History of Protestant criticism

[Jerusalem]

Hello Everyone,

My question is for those who know a little bit of in-depth historical info. about the Reformers.

So I have three questions really.

1.) Who was the First reformer or person to begin the idea that the Church radically
changed after Constantine and was perverted from its true form?

2.) Who was the first reformer or person to charge that the Catholic Church adopted
paganism and pagan rites into her worship?

3.) Can you site the 1st time this idea is recorded and intro. into human history in a
book?

If you can answer any of these questions I would appreciate it. I don’t believe any of these bc. Catholic customs came out of Judaism. But I’m debating someone and need to locate the orgin of these ideas to trace them to their source. No need to defend the Catholic faith. I’m Catholic I just want some research.

 

[Little_Mary]

I don’t know where to send you but I have a little unsolicited advice…

Make the person you are in a dialogue with prove it. He makes the claim, he better be able to back it up or you throw it out.

 

[freerf]

Hello Everyone,

My question is for those who know a little bit of in-depth historical info. about the Reformers.

So I have three questions really.

1.) Who was the First reformer or person to begin the idea that the Church radically
changed after Constantine and was perverted from its true form?

2.) Who was the first reformer or person to charge that the Catholic Church adopted
paganism and pagan rites into her worship?

3.) Can you site the 1st time this idea is recorded and intro. into human history in a
book?

If you can answer any of these questions I would appreciate it. I don’t believe any of these bc. Catholic customs came out of Judaism. But I’m debating someone and need to locate the orgin of these ideas to trace them to their source. No need to defend the Catholic faith. I’m Catholic I just want some research.

The best arguement against a Protestant (and I’m one) is that you believe God has lead you to the Catholic Church, that you experience the love of Jesus there, that you love Jesus Christ son of God, etc. This is usually effective in diverting the contentious conversation into a more spirit-filled and Christian one.

 

[Barbkw]

You might show this person Justin Martyr’s apology in 150 A.D. He wrote two apologies, and in them Justin talks about the Mass and the ‘eucharistified’ bread and the wine.

ststephens1928.org/Justin’s%20Apology.htm

Justin was greatly annoyed that the pagan cult Mithra was stealing their Eucharist celebration:

forums.catholic-questions.org/showthread.php?t=20639

en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mithraic_mysteries

Justin Martyr (a Greek pagan convert to Christianity) wrote:

"^ Justin Martyr, First Apology, ch. 66:

"For the apostles, in the memoirs composed by them, which are called Gospels, have thus delivered unto us what was enjoined upon them; that Jesus took bread, and when He had given thanks, said,

"This do ye in remembrance of Me, this is My body; "and that, after the same manner, having taken the cup and given thanks,

He said, "This is My blood; "and gave it to them alone.

Which the wicked devils have imitated in the mysteries of Mithras, commanding the same thing to be done. For, that bread and a cup of water are placed with certain incantations in the mystic rites of one who is being initiated, you either know or can learn."

 

[Epistemes]

1.) Who was the First reformer or person to begin the idea that the Church radically changed after Constantine and was perverted from its true form?

Arius of Alexandria.

2.) Who was the first reformer or person to charge that the Catholic Church adopted paganism and pagan rites into her worship?

Whoever wrote the Gospel of Judas.

3.) Can you site the 1st time this idea is recorded and intro. into human history in a book?

I would say Celsus’ “True Word.”

Protestant-ism has been alive and well in the Church since its beginning. It need to only be relegated to the 15th/16th century.

 

[mackbrislawn]

Hello Everyone,

My question is for those who know a little bit of in-depth historical info. about the Reformers.

So I have three questions really.

1.) Who was the First reformer or person to begin the idea that the Church radically
changed after Constantine and was perverted from its true form?

2.) Who was the first reformer or person to charge that the Catholic Church adopted
paganism and pagan rites into her worship?

3.) Can you site the 1st time this idea is recorded and intro. into human history in a
book?

If you can answer any of these questions I would appreciate it. I don’t believe any of these bc. Catholic customs came out of Judaism. But I’m debating someone and need to locate the orgin of these ideas to trace them to their source. No need to defend the Catholic faith. I’m Catholic I just want some research.

In regards to 2), there is a book The Paganism in Our Christianity by a person named Arthur Weigall. Early 20th century I believe. He was an atheist and according to him almost everything Christian is also pagan! There was a thread in CA about this topic back in 2006. Something like “Arthur Weigall and Paganism in Christianity.”

Heck, in my opinion, paganism in Christianity began with the New Testament language itself, Greek, a pagan language. So if Catholicism has paganism in it, so does Protestantism.