I think membership in the Masons is still cause for excommunication. As a public official his heresy would be notorious.
He can hardly have it both ways.
My thoughts are pro. The bishop was doing the only thing he could legitimately do and apparently even the bereaving sister of the deceased could understand. It is ubnreasonable for people to want Catholic burial rites who don’t even profess the Catholic faith. A Catholic Requiem Mass involves theology regarding purgatory that no Mason and few born-again Christians would agree with.
I tend to agree likewise; however for different a reason. My position would be that the church has an unfettered right to make decisions that they deem in order with the teachings of the church irrespective of what any organization or person wishes.
Hey gamewell. I’m glad you responded. I had forgotten this thread.
Gamewell, interesting link/article. The Church has that authority to do so. Just as Masons have the rights for their funeral and standings on admittance and other matters.
I also tend to agree with gamewell45 on this issue. The Church has the right whom it give Christian burial. The only problem I have with the original question is the line that the man was a “Born Again Christian.” I fully understand that it meant he was Protestant, BUT I also view Catholics who are true to the faith as also being Born Again as well.
Three cheers for Bishop Emilio Marquez!!
I can’t help but imagine that Governor Nantes would not have wanted a Catholic burial, and is probably relieved that his sister didn’t manage to procure one for him. At the same time, as someone else said on this forum, the funerals are for the living, not the dead. I hope, then, that the church was able to do something for HER even as it was doing the hand brush and ‘so there’ to him.
I don’t think it was done as “so there!” to the man. (If the Church was really in the business of “sticking it to” the dead, Ted Kennedy wouldn’t have had a Catholic funeral!)He obviously wasn’t a practicing Catholic (even if he had been baptized as an infant). His sister can have Masses said for him. That can be done for anyone, Catholic or not.
Excellent point!!! I think that the issue of Mr Kennedy was that he had a more liberal bishop in that area. I have noticed in my travels that some Catholic diocese are liberal and allow anyone to receive the sacraments while others are a Catholics may receive only type. When I asked my Catholic aunt to explain this under the assumption that Catholicism is an all or nothing religion, this was her reply.
I would guess it would be the same with posts to any thread on this forum, some doctrinal issue even I have found that some Catholics have various opinions on but it comes down to they all believe basically the same.
In truth, I haven’t noticed that the Catholics are all that vindictive–at least not now. Y’all USED to be pretty interesting about it, though. I think, also…isn’t it still policy to bury suicides in consecrated ground? (not an accusation, a question; this used to be the policy, but I’m not certain it still is.)
Hi Padrej,I also tend to agree with gamewell45 on this issue. The Church has the right whom it give Christian burial. The only problem I have with the original question is the line that the man was a “Born Again Christian.” I fully understand that it meant he was Protestant, BUT I also view Catholics who are true to the faith as also being Born Again as well.
With that being said, If the church, (Catholic in this case) has rules it must follow on burial practices they must be followed.
I despise to do a funeral of a person who may have been baptized eons ago and hardly EVER darkens the door of a church and the family wants you to make them sound like they are right next to Mother Theresa in how they lived. I love the sayings they use like “you don’t have to go to church to be a Christian” However, by the same token you do not have to go to a bar to get drunk either. My cousin the undertaker likes to remind me that a funeral is not for the dead but for the living.
I know full well that the term “born again” usually identifies a common Protestant doctrine. I am however going to have to disagree with you that not all Protestants do not recognize the difference between the eternal and temporal punishments for sin. To the evangelicals you are 100% correct. They see the verse of the Bible that states God equates all sin as equal and take that very literally. The more liturgical amongst the Protestant tend to divide categories (for lack of better tern at the hour I am writing this) into the same categories that Catholics do but under different names. The difference for a Protestant who may not believe in Purgatory (I say may not as there are some Anglicans that do and some Methodists that still believe in a “holding place”) is that they believe that Christ totally took the punishment for ALL sin.