Help with Sirach 12:2-3

[awalt]

This passage seems to imply that God hates sinners! Here is what Oxford COmmentary says, I have not found anything that EXPLAINS what is meant. Can anyone help, this seems wrong??

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What is most striking about this passage, however, is the vigorous insistence that one should only do good to the just, and give no comfort to the wicked (12:2–3) and even that God hates sinners (12:6). Cf. the Qumran Rule of the Community, where those who enter the covenant commit themselves to hate all the sons of darkness, with the implication that God detests them (1QS 1:4, 10). A similar proverb is found in Midr. Qoh. Rab. 5. 8f. §5 (Soncino edn.): ‘Do no good to an evil person and harm will not come to you; for if you do good to an evil person, you have done wrong.’ The contrast with the teaching of Jesus in the NT is obvious (Mt 5:43–8; Lk 6:27–8, 32–6). But the idea that God hates sinners is also exceptional in Jewish literature. Contrast Wis 11:24: ‘For you love all things that exist, and detest none of the things that you have made, for you would not have made anything if you had hated it.’%between% 1

 

[Nan_S]

awalt:

This passage seems to imply that God hates sinners! … What is most striking about this passage, however, is the vigorous insistence that one should only do good to the just, and give no comfort to the wicked (12:2–3) and even that God hates sinners (12:6).

OK, I’m no trained theologian, but here goes IMHO:

First, remember this is OT. Reading all of Sirach Chapters 11 and 12, the writer is admonishing us, basically, to avoid the near occasion of sin. The Israelites had a lot of trouble with this; they kept inviting, even welcoming, the Baal-worshippers into their midst. Look what God had to do over and over to purge the Israelites of their sinful leaders. The writer instructs us to shun the evil ones and do not allow them to tempt you to turn from God. Rather, do everything possible to rid yourself and your community of their influence. Today, if you do not have the benefit of the armor of the Holy Spirit, this is still a good fall-back position.

In the NT, Jesus prepared His followers to convert the whole world. In contrast with the Israel of the OT, who had to isolate themselves from the foreigners and purge themselves of foreign influence, Jesus disciples were instructed to embrace the foreigners and love them. The NT disciples could do this because they had the benefit two things the Israelites did not have. Jesus clarified the rules for living as a Child of God, and the Holy Spirit filled them to keep them focused on God and (mostly) immune from evil influences.

As I said, I’m no trained theologian, so I defer to whoever follows me with a better explanation.

 

[Subrosa]

The writer advises against generosity to those who would abuse it.

 

[Huiou_Theou]

This is a common theme.

Mat7:5 Thou hypocrite, first cast out the beam out of thine own eye; and then shalt thou see clearly to cast out the mote out of thy brother’s eye.
Mat7:6 Give not that which is holy unto the dogs, neither cast ye your pearls before swine, lest they trample them under their feet, and turn again and rend you.
Mat7:7 Ask, and it shall be given you; seek, and ye shall find; knock, and it shall be opened unto you:
Mat7:8 For every one that asketh receiveth; and he that seeketh findeth; and to him that knocketh it shall be opened.

God does “hate” sinners, but it is not the hate of malice, but rather the hate of seperation.

Mal1:2 I have loved you, saith the LORD. Yet ye say, Wherein hast thou loved us? Was not Esau Jacob’s brother? saith the LORD: yet I loved Jacob,
Mal1:3 And I hated Esau, and laid his mountains and his heritage waste for the dragons of the wilderness.

Esau chose to marry into a different family.

Ge28:6 When Esau saw that Isaac had blessed Jacob, and sent him away to Padanaram, to take him a wife from thence; and that as he blessed him he gave him a charge, saying, Thou shalt not take a wife of the daughters of Canaan;
Ge28:7 And that Jacob obeyed his father and his mother, and was gone to Padanaram;
Ge28:8 And Esau seeing that the daughters of Canaan pleased not Isaac his father;
Ge28:9 Then went Esau unto Ishmael, and took unto the wives which he had Mahalath the daughter of Ishmael Abraham’s son, the sister of Nebajoth, to be his wife.

He went his own way, married into corruption. Ishmael is the son Abraham sent away without the ultimate promise. Hence Esau, who sold his birthright, marries someone with a lesser claim.

Ge36:8 Thus dwelt Esau in mount Seir: Esau is Edom.
Ge36:9 And these are the generations of Esau the father of the Edomites in mount Seir:

The Edomites would be at war with Israel, later.

2Ki8:21 So Joram went over to Zair, and all the chariots with him: and he rose by night, and smote the Edomites which compassed him about, and the captains of the chariots: and the people fled into their tents.
2Ki8:22 Yet Edom revolted from under the hand of Judah unto this day. Then Libnah revolted at the same time.

And loose. The nation served Israel.

1Chr18:13 And he put garrisons in Edom; and all the Edomites became David’s servants. Thus the LORD preserved David whithersoever he went.

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Again, the theme shows up in the psalms.

Psa5:5 The foolish shall not stand in thy sight: thou hatest all workers of iniquity.
Psa5:6 Thou shalt destroy them that speak leasing: the LORD will abhor the bloody and deceitful man.

Psa11:4 The LORD is in his holy temple, the LORD’s throne is in heaven: his eyes behold, his eyelids try, the children of men.
Psa11:5 The LORD trieth the righteous: but the wicked and him that loveth violence his soul hateth.
Psa11:6 Upon the wicked he shall rain snares, fire and brimstone, and an horrible tempest: this shall be the portion of their cup.

and the psalm which shows the correct sense:

Psa26:4 I have not sat with vain persons, neither will I go in with dissemblers.
Psa26:5 I have hated the congregation of evil doers; and will not sit with the wicked.
Psa26:6 I will wash mine hands in innocency: so will I compass thine altar, O LORD:

One does not have to hate with malice, but one cannot allow the wicked (malicious) to use one’s gifts against them. You do not arm an enemy – although you can love them, you may not be able to live with them. (self defense).

 

[awalt]

Thanks, good explanations!