Founding New Churches

[BlackJack774]

2 Tim. 3:16-17
16All Scripture is inspired by God and profitable for teaching, for reproof, for correction, for training in righteousness;
17so that the man of God may be adequate, equipped for every good work.

Is this the scriptures that men like, Luther and Calvin, used to make their own churches? Apart and separate from the Pope and the Bishops of the Catholic Church.

If so, the major problem I have with this is that the Bible wasn’t cannoned at the time this scripture was written. Only the Old testament.

 

[AmericanJosiah]

2 Tim. 3:16-17
16All Scripture is inspired by God and profitable for teaching, for reproof, for correction, for training in righteousness;
17so that the man of God may be adequate, equipped for every good work.

Is this the scriptures that men like, Luther and Calvin, used to make their own churches? Apart and separate from the Pope and the Bishops of the Catholic Church.

If so, the major problem I have with this is that the Bible wasn’t cannoned at the time this scripture was written. Only the Old testament.

Some thoughts…

1. The Lutheran Church exists because the Pope of The Catholic Church excommunicated Luther… We consider that unfortunate - even tragic - and if you agree, my recommendation would be to take that up with Pope Leo X in Heaven.
2. Protestants believe - literally - what we profess in the Creed. We believe in one, holy and catholic church. And yes, it is the communion of saints, the mystical union of believers, the community of faith. We believe what we profess IS true - not just that it was true in the 4th century. Thus, the reality that there are millions of congregations and thousands of associations of them (denominations) is moot to our conviction that there is one church - and it was/is/ever will be one, holy, and catholic, that was/is/ever will be the communion of saints, the mystical union of all believers. We believe that Christians are people, and thus the mystical union of Christians (the church) is people. We reject the idea that the communion of saints is a denomination (yours, mine or any other).
3. Yes, Protestants embrace accountability. We - individually or collectively, as people or as institutional organizations - do not claim exclusive infalliblity and insist that self alone is exempt from accountability since self alone cannot err (however defined or restricted). Thus, in norming, the first issue is WHAT will serve as the norma normans/ the rule/ the canon for such. For those Protestants that embrace the praxis of Sola Scriptura, Scripture is that norma normans for the evaluation of doctrines proclaimed (by all - including The Catholic Church and all other denominations and teachers). The verse you quote might be one given to support the soundless of that specific norma normans, but it certainly would not be limited to that. But it’s not a “reason” to start a new congregation or a new association of congregations.

Thank you.

Pax

• Josiah

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[NDfan]

2 Tim. 3:16-17
16All Scripture is inspired by God and profitable for teaching, for reproof, for correction, for training in righteousness;
17so that the man of God may be adequate, equipped for every good work.

Is this the scriptures that men like, Luther and Calvin, used to make their own churches? Apart and separate from the Pope and the Bishops of the Catholic Church.

If so, the major problem I have with this is that the Bible wasn’t cannoned at the time this scripture was written. Only the Old testament.

These verses have nothing to do with making “your own” church as you say. There’s only one church and that is the church Christ founded on Peter’s confession of Faith. These verses are strictly referring to the role scripture plays in our life and the importance of it.

While the works that were canonized into what we now know as the Bible didn’t carry the label of holy scripture, it doesn’t mean they weren’t read and accepted as inspired material. The one premise the church used to canonize works were the general acceptance of said works. It’s not like the church sat down one day and said let’s decide what everyone is going to read. Everyone was already reading something. That’s the meaning of the word canon - measuring stick. You can’t canonize something without something to measure against.

 

[ralphinal]

Some thoughts…

1. The Lutheran Church exists because the Pope of The Catholic Church excommunicated Luther… We consider that unfortunate - even tragic - and if you agree, my recommendation would be to take that up with Pope Leo X in Heaven.

Oversimplified to then point of being incorrect. There is much more than Luther’s status with Rome involved.

1. Protestants believe - literally - what we profess in the Creed. We believe in one, holy and catholic church. And yes, it is the communion of saints, the mystical union of believers, the community of faith. We believe what we profess IS true - not just that it was true in the 4th century. Thus, the reality that there are millions of congregations and thousands of associations of them (denominations) is moot to our conviction that there is one church - and it was/is/ever will be one, holy, and catholic, that was/is/ever will be the communion of saints, the mystical union of all believers. We believe that Christians are people, and thus the mystical union of Christians (the church) is people. We reject the idea that the communion of saints is a denomination (yours, mine or any other).

Lutherans are a bad example on this one. They do hold to the creed and actually define the words very closely to how we do. However, not all non-Catholics do so. They profess it but do not mean the words in the same way.

1. Yes, Protestants embrace accountability. We - individually or collectively, as people or as institutional organizations - do not claim exclusive infalliblity and insist that self alone is exempt from accountability since self alone cannot err (however defined or restricted). Thus, in norming, the first issue is WHAT will serve as the norma normans/ the rule/ the canon for such. For those Protestants that embrace the praxis of Sola Scriptura, Scripture is that norma normans for the evaluation of doctrines proclaimed (by all - including The Catholic Church and all other denominations and teachers). The verse you quote might be one given to support the soundless of that specific norma normans, but it certainly would not be limited to that. But it’s not a “reason” to start a new congregation or a new association of congregations.

And yet, why are there so many denominations?

Thank you.

Pax

• Josiah

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[Lutheranteach]

You’ll find that many denominations have little to no doctrinal differences but only historical and cultural ones. You can have two protestant churches next to one another that really have no difference other than when they were built the two congregations spoke a different language or had different skin colors.United Methodist and African Methodist Episcopal (AME) for example.

 

[ralphinal]

You’ll find that many denominations have little to no doctrinal differences but only historical and cultural ones. You can have two protestant churches next to one another that really have no difference other than when they were built the two congregations spoke a different language or had different skin colors.United Methodist and African Methodist Episcopal (AME) for example.

That is an excellent point.

I for one, do not like the huge number used for denominations. In reality, some of the inflations are because of things like this