Heightened Tensions over the Church Sexual Abuse Crisis

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aoliveras

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I wanted to get some thoughts regarding the renewed tensions with the sex abuse crisis in the Church.

Having gone through this in 2002, it still seems that the majority of the cases were and continue to be from the past. The reason this old wound has reopened is due to the revelation that a Cardinal (Theodore McCarrick) who was part of the original proceedings in 2002, was accused of sexual misconduct that had credible evidence supporting the allegations.

After watching the recent Kavanaugh hearings, it makes me wonder if this has gone too far. Have members of the Church adopted a mob rules mentality?
 
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I agree. We need to listen to God more intently in a time of crisis.
 
Well two events happened. The AG of the state of Pennsylvania formed a grand Jury and they issued a report which released the files they got from the dioceses, all but Philadelphia which was the target of an earlier investigation. The second was the investigation that the church did concerning Cardinal McCarrick, reported by Cardinal Dolan, that said, as I recall, that there was creditable allegations of sexual abuse against Cardinal M.

I read the Grand Jury report and learned the following:
After the scandal of 2000 the Bishops put out the information that about 3.5 % of the priest had been accused of pedophilia under 12 years of age. That was true but the whole truth is that about 8% were accused of abusing those under 18 years of age. In addition, the norm was to keep these accusations private, send the priest to rehabilitation and make settlements to the victim. After 2000 the cases were turned over to authorities and were fewer in number.

The result being that the Bishops have lost credibility with the faithful and the general public because of the cover-up and reassignment of offending priest.

IMO deservedly so. The Bishops are working very hard to regain credibility. We know that will happen but there is a lot of pain yet to come.

The Kavanaugh hearing is something entirely different and there is nothing to be learned with a comparison.
 
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aoliveras said:
After watching the recent Kavanaugh hearings, it makes me wonder if this has gone too far. Have members of the Church adopted a mob rules mentality?
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I don’t understand what you’re asking. Are you asking if we have gone too far in ferreting out the bad guys in the Church? Are you worried that Catholics are acting like a mob?
 
In many cases the money was for therapy. The victims wanted things kept secret in many cases also. Everyone was working to make the best deal for their interest.

What the Bishops didn’t act on was that the truth will set you free.
 
Most people have only exceedingly minimal understanding of how life-long the damage of sexual abuse can be. The priests who abused took more than just their innocence from them; in all too many circumstances, they lost their sense of self worth. Add to this the reaction of all too many - including parents, other priests and even bishops who either denied anything had happened, or downplayed it as a minor detail, or in the case of some, had the bishop actually accuse them of being the perpetrator. Cases which have been tried repeatedly and constantly show lives destroyed; victims wh turned to alcohol, and/or drugs, and some to suicide as they could not live with the consequences which descended upon them.

The damage was psychological and lasting, and is no different than if the priests had physically damaged them to the same extent.

We have a court system, and that is the only legal means of righting the wrongs which have occurred - and much of those wrongs are due to the devastation to those victims lives. Weh have moved beyond the “eye for an eye” form of justice, beyond the death feuds of old. Does it compensate the victims for their inability to hold a job, or to get a job, or to the families they tried to for which likewise ended in disaster (similar to what has occurred with soldiers who have serious PTSD)?

It gives them monetary compensation, but does not deal with the psychological damage. That might be ameliorated through psychological counseling after the court award, which might help the victim; but they will never be made whole.

They are our brothers and sisters, just as the poor are; just as the needy in our parishes are - and anyone else the Church reaches out to help. And yes, there are those among us who resent paying for the crimes of the priests, and the coverups which the bishops engaged in. Having read the Gospels and Epistles more than a few times, I do not get the message that the victims are not our responsibility.

It is astoundingly false that paying money to the victims does nothing at all. It will not make them whole again, but it does in part. Would you suggest we simply tell the victims “Oh, I’m sorry.” and then go on our merry way?
 
I think it’s important to thank your priest, even just briefly, on the way out of church. It can be lonely. 99% of the priests have nothing to do with the scandal. For whatever reason, some Catholics lump all priests together with the few bad ones, and this isn’t fair to all the good guys who gave up their lives for Jesus.
 
Thank you for the clarifications. My only thought with regards to the Kavanaugh hearings was the idea of innocence until proven guilty. I remember back in the early 2000s there were a lot of off-color jokes about priests and male children, and a general mistrust of the priesthood and an exodus from the Church.

Another point from what I recall is that the John Jay report did not find a higher incidence of sexual abuse in the Church than in other secular institutions (e.g., schools). Much of the press is focused on the Church (both from the secular media, as well as Catholic affiliated outlets). Not that of course the Church should not be held to a higher standard.
 
I agree, Joy. Anybody can come back 35 years later and say anything, and will if there are anti-Catholic groups willing to foot the bills for lawyers to shake down the Church.
 
You have never faced a deposition by a skilled lawyer. In the thousands of cases of sexual molestation by priests, have there been a handful of cases which were false claims? Undoubtedly - I personally know of one. But your wide ranging broad accusation needs some corroboration other than just throwing it out there. and that does not justify turning our backs on the thousands who were abused. Nor does it say the system (that is, our justice system) is a farce, or is nothing more than “make a charge and obtains millions”. It simply does not work that way.

Not only are there attorneys for the various dioceses, but there are also attorneys for the various insurance companies who have been faced with addressing allegations - and none of those attorneys are slouches at defending the dioceses from false charges.
 
Oh, I have absolutely no doubt that the devil is fast at work, not only from the original evil perpetrated upon the victims, but also on the dioceses and archdioceses which have been brought to bankruptcy.

However, just as it has been said that God can bring good out of evil, God is bringing the dioceses and archdioceses to an accounting through the judicial system.

Do you really think that the Church - meaning the laity as well as the religious - would be putting in the effort they have been over seeing that children are protected? I can’t speak for you diocese, but ours is relentless in finding ways to see that children are protected. And my archdiocese has repeatedly sought out the victims to assist them in obtaining counseling. This has not been swept under the carpet out here.
 
You seem to be objecting to the large settlements which victims have obtained, and the fact that these large settlements have brought a number of dioceses and archdioceses to bankruptcy.

However, I most strongly disagree with you that “money was thrown” at any victims. The judicial aspect has been thoroughly vetted; no one that I know of or have heard of has made an allegation and walked away with money without having to go into great detail, not just over the acts, but also to prove they were damaged.

And your allegation they are being told to “go and keep quiet and move along” is meritless. That may be your feeling, but your feeling is not supported by evidence.
 
aoliveras said:
Have members of the Church adopted a mob rules mentality?
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Totes McGotes. We should ignore all claims of abuse unless the accusers present both DNA and high-definition video evidence. Also multiple witnesses.
 
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It is my assessment, having watched this issue since the 1983 criminal conviction of a priest I knew personally, that it is the judgements in civil court which have forced the Church to do something.

I am well aware of the cost to the Church. That is money. The failure of the Church to adequately address the matter for decades, and the almost utter destruction to thousands upon thousands of innocent children is the cause of the economic loss. And I see no one saying that the Church was going to wake up, and that this was going to occur because of the overwhelming response of the bishops back then, or for a long time since the beginning, subsequent bishops.

When I look at the destruction of lives, and I compare it to the loss of money - we are getting off cheap. Will missions of the Church be set back? Undoubtedly.

But those children in those Catholic schools are far less likely to have a predator priest preying on them. Where do you think many of the predator priests found their potential victims? Hint: in those same schools.

In short, the economic damage to the various dioceses is what is going to protect those children in those Catholic schools. Some schools may not survive.

And whose fault is that? Not the victims, not the attorneys who represent those victims. It is the predator priests who have caused this, and the bishops who grossly mishandled the whole affair.

One can ask “Is this fair to the kids now?” No, it is not fair, but no one, including Christ in the Gospels ever promised “fairness”. We all get to suffer for the sins of the past. And hopefully, the dioceses having been brought to their knees economically will never forget the lesson they have been forced to learn.

I am also well aware of the anti-Catholic backlash; again, what is the source of that? The victims? Their attorneys? The court awards and the settlements? No - it has been brought on by the predator priests and the massive failure of multiple bishops.

The irony is that the bishops feared that information concerning the predation would harm the Church, and their very act of hiding the scandal is what has resulted in such a whiplash reaction. Yes, had they been transparent about the matters, there would have been some economic damage but it would have been far more isolated. But they chose to sweep it under the rug. Much (although certainly not all) of the reaction has been the abject refusal to deal with the victims and hope that it would all “go away”.
 
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I think your question begs another question. Why is it that we have been brought to a place by our leadership where we had to act like a mob to get something done about it? The world seems to act like a pendulum. Our church leadership swung it hard in a bad direction and you have to swing it hard the other way until we find a place in the middle. The question is on the bishops and cardinals to answer. Once trust has been so profoundly and viley violated, it’s a long road back.

All the best!
 
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Shasta-Rose, this is an EXCELLENT point that should be made by people more frequently. By the way, my understanding is that the Church HAS done a good job of cleaning things up after 2002 regarding children. 99% of the priests have nothing to do with the whole scandal.
And, why isn’t there an attack on public schools, where there are far more abuses of children? Answer: because public schools promote socialism, sexual oddities, and the rest of the Leftist agenda to kids at young ages.
 
You have to take into account that it takes approximately 30-35 years for those who were abused to speak.
 
Clergy Misbehavior in the US
Seminaries of all denominations and continuing clergy formation has to deal with its hetero, homo, and “ambigusexual” realities rather than teach that sexuality can be prayed away or is merely an issue for the Catholic Church. Future clergy should be taught how to make healthy boundaries, protect themselves from predators, report wrongdoings, and if need be defend themselves against false accusations, and above all to hold oneself accountable and leave if the vocation is not for them. And there needs to be an accountability of the psychiatric community that has released predators they have considered “healed”.
There have never been serious or otherwise well defined courses on the sexuality of religious leaders. The belief is that one can pray away any sexual desires. And, the common perception that clergy must be “held to a higher standard” that we would never hold ourselves, entertainers, or our sports people to meeting. The pat answer of “they should allow Catholic clergy to get married” will not address the issue of homosexuality or pedophilia in any church or religion. And, as we know, marriage does not solve all ills.
The over reaction would be to have a site like“bishopaccountability.org” that has Catholic clergy and religious listed even if exonerated, or release lists of people convicted or long dead for “transparency” . No other religion or school system is held to such a standard whereby lists of people accused are there forever even if exonerated; there is no anti defamation league for Catholics. The site tends more toward an occasion of slander rather than advocate of “freedom of speech”. The creation of “lay councils” as over watch groups that can be either alt left or alt right (to coin republican and democrat party terms) can lead to a congregationalism that can be rather divisive. This approach has yielded the annual division of Christian denominations based merely on who gets along with whom rather than what is believed (over 30,000 different ones in the US alone). But in the case of the Catholic Church, the awful few makes press and Catholics are rather easy target if not for the front page news they get when something goes wrong, but for the fact Catholics do not have an anti defamation league to end people’s careers if slandered or falsely accused. The judicial system has two tracks- civil and criminal. Criminal clergy should be prosecuted and never allowed to minister again in any religion. Multimillion dollar settlements in the civil cases that go beyond psychological help and money lost from not being able to work, hurt congregations (as their collection money support given churches) and end up being more about revenge rather than a search for equity. Many Christians believe that they are “called to ministry”; in this vain, if they ignore when they are called out of ministry, they must face the consequences of society. The “some” is not the all, and the majority that does well barely makes press anymore
 
1cthlctrth said:
Shasta-Rose, this is an EXCELLENT point that should be made by people more frequently. By the way, my understanding is that the Church HAS done a good job of cleaning things up after 2002 regarding children. 99% of the priests have nothing to do with the whole scandal.
And, why isn’t there an attack on public schools, where there are far more abuses of children? Answer: because public schools promote socialism, sexual oddities, and the rest of the Leftist agenda to kids at young ages.
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You’re suggesting that SNAP and the other activists would be fine with sexual abuse so long as socialism got taught. For that matter, you’re suggesting that leftists are okay with child molestation as long as their political points get promoted. That’s demonstrably untrue.

And, while it’s true that the American Church is markedly better post-2002 than it was before 2002, that’s irrelevant. So is the record of non-Church organizations. The Church is supposed to be better than the rest. Impugning the motives of those who rightly call the Church to task for its failures is counterproductive and immoral.
 
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