God Hates Religion

[peeteyg]

I have a protestant friend that says that god hates religion. What would be a catholic response to this and is there any scriptural basis for or against?

 

[fermat]

Can you provide any context for your friends statement? What were you talking about when it came up. How does he, as a Christian, back that up?

This is a hard question to try an actually answer without more information.

 

[Cristian_B]

The important thing is what does your friend exactly mean by “religion”? What does religion mean to him? What does he think religion is? What does he understand by religion?

 

[Lancer]

I have a protestant friend that says that god hates religion. What would be a catholic response to this and is there any scriptural basis for or against?

I am sorry, but I don’t have an answer for your friend…but I do have a question:…
Is the sound of God’s voice a baritone?..tenor?..or maybe bass?..or something altogether different?

Pax Christi

 

[Crown_of_Thorns]

I have a protestant friend that says that god hates religion. What would be a catholic response to this and is there any scriptural basis for or against?

God does hate bad religion: “If anyone considers himself religious and yet does not keep a tight rein on his tongue, he deceives himself and his religion is worthless.” James 1.26

However, “Religion that God our Father accepts as pure and faultless is this: to look after orphans and widows in their distress and to keep oneself from being polluted by the world.” James 1.27

When Jesus attacked religion he attacked the corrupt & hypocritical religion of the religious leaders of his day. If only more protestants would read the letter of St. James, it would clear up so much division…

 

[Whitacre_Girl]

I wrote this a while back in response to some protestant friends saying the same thing:

Religion:

Main Entry: re·li·gion

1 a : the state of a religious (a nun in her 20th year of religion), the service and worship of God or the supernatural : commitment or devotion to religious faith or observance
2 : a personal set or institutionalized system of religious attitudes, beliefs, and practices
3 archaic : scrupulous conformity : conscientiousness
4 : a cause, principle, or system of beliefs held to with ardor and faith
— re·li·gion·less adjective

This is the meaning of the English word “religion” as defined by Mirriam-Webster’s online dictionary.

People use this to tell catholics why exactly we “miss the point.” If one focuses on, to the exclusion of all others, the second definition of the word this may work.

" A personal set or institutionalized system of religious attitudes, beliefs, and practices"

If one is following ONLY a personal or institutionalized system of beliefs, and focuses on this to the exclusion of all others, then I can see how the way the word is commonly twisted by evangelical preachers may hold true. I know how it works, it seems people forget I was in that circle. In order to convert people who have a bad taste of “religion” in their mouths that more than likely came from a stringent belief system forced on them by a demanding family, the meaning of the word “religion” is twisted to describe the faith they have shoved on them. Then the word “relationship” is interjected to show that Jesus seeks relationship. I hope to show that the true meaning of “religion” is synonymous with “relationship.” if not, in fact, relationship is defined by religion altogether.

Main Entry: re·la·tion·ship

1 : the state of being related or interrelated
2 : the relation connecting or binding participants in a relationship: as a : kinship b : a specific instance or type of kinship
3 a : a state of affairs existing between those having relations or dealings b : a romantic or passionate attachment

This works in the context of Jesus if we use specifically the third definition (although the first two apply to the trinity as well):

“a state of affairs existing between those having relations or dealings.”

But what is that state of affairs? We can pull from scripture on that: Deuteronomy 6:13, Deuteronomy 10:12, Deuteronomy 13:4 all deal with serving God. Matthew 4:10 is a statement by Jesus quite clearly that we worship and serve only God. Scripture makes it quite clear that we worship and serve God by following his commands, as well as by loving him. Especially since some of his commands deal specifically with love of God and love of others. Joshua 22:5

“But be very careful to keep the commandment and the law that Moses the servant of the LORD gave you: to love the LORD your God, to walk in all his ways, to obey his commands, to hold fast to him and to serve him with all your heart and all your soul.”

We are to talk in his ways (this is why he gave us a law to follow), we are to obey his commands (including those that mean to love), and serve him. These are all things included in the deifnition of “religion” as well.

1 a : the state of a religious (a nun in her 20th year of religion) b (1) : the service and worship of God or the supernatural (2) : commitment or devotion to religious faith or observance
2 : a personal set or institutionalized system of religious attitudes, beliefs, and practices
3 archaic : scrupulous conformity : conscientiousness
4 : a cause, principle, or system of beliefs held to with ardor and faith

I am religious.

1. I am in the service and worship of the most Holy God. I have a commitment and devotion to follow him in love and obedience.
2. I have an institutionalized set of beliefs that have been laid down by God in Holy Scriptures, and have been continued by the universal church that Christ established. I obey these so as to be obedient to God and his commands.
3. I am conscientious of God’s law, as David says in Psalm 119:12

“My soul is consumed with longing for your laws at all times.”

Or Psalm 119:105

“Your word is a lamp to my feet and a light for my path.”

1. I serve the cause of the Gospel with love and faith. I derive my principles from the love of God, and his commands. I hold to my system of belief (faith) with love and devotion.

THIS is true religion. When we examine the meaning of the word “religion” as defined in the English language with the faith that Christ preaches, we find truth, love and freedom. We are called to love others, and to love God. Loving God means an obedience, as does that in any relationship. I love my husband, therefore I am obedient to him. He may ask of me things that make no sense, but I follow that because I love him. The same is true of God and his laws. I follow his law and love the law because I love him. When you love God, following the law is only natural. Therefore, love of God (relationship) is necessary for religion in the first place, but is also part of the definition of religion as well:

" a cause, principle, or system of beliefs held to with ardor and faith" (emphasis mine)

Main Entry: ar·dor

1 a : an often restless or transitory warmth of feeling b : extreme vigor or energy : intensity c : zeal d : loyalty

A restless OR (not also) transitory warmth of feeling. Extreme Vigor. Intensity. Zeal. Loyalty. Otherwise known as “love.” I love the Gospel. I love Christ. To love Christ is to have TRUE religion as is defined by the standard of the english language.

So keep in mind when a christian says they hate religion or that God hates religion, they are saying that they hate: “the service and worship of God or the supernatural.”

 

[kimmielittle]

I have a protestant friend that says that god hates religion. What would be a catholic response to this and is there any scriptural basis for or against?

Hiyas

I would honestly ask your friend: Does God hate Religion OR do you… hate Religion?

If your friend says God does…I ask for their proof, or base, for their opinion.

Then I’d ask your friend: Do you believe in Jesus?

And then I’d ask… Is Jesus the son of God? I would leave it simple, don’t get into the Trinity ]

If your friend says no…They aren’t the Protestant / Christian they are saying they are.

If your friend says yes…Remind them of Jesus’ Religious time in the Temple.

When they acknowledge Jesus’ time in the Temple…State " then by your thoughts / reasoning… God hates Jesus?"

Sometimes the easiest logical way to disprove an illogical statement…is in simple terms ]

I hope this helps

 

[judechild]

I have a protestant friend that says that god hates religion. What would be a catholic response to this and is there any scriptural basis for or against?

I agree with Cristian B; ask him what religion means to him/her.

Your friend may respond that he/she is “spiritual” rather than “religious” which, while I’ve noticed that that is a very trendy thing to say in some protestant circles, it really doesn’t mean anything. If the friend says that God does not work through institutional means (another trendy thought), you might want to remind him/her that Israel was very much an institution, as well as an invisible reality.

 

[peeteyg]

I really appreciate the responses. We have had alot of debate recently on Free will and I have really pressed hard to show him the Catholic view. He is a Sola Scriptura Protestant. I think he really is internally torn between Reformed/Systematic theology and Catholicism. I think this is where the God hates religion comes from. I think he was taught that to deflect Our beliefs. I have pointed him to all passages that teach Free will and have pointed to the church fathers especially the Ante-Nicene fathers. I told him that he is basing his eternal salvation on the created theology of a couple of fallen Catholics. Now that is Apostasy if I ever saw it. When I speak of Dogma of the church he tells me I sound like a JW. Can you believe that. I finally did get him to read the church fathers and look at the Philosphy of Free Will. He asked me if I was a Pelagian or a semi-pelagian? I thought to myself this is good because he is learning about the truth. I told him I am either a Molonist or a Thomist (both catholic) but I am most likely a thomist. He has not brought up Free will again. I will let him think about it for a week or so and re ask the questions. I will quote someof these responses, it is kinda what I was thinking but not in such eloquent terms. Thanks.

PS I always debate with respect and love. Sometimes he takes off the gloves. It is his soul and the souls of his family I worry about. I love the dude, he is my best friend since childhood.

 

[kimmielittle]

I really appreciate the responses. We have had alot of debate recently on Free will and I have really pressed hard to show him the Catholic view. He is a Sola Scriptura Protestant. I think he really is internally torn between Reformed/Systematic theology and Catholicism. I think this is where the God hates religion comes from. I think he was taught that to deflect Our beliefs. I have pointed him to all passages that teach Free will and have pointed to the church fathers especially the Ante-Nicene fathers. I told him that he is basing his eternal salvation on the created theology of a couple of fallen Catholics. Now that is Apostasy if I ever saw it. When I speak of Dogma of the church he tells me I sound like a JW. Can you believe that. I finally did get him to read the church fathers and look at the Philosphy of Free Will. He asked me if I was a Pelagian or a semi-pelagian? I thought to myself this is good because he is learning about the truth. I told him I am either a Molonist or a Thomist (both catholic) but I am most likely a thomist. He has not brought up Free will again. I will let him think about it for a week or so and re ask the questions. I will quote someof these responses, it is kinda what I was thinking but not in such eloquent terms. Thanks.

PS I always debate with respect and love. Sometimes he takes off the gloves. It is his soul and the souls of his family I worry about. I love the dude, he is my best friend since childhood.

:clapping::clapping: