he was truly the Son of God. The religions that do not accept the fact that Jesus is the Son of God that died and rose again to save us from hell … are false religions.
Islam does not accept the fact that Jesus is equal with the Father … Islam does not accept the fact that following Jesus is the only way to escape hell for eternity.

Good works are totally worthless to save anyone. The only way to make it to heaven is to first acknowledge who Jesus is and what he did. Adam, when he disobeyed God’s direct orders, was reduced … from intimacy with God … to only being able to navigate by his knowledge of good and evil. He and all of us know what good and evil look like … but the disobedience cut us all off from the source of life. It was a really bad trade off. Without Jesus to restore the life … you can know what good is … and do all the good that you want … and still die in sin separated from the source of life for all eternity. Jesus is the way to life. After a person takes care of the fact that they are separated from the source of life … because of disobedience ( which is an Adamic family trait) … then they can start thinking about doing good … and having it count for something.

Buddhism … Islam … Shintoism Hinduism … they alll try to make good people … but they are all missing the key issue that good works are worth nothing to a man that is seperated from the source of life.

Jesus said clearly … "I am the vine … you are the branches … you can do nothing that has any value at all unless you abide in me. (the vine)
If a religion does not accept that simple fact … it is a false religion.

 

[1voice]

But how can one be so sure that Islam and other non-Catholic religions are evil counterfeits? Sure, they may be missing some of the elements that compose the Catholic churchs, but they contain many of the same truths.

… Concrete example… If you were on the Titantic you could do all the nice things you wanted to … and it would not prevent you from drowning… What you would have needed … is a life boat … you would need rescue. … all the good works in the world would not save you from a watery grave … That is what Jesus is … he is the only source of life … in a dying world.

Lots of religions offer a good way to live on this Earth… Only Christ offers a way to connect with the source of life for all of eternity.

 

[CallMeJFK]

Maybe I should rephrase this…

How CAN exorcisms be performed successfully by different religions? How can a religion that is not one with the truth be able to succeed against the Devil?

BTW, very thought-provoking analogy about the life-boat, Titanic, etc. Kudos.

 

[Sufjon]

Maybe I should rephrase this…

How CAN exorcisms be performed successfully by different religions? How can a religion that is not one with the truth be able to succeed against the Devil?

I have a question if I may:

-Assuming that you haven’t already decided in your own head which religions are true and which are not, what litmus test would you use to determine which are true and which are false? Aside from quoting whatever scripture you happen to subscribe to, (scripture that naturally is going to affirm that your faith is right) how do you prove that the one you picked is right?

I have another question:

How have we empirically established that the Devil is real? If the Devil is not real, then nothing that holds any truth would deal with the subject of the Devil. If he is only fiction, then any religion that deals with it is fiction as well. The problem in my thinking is that we seem to be asking for empirical evidence in regard to a question that is primarily based on faith in the first place. If you have a particular faith, my sense is that you should stick with the way it deals with such things.

I have another question:

Are you honestly looking for an exorcist, or is this just looking for an inroad that leads to yet another CAF member proclamation about how one faith is right and others are all wrong?

Your friend
Sufjon

 

[Richard_Kastner]

Maybe I should rephrase this…

How CAN exorcisms be performed successfully by different religions? How can a religion that is not one with the truth be able to succeed against the Devil?

BTW, very thought-provoking analogy about the life-boat, Titanic, etc. Kudos.

Matt.7
21Not every one that saith unto me, Lord, Lord, shall enter into the kingdom of heaven; but he that doeth the will of my Father which is in heaven.

22Many will say to me in that day, Lord, Lord, have we not prophesied in thy name? and in thy name have cast out devils? and in thy name done many wonderful works?

23And then will I profess unto them, I never knew you: depart from me, ye that work iniquity.

 

[1voice]

Maybe I should rephrase this…

How CAN exorcisms be performed successfully by different religions? How can a religion that is not one with the truth be able to succeed against the Devil?

BTW, very thought-provoking analogy about the life-boat, Titanic, etc. Kudos.

… Thanks for the kudos … I amazed myself with that one…

… as per the exorcism question… satan is a deceiver … a con … he and his crew may back off for a while in an area in order to convince their mark that this stuff really works … but the overall strategy is a deception designed to capture the bigger prize … which is the persons soul. For example: Shamans ( healers or people that deal in magic in some spiritual belief systems) have a measure of power (from satan , and are themselves deceived) … a person might go to a Shaman for any number of reasons … in the same way that we in western society would go to a doctor or a psychiatrist or a marriage counselor … etc. The Shaman can produce real results that seem very positive in the short term… But the source of the power is evil … and the person being delivered or healed or whatever … has unknowingly opened the door to demonic influences … many people that come for help may seem to get what they request … but satan doesnt play fair … his goal is destruction. once the door has been opened satan will work to oppress the persons mind and work to remove every influence that might lead to that person’s true deliverance … and salvation.
The whole thing is a scam designed to con the mark … There are lots of stories of famous / successful people that gave themselves over to satan in exchange for their wealth/ success … thinking that it is an awesome opportunity and no big deal. The same thing with false deliverance or healing … or whatever … a person who wants something … is deceived into going to the wrong source … has success and learns to trust in that source even more … and then pays an eternal price for it.

I have heard stories about people that put a statue of Buddha in their home because they have been told that it will produce 7 years of good luck… and satan makes sure that it really happens … but then the other shoe drops … and without faith in Jesus … satan begins to do what he planned the day the statue of Buddha showed up.

 

[pablope]

My girlfriend asked me this question the other day, and I didn’t quite know how to answer it. She says that other religions (for example, Islam) are able to successfully perform exorcisms on possessed individuals. How does one determine which religion is “right” if multiple religions possess the ability to do this?

I cannot answer about other religions.

I will give you a catholic viewpoint: In the CC, only the bishop can do an exorcism, but this authority is delegated to a priest, rightly trained to conduct an exorcism. And not just any priest. A priest chosen to do an exorcism must be prepared spiritually and mentally to deal with what happens in an exorcism.

The devil is wily, wise and very deceiving.

I would suggest a book…The Rite by Matt Baglio. It is a great read and resource about exorcism.

 

[pablope]

Maybe I should rephrase this…

How CAN exorcisms be performed successfully by different religions? How can a religion that is not one with the truth be able to succeed against the Devil?

BTW, very thought-provoking analogy about the life-boat, Titanic, etc. Kudos.

There is no way to know. The devil is the great deceiver…he will tell you 99 truths to squeeze in one lie.

This article may help you: catholicnewsagency.com/news/romes-exorcist-finding-bl.-john-paul-ii-effective-against-satan/

From accounts of Cathoic exorcists, they get supernatural help. So, deduce from there…who believes in the intercession of the saints?

 

[pablope]

I have a question if I may:

-Assuming that you haven’t already decided in your own head which religions are true and which are not, what litmus test would you use to determine which are true and which are false? Aside from quoting whatever scripture you happen to subscribe to, (scripture that naturally is going to affirm that your faith is right) how do you prove that the one you picked is right?

 

[Hail_Linus]

My girlfriend asked me this question the other day, and I didn’t quite know how to answer it. She says that other religions (for example, Islam) are able to successfully perform exorcisms on possessed individuals. How does one determine which religion is “right” if multiple religions possess the ability to do this?

How do these other religions determine whether a person is actually possessed?

The Catholic Church has very high standards to determine if a person is possessed.

My point is what these other religions consider possession may not be what Catholics consider possession.

 

[fred_conty]

I have a question if I may:

-Assuming that you haven’t already decided in your own head which religions are true and which are not, what litmus test would you use to determine which are true and which are false? Aside from quoting whatever scripture you happen to subscribe to, (scripture that naturally is going to affirm that your faith is right) how do you prove that the one you picked is right?

I have another question:

How have we empirically established that the Devil is real? If the Devil is not real, then nothing that holds any truth would deal with the subject of the Devil. If he is only fiction, then any religion that deals with it is fiction as well. The problem in my thinking is that we seem to be asking for empirical evidence in regard to a question that is primarily based on faith in the first place. If you have a particular faith, my sense is that you should stick with the way it deals with such things.

I have another question:

Are you honestly looking for an exorcist, or is this just looking for an inroad that leads to yet another CAF member proclamation about how one faith is right and others are all wrong?

Your friend
Sufjon

1. how do you prove that the one you picked is right?
   The four marks I would look for are: one, holy, catholic, apostolic.
   One means that it would teach the same things everywhere it is found.
   Holy means that it would have very holy people who lived good lives, some with miracles.
   …Hospitals, orphanagies, etc…
   …This dosen’t mean all members are sinless.
   Catholic means it is found everywhere in the world of all nations and tongues, rich and poor, smart and handicaped, etc… everyone and excluding noone.
   Apostolic means it has its roots from the early apostles with the powers that were entrusted to them to carry on the work of Christ thru time.
2. How have we empirically established that the Devil is real?
   Testimonies of those who have experienced the Devil. There are a goodly number especially holy people who would be trustworthy.
3. Are you honestly looking for an exorcist, or…
   That I don’t know. But I personally have seen tv shows of exorcists of other christian faiths.

 

[Sufjon]

Hi Fred:

how do you prove that the one you picked is right?
The four marks I would look for are: one, holy, catholic, apostolic.
One means that it would teach the same things everywhere it is found.
Holy means that it would have very holy people who lived good lives, some with miracles.
…Hospitals, orphanagies, etc…
…This dosen’t mean all members are sinless.

Lots of religions teach the same things everywhere it is found. Many claim miraculous things as well, and many are undoubtedly true. Many if not most do good deeds, fed the hungry and treat the sick.

Catholic means it is found everywhere in the world of all nations and tongues, rich and poor, smart and handicaped, etc… everyone and excluding noone.
Apostolic means it has its roots from the early apostles with the powers that were entrusted to them to carry on the work of Christ thru time.

Again, most religions are translated into languages around the world. Many with more consistent consensus on the meaning of their gospels than Christianity.

1. How have we empirically established that the Devil is real?
   Testimonies of those who have experienced the Devil. There are a goodly number especially holy people who would be trustworthy.

I have heard lots of testimony about flying saucers as well. I cannot prove they exist or that they don’t. Again, we are going on what we believe.

1. Are you honestly looking for an exorcist, or…
   That I don’t know. But I personally have seen tv shows of exorcists of other christian faiths.

I have seen them too. I can’t say whether an of it is real or false. that is my point really. Well, one of my points. My other point is t hat the OP should trust in whatever church he belongs to on the matter. I think he is Catholic.

Your friend
Sufjon

 

[Sufjon]

Hi Sufjon…how are you doing my friend…please allow me to answer.

Hi Pablope: I’m doing okay theses days and I hope you are doing well.

J

ust as Jesus affirmed who He is by the miracles he did, I would also affirm the true religion He founded by the miracles attributed to that religion.

As you know, I believe in Jesus too. I just have a very different understanding of Him from what Christians have (as you know).

From the accounts of Catholic exorcists, who wrote about their experiences and ministry, I believe the Devil is indeed real.

Saints have written of the attacks of the devil, and to name a few: St.Gemma Galgani, Padre Pio, St. John Vianney.

Fr. Gary Thomas, a real priest, and the priest talked about in the book The Rite, was a guest on Catholic Answers Live (you can search for it in the archives) accounted his encounter with the devil and attests to such. I have no reason to doubt what he said.

Now, if one does not want to believe, then the only recourse I could think of is to invite the devil to possess you and experience it first hand.

I have read some of those accounts, but I am on the fence as to their Veracity. Doesn’t mean i disbelieve them. It only means I can’t account for what they experienced. I am a huge fan of Jimmy Carter. He says he saw a flying saucer once. I believe he wouldn’t lie, but I can’t say for certain what he experienced. I’m sure it was convincing.

How are doing in your investigative journey, my friend? Hope all is well with you.

Long.

I am very happy to hear from you Pablope!

Your friend
Sufion