Faith and Experience

[authenticity]

My father said to me that we know faith through experience. As in, I have faith in God because of experiences I’ve had that reveal God to me. He asked me to “chew on it” for a while.

So far, I’m still of the other opinion. Faith precedes experience. For example, if I get a flat tire and some stranger stops to help me fix it, I would be grateful to God and consider this person a good Samaritan or even a guardian angel. Someone who has different beliefs would come to a different conclusion.

This goes along with a discussion I was having in the Tolle 2 thread (now closed) about whether a person is saved by faith or by spiritual experience. My opinion there was that a person was saved by faith. Some people are simply not as spiritually inclined as others, but that does not bar them from salvation. They can have faith without any personal proof and still reach heaven.

What do you think?

 

[geometer]

Salvation is an act of God. The scriptures state that we are saved by the grace of God.

It is a supernatural event.

Faith means trust. You must trust that God exists and has the power to save you, but God saves you.

 

[mash85]

My father said to me that we know faith through experience. As in, I have faith in God because of experiences I’ve had that reveal God to me. He asked me to “chew on it” for a while.

So far, I’m still of the other opinion. Faith precedes experience. For example, if I get a flat tire and some stranger stops to help me fix it, I would be grateful to God and consider this person a good Samaritan or even a guardian angel. Someone who has different beliefs would come to a different conclusion.

This goes along with a discussion I was having in the Tolle 2 thread (now closed) about whether a person is saved by faith or by spiritual experience. My opinion there was that a person was saved by faith. Some people are simply not as spiritually inclined as others, but that does not bar them from salvation. They can have faith without any personal proof and still reach heaven.

What do you think?

I will start by asking a question. How do you first come to declare that God exist? I believe that this is through the encounters that you have had, be it through hearing,be it through His wonders as you see them. in other words through your senses and as a result you have affirmed that it is true and have come to believe so. This is what we refer to as experience. experience does not have to happen to you in person for you to know or declare that it is one. The case of the Samaritan is just but one form of experience and for this experience comes first and this experience leads me to believe. i start from a reality, something that exist and is present for me to know about that which i can not see.

 

[Michael1985]

Following experiences of God can lead people into trouble. The Mormans say that you will know whether the Book of Mormon is true if you receive a testimony from the Holy Spirit; an experience of peace.

That’s fine until you realise that many other belief systems can make you feel peaceful as well. If it is purely an experience of God how do you know which one it is true.

Often when I know God is calling me to something, like speaking out on a controversial issue I feel very uncomfortable and not at all at peace.

Another issue with “experience” is that they may not be from God. Jeremiah says “the heart is deceptive in all things.” Often when people think they feel “God” when they are just drawn to the music, or the pastor of a Church, or some other human factor.

Of course this doesn’t mean that there aren’t genuine experiences of God, but there are many who deceive themselves. There certainly can be love at first sight but more often than not, the people need to get to know each other a bit before they start having feelings for each other, the same is true for our relationship with God. We need to know God first.

 

[authenticity]

I will start by asking a question. How do you first come to declare that God exist? I believe that this is through the encounters that you have had, be it through hearing,be it through His wonders as you see them. in other words through your senses and as a result you have affirmed that it is true and have come to believe so. This is what we refer to as experience. experience does not have to happen to you in person for you to know or declare that it is one. The case of the Samaritan is just but one form of experience and for this experience comes first and this experience leads me to believe. i start from a reality, something that exist and is present for me to know about that which i can not see.

That’s an interesting question. But it still seems to me that one starts off with a belief in God and what one experiences is a confirmation. For example, a person who was an atheist would not have the question of God’s existence in the first place. He or she would not attribute experiences to the existence of God. This is not to say that faith makes God exist-- I think this is what many critics think. But it is is because of my faith that I can know.

To use another example. I go to a job and I have faith that my employer will pay me for my work. If I did not have that faith, I would not do the work. The reason I have that faith though is because there is a system of laws that I didn’t create that says that employers must pay their employees for their work.

 

[authenticity]

Following experiences of God can lead people into trouble. The Mormans say that you will know whether the Book of Mormon is true if you receive a testimony from the Holy Spirit; an experience of peace.

That’s fine until you realise that many other belief systems can make you feel peaceful as well. If it is purely an experience of God how do you know which one it is true.

Often when I know God is calling me to something, like speaking out on a controversial issue I feel very uncomfortable and not at all at peace.

This is kind of what I was thinking, also. If life hands you some difficult situations, you might think that God doesn’t care or is cruel based on your experience. Or you might look at people who are self-centered and well off as an example of God’s hypocrisy.

I’ve heard many people ask, “If God is a loving God, why is there x, y, z in the world?”

That’s different then saying, “Since God is a loving God, why is there x, y, z in the world?”

Another issue with “experience” is that they may not be from God. Jeremiah says “the heart is deceptive in all things.” Often when people think they feel “God” when they are just drawn to the music, or the pastor of a Church, or some other human factor.

I think this is how many people today approach religion.

Of course this doesn’t mean that there aren’t genuine experiences of God, but there are many who deceive themselves. There certainly can be love at first sight but more often than not, the people need to get to know each other a bit before they start having feelings for each other, the same is true for our relationship with God. We need to know God first.

 

[mash85]

That’s an interesting question. But it still seems to me that one starts off with a belief in God and what one experiences is a confirmation. For example, a person who was an atheist would not have the question of God’s existence in the first place. He or she would not attribute experiences to the existence of God. This is not to say that faith makes God exist-- I think this is what many critics think. But it is is because of my faith that I can know.

To use another example. I go to a job and I have faith that my employer will pay me for my work. If I did not have that faith, I would not do the work. The reason I have that faith though is because there is a system of laws that I didn’t create that says that employers must pay their employees for their work.

I agree with you totally, but the funny thing is that even the atheist, despite the fact that he may refuse the fact of existence of God, will accept that what happens has a certain force behind it, it is there because Another has made it so. This is what we call God. What give you a guarantee that your employer will pay you at your place is not just a set of rules because we have also had cases of people including employers going against the set rule, but our experience or actually what we may have seen happen to other employees within the organization. This experience make me believe that the same will happen to me. it on this account that i still that Faith is an affirmation of an existence, a presence and we have to start form the experience, the reality for us to believe.