For those who don't believe in all Church teachings -- thoughts?

[centurionguard]

Quite simply put being a Catholic and believing in what the Church teaches through its Magisterial Authority regarding the Saints and Dogmatic teachings is not something to be accepted by a Catholic purely out of convenience.

Bottom line your a real Catholic or your not.

A clean heart is a free heart. A free heart can love Christ with an undivided love in chastity, convinced that nothing and nobody will separate it from his love. Purity, chastity, and virginity created a special beauty in Mary that attracted God’s attention. He showed his great love for the world by giving Jesus to her.

There is a terrible hunger for love. We all experience that in our lives - the pain, the loneliness. We must have the courage to recognize it. The poor you may have right in your own family.
Find them.
Love them.

Before you speak, it is necessary for you to listen, for God speaks in the silence of the heart.

Give yourself fully to God. He will use you to accomplish great things on the condition that you believe much more in His love than in your own weakness.

Speak tenderly to them. Let there be kindness in your face, in your eyes, in your smile, in the warmth of your greeting. Always have a cheerful smile. Don’t only give your care, but give your heart as well.

The more you have, the more you are occupied, the less you give. But the less you have the more free you are. Poverty for us is a freedom. It is not mortification, a penance.
It is joyful freedom. There is no television here, no this, no that. But we are perfectly happy.

I pray that you will understand the words of Jesus, “Love one another as I have loved you.” Ask yourself “How has he loved me? Do I really love others in the same way?” Unless this love is among us, we can kill ourselves with work and it will only be work, not love. Work without love is slavery.

Little things are indeed little, but to be faithful in little things is a great thing.

A sacrifice to be real must cost, must hurt, must empty ourselves. The fruit of silence is prayer, the fruit of prayer is faith, the fruit of faith is love, the fruit of love is service, the fruit of service is peace.

Mother Teresa of Calcutta

 

[JRKH]

Things like this always baffle me.

I’m a reasonably well educated guy. I have read the works of historians and philosophers and theologians for decades, and still do…almost every night.

And, whenever I am presented with some critique of the Church or some part of doctrine, I still think “Who am I to reinvent the wheel?” Somewhere in the tomes of the writings there is a perfectly good answer to the question. My task is to find it, not to assume I’m somehow smarter than, e.g., St. Thomas Aquinas or Augustine or Maritain or Pope Benedict, who is indisputably more knowledgeable than I am, despite all my efforts.

And does the Holy Spirit guide me more inerrantly than the Pope? One would have to be extrarodinarily full of oneself to think so.

At some point, one simply has to acknowledge that he is not a prophet; that he is properly a listener in sacred matters, not an “inventor”. Those who invent their own theologies are, in my opinion, prideful fools.

While I do not disagree with you on the points you make above, I think that we should also not sell ourselves short either. As you say, you are a, “reasonably well educated guy”, and one can assume from this that you are also, at least, reasonably intelligent.
So -
I don’t think that it is necessarily that some other individual within the Church is more (or less) intelligent than you or I, not even necessarily an Aquinas or an Augustine et.al…For each person brings something wonderful to the discussion when speaking from Love and enlightened by the Holy Spirit.
Rather I think that it is the consensus drawn from the (name removed by moderator)ut of the the many millions of “reasonably intelligent” members of the “faithful”, also known in Scripture as the Ekklesia - and what we refer to as “The Church” and “The Magisterium”.

It is this consensus, drawn from the many Spirit inspired sources, and humbly and prayerfully distilled into the beautifully consistent and interlocking teachings of the Church that we plumb for answers.

Peace
James

 

[Leon_Bloy]

I believe in all the Church’s teachings without exception because I believe in the authenticity of the source (i.e. the Magisterium of the Church). To do otherwise would set me up as a judge of the truths of individual teachings, and that would make no sense, since I could prove next to none of them!

 

[Luvtosew]

As it has been said…it is shallow enough that a small child can play…and has its depths that an elephant can swim!

which may be a problem, its not play, faith is a serious matter, and while I have been a poorly educated Catholic for years ( yes the teaching in cathechism was not indept and I also take some of the blame) I have recently learned much and read much and am finding out that what I believed is different than I thought, so to make something so complicated and have so many resources that say different stuff, just confuses one even more.

 

[Ridgerunner]

While I do not disagree with you on the points you make above, I think that we should also not sell ourselves short either. As you say, you are a, “reasonably well educated guy”, and one can assume from this that you are also, at least, reasonably intelligent.
So -
I don’t think that it is necessarily that some other individual within the Church is more (or less) intelligent than you or I, not even necessarily an Aquinas or an Augustine et.al…For each person brings something wonderful to the discussion when speaking from Love and enlightened by the Holy Spirit.
Rather I think that it is the consensus drawn from the (name removed by moderator)ut of the the many millions of “reasonably intelligent” members of the “faithful”, also known in Scripture as the Ekklesia - and what we refer to as “The Church” and “The Magisterium”.

It is this consensus, drawn from the many Spirit inspired sources, and humbly and prayerfully distilled into the beautifully consistent and interlocking teachings of the Church that we plumb for answers.

Peace
James

Are you really saying you believe Church teaching is a matter of consensus among the faithful? If so, there will never truly be teachings of the Church, there will only be millions of “churches”.

 

[Sherry_G]

If Christ is the head of the Church and the Holy Spirit guides the church to this day, I accept all the teachings of my church. All the Traditions are my Traditions, every Pope is the Vicar of Christ. I may stumble over some teachings as they are hard. Just as the followers of Christ said, “This saying is hard. Who can accept it?” Many left Christ and returned to their former way of life. I have also left Christ at times in my life due to the hard sayings or teachings. Knowing that one doesn’t like the teaching is not the same as knowing the teaching is incorrect, however. Thank God for giving us His only son, Jesus Christ and the sacraments of Penance and the Holy Eucharist, especially.

 

[JRKH]

Are you really saying you believe Church teaching is a matter of consensus among the faithful? If so, there will never truly be teachings of the Church, there will only be millions of “churches”.

You are confusing “consensus” with “majority rules”.

Beginning with the Council of Jerusalem, the Church (ekklesia - Community called out) has sought to settle matters openly and through careful, prayerful deliberation and asking the Holy Spirit to Guide her as promised by our Lord.
By necessity - and by the natural order of things - these things have occurred and still occur through the thoughtful work of many people - the ekklesia.
Of course, once a matter is settled, and a teaching promulgated, that matter stays settled. That is the substantial difference between the Catholic Church and the “millions” of churches you refer to above. We don’t “re-invent the wheel”, but that does not mean we (individually and together in groups) do not contribute to the whole rich fabric that is the Church.
Of course there are great minds who have had profound influence on the Church over the centuries. Augustine and Aquinas are certainly two…But their influence does not stand in isolation. Their great contributions are great for two reasons. First because of the Truth they contain. Second, is because of the fat that others in the ekklesia (spirit guided) recognized the great truths in their writings.

Does that explain it better?

Peace
James

 

[A_Catholic]

You are confusing “consensus” with “majority rules”.

Beginning with the Council of Jerusalem, the Church (ekklesia - Community called out) has sought to settle matters openly and through careful, prayerful deliberation and asking the Holy Spirit to Guide her as promised by our Lord.
By necessity - and by the natural order of things - these things have occurred and still occur through the thoughtful work of many people - the ekklesia.
Of course, once a matter is settled, and a teaching promulgated, that matter stays settled. That is the substantial difference between the Catholic Church and the “millions” of churches you refer to above. We don’t “re-invent the wheel”, but that does not mean we (individually and together in groups) do not contribute to the whole rich fabric that is the Church.
Of course there are great minds who have had profound influence on the Church over the centuries. Augustine and Aquinas are certainly two…But their influence does not stand in isolation. Their great contributions are great for two reasons. First because of the Truth they contain. Second, is because of the fat that others in the ekklesia (spirit guided) recognized the great truths in their writings.

Does that explain it better?

Peace
James

It doesn’t explain it better to me. There is one magesterium in the Church, and it is comprised basically of the Pope in consultation with the Bishops - sometimes. I think of Humanae Vitae, which was basically the judgment of the Holy Father in spite of disagreement among many Bishops.

The “ekklesia” does not constitute the Magesterium. The Magesterium is guided by the Holy Spirit, not by “consensus” or the “ekklesia.” Great saints like Augustine or Aquinas explained teachings of the church, they did not form church teaching.

I’m actually very confused with what you are saying.

 

[JRKH]

It doesn’t explain it better to me. There is one magesterium in the Church, and it is comprised basically of the Pope in consultation with the Bishops - sometimes. I think of Humanae Vitae, which was basically the judgment of the Holy Father in spite of disagreement among many Bishops.

The “ekklesia” does not constitute the Magesterium. The Magesterium is guided by the Holy Spirit, not by “consensus” or the “ekklesia.” Great saints like Augustine or Aquinas explained teachings of the church, they did not form church teaching.

I’m actually very confused with what you are saying.

Probably best if I just withdraw my statements…One of those things that makes sense in my head, but I can’t explain it…

So I’ll shut-up now…

Peace
James