Expectations from psychics

[MJE]

This is not a discussion re: validity of psychics or the RC church’s teaching on this matter. Rather, what are the expectations of those who visit psychics et al.? I know several people, one a Catholic, who have paid $ for a message re: a deceased family member. They all seem to get the same message: *deceased relative is fine and happy. * And I suspect, that was what they were hoping for when they put down their $. What would happen if the message was not ‘consoling’ and the paying customer leaves disturbed?

 

[OrdinaryMelkite]

This is not a discussion re: validity of psychics or the RC church’s teaching on this matter. Rather, what are the expectations of those who visit psychics et al.? I know several people, one a Catholic, who have paid $ for a message re: a deceased family member. They all seem to get the same message: *deceased relative is fine and happy. * And I suspect, that was what they were hoping for when they put down their $. What would happen if the message was not ‘consoling’ and the paying customer leaves disturbed?

The Psychic would then say “You Paid Me To Contact Your Loved Ones…Whatever The Outcome Of That May Be-----------NOT To Reassure you Necessarily.”

I know Of a TV Psychic (I Forget Her Name) who Always Asks Her Clients Beforehand----“Do You Want to Hear Everything?”
Most say Yes.

So that is Basically the Response You Would Get.

 

[Nine_Two]

A good business person will never give customers other than they want.

 

[Sufjon]

This is not a discussion re: validity of psychics or the RC church’s teaching on this matter. Rather, what are the expectations of those who visit psychics et al.? I know several people, one a Catholic, who have paid $ for a message re: a deceased family member. They all seem to get the same message: *deceased relative is fine and happy. * And I suspect, that was what they were hoping for when they put down their $. What would happen if the message was not ‘consoling’ and the paying customer leaves disturbed?

I know some people who say they are psychics. I don’t know if they are or they aren’t. I was never curious enough to ask them anything. The ones I know don’t charge money. You can give them a love offering of food or something if you like, but giving them nothing is fine as well. They hold down real jobs in the real world and do what they do because they think they are helping people. I can’t say either way about what they can or can’t do. I am of the opinion that the ones who don’t charge money may be more genuine. Sure, everyone has to have their hand in someone’s pocket, but in my faith many of us don’t trust people who take money for spiritual things. I have never accepted a spiritual teacher who accepted more than a few dollars for expenses or a meal. As for the people who seek psychics, I think probably they are seeking comfort and reassurance for the most part. Pretty much what most everyone is looking for.

Every community has people who are supposedly psychic. I trust some of them are for real. If I were looking for one, I would seek the oddball who says and does strange things, has very little, and doesn’t seem to notice that he or she has very little. You might get a thing or two out of such a person.

Your friend,
Sufjon

 

[antihippy79]

Sufjon,

You implicitly recommend that if you are looking for a psychic that they seek out an “odd ball.” Do not seek out a psychic under any circumstance whether oddball or humbly poor or not. You are going to either a fraud or worse; a child playing with dangerous malevolent forces! When you use a psychic to summon the dead you forfeit your friendship with Christ.

I don’t know what people’s expectation are when seeing a psychic but the results are direct mortal sin and potential demonic possession. I imagine these results are generally not expected!

Read Chief Vatican Exorcist Gabriele Amorth’s writings to see what people get when they expect some nice occult experience. He says that the most common source of possession is messing around with the occult.

 

[Sufjon]

Sufjon,

You implicitly recommend that if you are looking for a psychic that they seek out an “odd ball.” Do not seek out a psychic under any circumstance whether oddball or humbly poor or not. You are going to either a fraud or worse; a child playing with dangerous malevolent forces!

Hello antihippy79:

-First, it is very good of you to worry about the fate of others. I deeply respect that.

-People will do what they will do. I have not recommended that they see a psychic. I have suggested what I think a good one would look like.

-All forces, whether dangerous, malevolent, divine or whatever, issue forth from God. Nothing inside or outside of creation exists without God. You belong to God. There is nothing to fear. Nothing. I have no fear of such things.

When you use a psychic to summon the dead you forfeit your friendship with Christ.

My friendship with God/Christ is unconditional. It is not motivated by want of heaven or dread of hell. Love of God that is predicated on these things is frail and a waste of time. He sees through it.

I don’t know what people’s expectation are when seeing a psychic but the results are direct mortal sin and potential demonic possession. I imagine these results are generally not expected!

Mortal sin, venial sin. There is but one sin. All other sins or born of it. That sin is the inability to love God with all your heart and your neighbor as yourself. It is the inability to see that they are all one thing. God, you , your neighbor. One thing. The one who sees this is freed from the shackles of all sin. The one who does not see this is kicking the can down the road until he does see it. The sins of the ten commandments are not sin. They are symptoms of sin, of which there is but one, as I have explained.

Read Chief Vatican Exorcist Gabriele Amorth’s writings to see what people get when they expect some nice occult experience. He says that the most common source of possession is messing around with the occult.

That which is possessed by God has nothing to fear of being possessed by anything else. All things are possessed by God. I am not held to ransom by any church or their officials. Those who want to be held to account by a church should do so. That is their path. It is not mine.

Your friend,
Sufjon

 

[MJE]

Have you ever heard of someone being told by a ‘psychic’ their beloved deceased is in hell or suffering?

 

[seeker57]

Psychics, and spiritualism in general, fill a need for some who need some reassurance of what lies beyond their physcial existance.

Most psychics and spiritualists I have known are loosely Christian, with some foundation in Christain beliefs or some sort of a belief in the divinity of Jesus.

Those who I know who practice this belief, both the psychcs and those who utilize them, seem to have a firm belief in it, albeit a non-dogmatic one.

I had one friend, an avid believer in spiritualism, tell me he knew his deceased mother had contacted him via signs he perceives in his home.

I don’t believe there is any danger using a psychic, aside from being duped. That said, I don’t put any faith in spiritualism myself.

Seeker

 

[antihippy79]

Hello antihippy79:

-First, it is very good of you to worry about the fate of others. I deeply respect that.

Thank you.

-People will do what they will do. I have not recommended that they see a psychic. I have suggested what I think a good one would look like.

There are no good psychics. “9 When you enter the land the LORD your God is giving you, do not learn to imitate the detestable ways of the nations there. 10 Let no one be found among you who sacrifices their son or daughter in the fire, who practices divination or sorcery, interprets omens, engages in witchcraft, 11 or casts spells, or who is a medium or spiritist or who consults the dead. 12 Anyone who does these things is detestable to the LORD; because of these same detestable practices the LORD your God will drive out those nations before you. 13 You must be blameless before the LORD your God.” Deuteronomy 18:9-13

-All forces, whether dangerous, malevolent, divine or whatever, issue forth from God. Nothing inside or outside of creation exists without God. You belong to God. There is nothing to fear. Nothing. I have no fear of such things.

Demons who wish for the ruin of your soul are not issued forth from God. They betray God and have nothing to do with Him. This is blasphemous to attribute evil to our loving Creator. Something unable to “exist without God” does not make it good.

My friendship with God/Christ is unconditional. It is not motivated by want of heaven or dread of hell. Love of God that is predicated on these things is frail and a waste of time. He sees through it.

Christ’s friendship is not unconditional nor is yours. Matthew 7:21 – 23
“Not everyone who says to me, ‘Lord, Lord,’ will enter the kingdom of heaven, but only he who does the will of my Father who is in heaven. Many will say to me on that day, ‘Lord, Lord, did we not prophesy in your name, and in your name drive out demons and perform many miracles?’ Then I will tell them plainly, ‘I never knew you. Away from me, you evildoers!" Your free will is also unconditional. You can choose to walk away from Christ’s friendship (I have before). He does not force you to love Him or obey Him as I have learned when I have sinned. Friendship is always motivated by love and is conditioned on it. Without love there is no friendship…therefore all friendship is conditioned on love. If you do not love God with all of your heart, you are not choosing to be his friend.

Mortal sin, venial sin. There is but one sin. All other sins or born of it. That sin is the inability to love God with all your heart and your neighbor as yourself. It is the inability to see that they are all one thing. God, you , your neighbor. One thing. The one who sees this is freed from the shackles of all sin. The one who does not see this is kicking the can down the road until he does see it. The sins of the ten commandments are not sin. They are symptoms of sin, of which there is but one, as I have explained.

I agree that all sin is evil and not of God. However, some sin deserves different divine Justice than others just as petty theft has a different punishment than murder. You are incorrect that all is part of God. We are. His creation is. Sin is not. Sin is the lack of God as shadow is the lack of light. Also, the sins of the ten commandments are sin. I understand that all sin comes from not loving God, but they are still sins. Species of sin at least…

That which is possessed by God has nothing to fear of being possessed by anything else. All things are possessed by God. I am not held to ransom by any church or their officials. Those who want to be held to account by a church should do so. That is their path. It is not mine.

You can choose to not be possessed by God and give yourself to some other god…like lust, greed or demons. I understand that you do not mean to harm anyone, but people read these forums who are not as enlightened as you seem to be. It must be understood without equivocation: Using a psychic is to not love God as you are directly disobeying the Lord’s command. Does choosing not to follow God’s commandments mean you don’t love him? 2 John 1-6 “And this is love, that we walk according to His commandments. This is the commandment, just as you have heard from the beginning, that you should walk in it.” As you said, all sin is the same…no love of God. Ignoring his command is to not love God.

Your friend,
Sufjon

Yours in Christ.

 

[Loboto-Me]

Funny that I came across this thread because yesterday I was reading the scripture of Acts 16 :

16 Once when we were going to the place of prayer, we were met by a female slave who had a spirit by which she predicted the future. She earned a great deal of money for her owners by fortune-telling. 17 She followed Paul and the rest of us, shouting, “These men are servants of the Most High God, who are telling you the way to be saved.” 18 She kept this up for many days. Finally Paul became so annoyed that he turned around and said to the spirit, “In the name of Jesus Christ I command you to come out of her!” At that moment the spirit left her.

This tells me that psychics even well intentioned should not be trusted not to be unknowingly following dark spirits. Afterall, had it been me who was there walking with Paul, I would have let the lady go since she was calling God “the most high” and basically telling everyone to follow what Paul had to say. Yet Paul saw something that most would not have.

 

[Pieman333272]

My buddy paid $5 and was told “you will eat dinner”. No joke. They predict the most obvious or general things that there is a certainty they will be right.

 

[crystal_waters]

The ones I know don’t charge money. You can give them a love offering of food or something if you like, but giving them nothing is fine as well… I am of the opinion that the ones who don’t charge money may be more genuine. Sure, everyone has to have their hand in someone’s pocket, but in my faith many of us don’t trust people who take money for spiritual things. I have never accepted a spiritual teacher who accepted more than a few dollars for expenses or a meal… .

Your friend,
Sufjon

well said:thumbsup:

 

[Publisher]

This is not a discussion re: validity of psychics or the RC church’s teaching on this matter. Rather, what are the expectations of those who visit psychics et al.? I know several people, one a Catholic, who have paid $ for a message re: a deceased family member. They all seem to get the same message: *deceased relative is fine and happy. * And I suspect, that was what they were hoping for when they put down their $. What would happen if the message was not ‘consoling’ and the paying customer leaves disturbed?

I’ve never been to a psychic…except at a work Xmas party where the company had hired a psychic as part of the entertainment…they are very good at reading people…good psychics are very intuitive…but I don’t put much stock in their “readings.”

If you are looking for answers to questions…you’d be better served by confiding and discussing with a close loving friend to use as a “sounding board”.

All advice a psychic would give you would not be better than what you’d get with some close friends who loved you and cared about your welfare.

 

[AntiTheist]

What would happen if the message was not ‘consoling’ and the paying customer leaves disturbed?

Curiously enough, there was a case a while back where Sylvia Browne – a supposed “psychic” and one of the world’s most disgusting people, for a lot of reasons – was doing an episode of Montel Williams, trying to determine the fate of children who had gone missing.

You can read about one particular encounter in the episode on this site dedicated to exposing Browne: stopsylvia.com/articles/montel_opal.shtml

Shockingly, Browne tells the grandmother of this poor, disappeared girl that the girl is not dead but has been taken into “white slavery” – i.e. forced prostitution – somewhere in Japan.

As the article goes on to report, the missing girl case was cracked four years after the show, and the little girl had not been sold into “white slavery” – she had been murdered and her body hidden.

So here’s an example of a “psychic” giving a family anything but comfort – in fact, giving them false hope that this missing girl was alive and false nightmares of thinking that she was being regularly sexually abused and exploited – and all to grab ratings and publicity for herself.

These psychic con-artists – redundant, since all psychics are con-artists, whether consciously or not – are the absolute lowest of the low. They feed off of human misery and desperation, and they take people’s money in exchange for providing false comfort and the kinds of platitudes you’d find in a fortune cookie.

They also, quite nicely, illustrate the kinds of lunacy you open the door to when you when you start thinking that “faith” or “deep feelings” or “knowing in your heart” is a good way to come to conclusions about the world.

Naturally, it should come as no surprise that Sylvia Browne has started her own religion, based on the “channeled” messages she’s received…and there are even nuts who buy into it. And why not? Once you start accepting “deep feelings” and “faith,” reality’s up for grabs.

 

[benidict]

I know some people who say they are psychics. I don’t know if they are or they aren’t. I was never curious enough to ask them anything. The ones I know don’t charge money. You can give them a love offering of food or something if you like, but giving them nothing is fine as well. They hold down real jobs in the real world and do what they do because they think they are helping people. I can’t say either way about what they can or can’t do. I am of the opinion that the ones who don’t charge money may be more genuine. Sure, everyone has to have their hand in someone’s pocket, but in my faith many of us don’t trust people who take money for spiritual things. I have never accepted a spiritual teacher who accepted more than a few dollars for expenses or a meal. As for the people who seek psychics, I think probably they are seeking comfort and reassurance for the most part. Pretty much what most everyone is looking for.

Every community has people who are supposedly psychic. I trust some of them are for real. If I were looking for one, I would seek the oddball who says and does strange things, has very little, and doesn’t seem to notice that he or she has very little. You might get a thing or two out of such a person.

Your friend,
Sufjon

Hello friend Sufjon. have they ever wone the lottery?

 

[rick43235]

Curiously enough…

Welcome back. I’ve missed your insightful posts. And the absolutely rabid reactions they sometimes inspire.

 

[AntiTheist]

Welcome back. I’ve missed your insightful posts. And the absolutely rabid reactions they sometimes inspire.

Thanks, Rick. I appreciate it.

 

[GaryTaylor]

Hard to dig thorough all this nonsense.

I do believe the better part are simply husslers.

Though I watched a documentry on the Oklahoma City PD. Ironicly even they were making “Twightlight Zone” jokes during the investigation.

Though at the end the “Psychic” led them not only to the body. Also she was correct on where it would be found, what it would be wrapped in [Blue Blanket and Duck Taped]. And it was found by two hunters as she indicated.

So the where, what and who, parts were correct. Needless to say no-one was joking around at the end of the investigation which closed the case.

I do think there are some gifted individuals. But to know who is a mystery. Edgar Cayce comes to mind also.

 

[1holycatholic]

My buddy paid $5 and was told “you will eat dinner”. No joke. They predict the most obvious or general things that there is a certainty they will be right.

http://hackedirl.files.wordpress.co...acked-irl-easy-to-predict-a-tough-economy.jpg

 

[Lokabrenna]

Hard to dig thorough all this nonsense.

I do believe the better part are simply husslers.

Though I watched a documentry on the Oklahoma City PD. Ironicly even they were making “Twightlight Zone” jokes during the investigation.

Though at the end the “Psychic” led them not only to the body. Also she was correct on where it would be found, what it would be wrapped in [Blue Blanket and Duck Taped]. And it was found by two hunters as she indicated.

So the where, what and who, parts were correct. Needless to say no-one was joking around at the end of the investigation which closed the case.

I do think there are some gifted individuals. But to know who is a mystery. Edgar Cayce comes to mind also.

I’ve heard of cases where psychics were actually arrested for the crimes they helped solve, because obviously only the murderer would know details like what they were describing!

I personally think that most (if not all) of the psychics that you see on TV are faking it, but my mom once visited a tea leaf reader with her cousin (who was always a big believer in psychics) who talked about seeing a little girl (a daughter, in fact) in her house who “is going to be crawling for a long time”. Well, mom was absolutely flabbergasted. She had two boys already and wasn’t even thinking about adopting (she had had a hysterectomy at this point).

Anyways, years later, she ended up adopting a daughter (yes, that’s me); the kicker is when the doctors told her that they didn’t think I would be able to walk for a long time after most children my age would be toddling around. Actually, both the doctors and the psychic were wrong on that point–my mom came home and I started walking that day.

I suppose you could say that the part about crawling around for a long time was a “miss” but I can’t think of any cold-reading technique that would explain how she would know how the doctor would diagnose my condition, perhaps a series of very lucky guesses?

I read tarot cards, but I don’t claim that I have psychic powers. I do have “deja vu” moments that I know I dreamed about prior to experiencing them (some would call that clairvoyance) but the information is pretty much useless (ie. seeing a forum post and then seeing my own response to that post) so I don’t pay that much attention to those moments.