Holy Spirit Bible question

[Wife.of.Gabriel]

In Luke 3:16, John says Jesus’s baptism would not just be for the forgiveness of sins as his baptism was, but would also give the baptised the Holy Spirit, in John 14:16, 17, 26; 15:26 Jesus says He’ll ask later & the Father will send the Holy Spirit and in John 20:21-23 Jesus breathed the Holy Spirit into 10 of the Apostles just as He’d promised… so my confusion is where we find in Luke 1:15, 35, 41, 67; 2:26, Acts 1:16 where John, Elizabeth, Zechariah, Simeon & King David are all said to be filled with the Holy Spirit Before Jesus breathed the Holy Spirit into His Apostles & Before Pentecost described in Acts 2:4. Of course, the Holy Spirit is the One Same Spirit, so how was the Holy Spirit being here different After Jesus, then Before Jesus Ascended to Heaven? Like why did He “send Him”, if He’s already been here the whole time?

 

[rose321]

In Luke 3:16, John says Jesus’s baptism would not just be for the forgiveness of sins as his baptism was, but would also give the baptised the Holy Spirit, in John 14:16, 17, 26; 15:26 Jesus says He’ll ask later & the Father will send the Holy Spirit and in John 20:21-23 Jesus breathed the Holy Spirit into 10 of the Apostles just as He’d promised… so my confusion is where we find in Luke 1:15, 35, 41, 67; 2:26, Acts 1:16 where John, Elizabeth, Zechariah, Simeon & King David are all said to be filled with the Holy Spirit Before Jesus breathed the Holy Spirit into His Apostles & Before Pentecost described in Acts 2:4. Of course, the Holy Spirit is the One Same Spirit, so how was the Holy Spirit being here different After Jesus, then Before Jesus Ascended to Heaven? Like why did He “send Him”, if He’s already been here the whole time?

Respectfully >>good question and the same question I had a long time ago. Thus went in search for answers. Answer is long but within the whole
Bible gives the answer also. Short answer, John Baptist, Jesus Apostles, all being born and raised in the Faith and Belief of their ancient forefathers and their Holy Scripture was OT. Holy Spirit is not new to them is it? God said I Will >places His Holy Spirit those he chooses?

But this would All be new to the ears, of Gentles, Pagans, non believers etc would it not be?

Peace

 

[Wife.of.Gabriel]

So basically the Holy Spirit was already poured out but limited to the lineage of the Hebrews/Jews of the OT times - like Abraham, Moses, King David, Zechariah, Simeon, etc., but what Jesus was talking about with sending the Holy Spirit with breathing into the Apostles & Pentecost & Baptism is that the Holy Spirit is now poured out onto everyone including the Greeks/Gentiles… is that what you’re saying?

 

[Vico]

…

There were justified people in time before the resurrection of Jesus Christ but they could not get to Heaven until after Christ came. Remember the triumphant descent of Christ into Hades?

Hebrews 11:13, 11:39-40:

13 All these died according to faith, not having received the promises, but beholding them afar off, and saluting them, and confessing that they are pilgrims and strangers on the earth.
…
39 And all these being approved by the testimony of faith, received not the promise;
40 God providing some better thing for us, that they should not be perfected without us.

1 Peter 3:19-20

19 In which also coming he preached to those spirits that were in prison:
20 Which had been some time incredulous, when they waited for the patience of God in the days of Noe, when the ark was a building: wherein a few, that is, eight souls, were saved by water.

1 Peter 4:6

6 For, for this cause was the gospel preached also to the dead: that they might be judged indeed according to men, in the flesh; but may live according to God, in the Spirit.

 

[guanophore]

Like why did He “send Him”, if He’s already been here the whole time?

There was a particular ministry of the Holy Spirit to the Church that did not begin until after Jesus Ascended. During the time Jesus was with them, the HS was “with” the Apostles also:

John 14:17
17 even the Spirit of truth, whom the world cannot receive, because it neither sees him nor knows him; you know him, for he dwells with you, and will be in you.

But the manner in which the HS indwelt did not come until after Pentecost.

Did all the Apostles/Disciples have Jesus’ baptism? The record does not show they did. How were they cleansed of their sins?

John 15:3 You are already made clean by the word which I have spoken to you.

God works in many and mysterious ways. His Spirit came “upon” certain persons in the OT. His Spirit worked through the 72 as they preached, healed and cast out demons. Yet something qualitatively different occurred on Pentecost.

 

[rose321]

There were justified people in time before the resurrection of Jesus Christ but they could not get to Heaven until after Christ came. Remember the triumphant descent of Christ into Hades?

Respectfully opinion only.
Who can only justify?
And who justified before Jesus came?
Where was Enoch? Abraham? Moses? Elijah? King David? His Prophets who also suffered great persecution and die for the One True God they were called to serve, where they all waiting in Hades till Jesus die and resurrected?

Remember Moses, Elijah met with Jesus on the mount? Talking thousands of years since the beginning of time and hundred of years apart?

Jesus commands his listening audience to search the Scriptures >> What Scriptures, for there was no New Testament, it did not exist till decades later after Jesus death?

Jesus and even St Paul heavily quote from OT, refers to throughout His Teaching, Preaching, does he not?
Jesus puts questions to the Elders of His own Temple, Pharisees, Sadduccees, >>
What did Isaiah say?
What did King David mean when he said? My Lord said to My Lord?
Sign> Like Jonah, 3 days and 3 nights?
Jesus Mentions and quotes from Enoch? Noah? Abraham? Moses? King David? Hosea? Isaiah? 1 Samuel? Isaiah? Job? Jonah? Elijah? Jeremiah? etc

Learn’t from a wise one>> want to understand Jesus his sayings go back to the OT >>>all flows then and gives understanding to, interesting.

Same with words, go back to the first time the word was used in the Bible to get understanding of the word and how it was used and where it was used. Why was Jesus upset with the Pharisees and Saduccees?
Why were they grafted off and why we grafted on, but told do not do what they did or we too will be grafted off from the Natural Tree?
To know, do we have to seek within the OT do we not, for those answers?
Then there is prophecy of Jeremiah 31:31-35 has this been fulfilled yet?
Interesting. Peace

For, for this cause was the gospel preached also to the dead: that they might be judged indeed according to men, in the flesh; but may live according to God, in the Spirit.

What did Luke 9:60 mean let the dead bury their dead?
Matthew 8:22, mean let the dead bury their dead?
Rev 3:1 To the angel of the church of Sardis write?>>stating you are alive but you are dead?
Mark 12:27 : “He is not the God of the dead but of the living”
Number 11:25
How many Biblical verses are there about the Spiritual dead?
What does that mean?
Commanded to by Jesus to>Test all Spirits? Why?

Can one be alive but yet be Spiritual dead?

Did all the Apostles/Disciples have Jesus’ baptism? The record does not show they did. How were they cleansed of their sins?

To many to mention or list on the Topic of Repentance in the OT which God gives instruction to, Repent return to Me and I WILL return to you. John Baptist continues calling out Repent Repent. And Isaiah has a whole chapter on this and what God desires when one transgresses His Laws, Interesting.

So many questions Peace

 

[Vico]

…

Yes, the justified were all waiting in Hades (the underworld) till Jesus resurrected.
Yes, Jeremiah 31:31-35 has been fulfilled in the New Covenant (Matt 26:28).

Luke 9:60, Matt. 8:22 - spiritual must be preferred to even necessary practical matters.
Mark 12:27 - he speaks to the resurrection of the dead to eternal life in spirit (for the justified) and the resurrection of the body to eternal life (in either heaven or hell), which the Sadducees did not believe.

Yes, one can one be alive but yet be spiritually dead, as is the case of the fallen here and forever in hell. Thus we have the sacraments of the dead and the sacraments of the living.

The death of the soul occurs when God forsakes the soul, as the death of the body when the soul forsakes the body. Yet, at the Parousia, both the soul (living or dead) and body will be reunited eternally.

According to the Council of Trent, the only formal cause of justification must be a created grace rather than uncreated grace (which is the Holy Spirit).

 

[Reuben_J]

I guess it is in the context of New Covenant. Things were quite different after Jesus came and after his resurrection. The Messiah had come and the forgiveness of sins for those who believe.

When Jesus was on earth, the focus was on him, so to speak. When he died (not around physically), a new era came about. Essentially what we experience now is that presence of Jesus as he was two thousand years ago but instead of his physical presence we have the Holy Spirit, who will be our Advocate, to speak for/to us on who Jesus is.

Thus Jesus sending of the Holy Spirit to all who believe rather than just the few disciples. In other word, we have the Church.

God bless.