Good Reasons to Believe

[devonsams]

Hello, I wish some of the guys here could help me.

I have an atheist friend, he says that sometimes he wish he could believe in God, but he can’t do it because he can’t conciliate the rational part of him that our faith will make any sense to him.

He says: “Everything I believe I need good arguments to support it, when it is about the Catholic Faith, there is no good reason for doing this! There are some argument for God like the Cosmological Argument, the Moral Argument, the Ontological Argument, but some of them were already refuted, and they at best support a Deism view of God, it doesn’t support specifically the Catholic view, and they could be used by a muslim, by a jew… How can I be a catholic when there’s no good reason for being a catholic? There’s nothing, I mean, we just have to believe that Jesus is God…”

I told him that our faith is based in many things, the personal experience with God, that we truly believe that Jesus is God and the Wisest Man, that our religion is really the best religion, that it provides a knowledge of the world… But still he says that he needs more to believe, he says he needs good reasons to believe. Please how can I solve this? Thank you.

 

[sowinskija]

Looks t Saint Thomas Aquinas 5 proofs and look up stuff about infinite regression being impossible. Think about it logically. What is the earth made up of? Matter. Well where did that come from? The big bang. Where did that matter come from? Cosmic pressure/quantum junk/whatever they want to say next. Where did that come from? This process keeps repeating if you leave God out of the equation, creating the logical impossibility of infinite regression.

 

[cheezey]

Looks t Saint Thomas Aquinas 5 proofs and look up stuff about infinite regression being impossible. Think about it logically. What is the earth made up of? Matter. Well where did that come from? The big bang. Where did that matter come from? Cosmic pressure/quantum junk/whatever they want to say next. Where did that come from? This process keeps repeating if you leave God out of the equation, creating the logical impossibility of infinite regression.

HA!! I like this!! Excellent!!

 

[stephe1987]

The “refutations” to the proofs are based on false assumptions about God and/or Christianity. There are many websites that address these issues.

 

[SMA_12]

Well if he already is leaving the possibility open that God could exist, this is a good start.

From here you can make the following arguments:

1. Jesus Christ did indeed exist. The Romans were very good at keeping records, arguably the best of all of the ancient civilizations. There are by far more historical documents proving Jesus of Nazareth existed than there are proving Alexander the Great existed, yet no one doubts Alexander the Great ever existed.
2. Since we have established Christ was a real human being and did indeed exist, move on to examining His claims. He claimed to be the Son of God. Either he was indeed the Son of God, he was a lunatic out of his mind, or he was liar.
   

       a) If Jesus was a liar, and an incredible liar at that, this would mean he was indeed evil to make such claims. And what would have been the purpose of His lies? He had nothing to gain. He rejected earthly power and instead leads tax collectors, prostitutes, and fisherman as His disciples- while gaining enmity with those who were powerful and had the means to put Him to death. Even when on trial, and given the chance to spare His life, He sticks to His claims, knowing it would lead to His torture and death. No liar seeking earthly gain would do this.
   
      b) Well if Jesus was not a liar, then He could have been a lunatic. If He was, He was unlike any other lunatic this world has seen. Preaching such wisdom and love that has passed the scrutiny of time, such as He did on the Sermon on the Mount. The clever interactions and warm conversations He had with both His friends and His enemies are unlike those of any psychotic person. This is why when Jesus asks Peter, "Who do you say that I am?" Peter responds, "You are the Christ, Son of the living God." This leads me to the next point...
   
      c) If He is not a liar and He is not a lunatic, then next we need to explore His claim that He is the Son of God. Whether you believe them or not, Christ's miracles are no secret. The Bible and the Apostles claim Christ walked this earth raising the dead, walking on water, healing the blind and diseased, and so on. Not to forget the greatest miracle of them all The Resurrection. Could these all be lies? Well, today a single eye witness is enough to lock someone up for murder in our criminal justice system. What do you make of the thousands of eye witnesses to Christ's miracles, including The Resurrection? Not only were they willing to TESTIFY to these events and spend their entire lives preaching them, they were willing to SUFFER HORRENDOUS DEATHS before they renounced these beliefs! Peter was crucified for preaching what he believed, but he felt unworthy to die as Christ did, so he asked to be crucified upside down! In fact all of the Apostles, outside of John who died in exile for his preaching, were tortured and killed for the faith. I don't see how so many people could be so devoted to what they knew to be a lie, that they would accept such deaths.

3. So if Christ is indeed the Son of God, and therefor everything He said is Truth, then how do we which church has it right? Christ established His Church with Peter as the foundation and promised the gates of Hell shall not prevail against it Matthew 16:18. There is only one church who can historically trace its lineage back to Christ and the Apostles, the Catholic Church. All others were founded by mere men.

This is an argument that has had a profound effect on me. I basically took the argument from the book Made for More by Curtis Martin, as well as some talks I have listened to given by Matt Fradd and Chris Stefanick, which can probably be found on Youtube.

Good luck and God bless!

 

[cheezey]

Well if he already is leaving the possibility open that God could exist, this is a good start…
Good luck and God bless!

Wow. If I hadn’t already believed…Wow. This would do it.

Thank you.

 

[DavidFilmer]

Jesus Christ did indeed exist. The Romans were very good at keeping records, arguably the best of all of the ancient civilizations. There are by far more historical documents proving Jesus of Nazareth existed than there are proving Alexander the Great existed, yet no one doubts Alexander the Great ever existed.

But Alexander the Great was Greek (not Roman). While it is perfectly true that Jesus is far better attested to in the historic record than (the Greek) Alexander, I would claim that Alexander is not a very good example.

I would instead present the (Roman - duh) Emperor Nero. For 14 years, he ruled the greatest Empire of antiquity. During his reign, he was the most powerful man on earth. How many accounts of contemporary historians have survived?

Answer: Zero. Not one.

The VERY FIRST historic records of Nero’s reign (all TWO of them) were written 50 years AFTER his death. The THIRD account was written 150 years after his death (all of these historic accounts were written by Roman citizens, BTW).

Within 150 years of the Roman Emperor Nero’s death, a grand total of THREE historic records survive. Within 150 years of Jesus’ death (a condemned criminal who was not even a Roman citizen, and who was as far removed from the status of Roman Emperor as a man could be, and who was executed by a Roman procurator), not less than 60 historic records survive.

 

[SMA_12]

But Alexander the Great was Greek (not Roman). While it is perfectly true that Jesus is far better attested to in the historic record than (the Greek) Alexander, I would claim that Alexander is not a very good example.

I would instead present the (Roman - duh) Emperor Nero. For 14 years, he ruled the greatest Empire of antiquity. During his reign, he was the most powerful man on earth. How many accounts of contemporary historians have survived?

Answer: Zero. Not one.

The VERY FIRST historic records of Nero’s reign (all TWO of them) were written 50 years AFTER his death. The THIRD account was written 150 years after his death (all of these historic accounts were written by Roman citizens, BTW).

Within 150 years of the Roman Emperor Nero’s death, a grand total of THREE historic records survive. Within 150 years of Jesus’ death (a condemned criminal who was not even a Roman citizen, and who was as far removed from the status of Roman Emperor as a man could be, and who was executed by a Roman procurator), not less than 60 historic records survive.

Very interesting! Thank you. An even better example for the OP to use

 

[Markus2007]

Hello, I wish some of the guys here could help me.

I have an atheist friend, he says that sometimes he wish he could believe in God, but he can’t do it because he can’t conciliate the rational part of him that our faith will make any sense to him.

He says: “Everything I believe I need good arguments to support it, when it is about the Catholic Faith, there is no good reason for doing this! There are some argument for God like the Cosmological Argument, the Moral Argument, the Ontological Argument, but some of them were already refuted, and they at best support a Deism view of God, it doesn’t support specifically the Catholic view, and they could be used by a muslim, by a jew… How can I be a catholic when there’s no good reason for being a catholic? There’s nothing, I mean, we just have to believe that Jesus is God…”

I told him that our faith is based in many things, the personal experience with God, that we truly believe that Jesus is God and the Wisest Man, that our religion is really the best religion, that it provides a knowledge of the world… But still he says that he needs more to believe, he says he needs good reasons to believe. Please how can I solve this? Thank you.

Your friend has a good attitude. There is nothing wrong with seeking evidence for a beliefe system, or anything else that claims objective truth.

You need to go step-by-step and provide evidence for the following “building blocks” when evangelizing a complete atheist:

1. The Existence of God (Is there a God and why is it reasonable to believe so?)
2. The Word of God / The Bible (what did/does this God say and how do we know he really said it?)
3. The Son of God / Jesus Christ (who is this God? Which one of the different “gods” is the real one?)
4. The Religion of God / Christianity (has this God established a religion and if so, which one is it and why?)
5. The Church of God / The Catholic Church (has this God founded a Church on the earth, and if so which one is it and why?)

As I said it is good to go step-by-step and not let the conversation “jump around” inbetween the different “building blocks”. But, you still need to recognize that the different points are interconnected. For example, evidence that suggests God inspired the Bible is also evidence for a God to even exist.

You can find very strong evidences and very good arguments for each of those points online using Google or websites that you already know provide good information on these topics. I recommend either printing out a certain number of arguments and evidences for each point and creating a folder, or saving it to a folder on your computer. This way you can always find good ressources quickly and efficiently. You can also give away a folder like that if you print it out multiple times or burn it to a CD etc. (you may have to check copyright laws for this) to friends and family.

Some good examples:
“Twenty Arguments for the Existence of God” by Peter Kreeft: peterkreeft.com/topics-more/20_arguments-gods-existence.htm (good for atheists to start with)
The website “Scripture Catholic” which proves the Catholic Church by using Sacred Scripture only: scripturecatholic.com/ (good for protestants to make the final step)

One of many great speakers for these issues is William Lane Craig. I recommend you watch some of his videos on youtube.

If you are willing and able to spend some money, there are very many fantastic books out there providing very solid arguments why it is reasonable to believe in God and the Catholic Faith. Catholic Answers also sells many of them as far as I know.