S
Skenned
Guest
Hello-
I am in a discussion with my friend who is an evangelist Christian. So, we’re having a good discussion.
One of his arguments is that a Christian can never lose his salvation. When I show him verses of people that have stopped following Jesus, he says that’s because they were never really saved in the first place.
I don’t think that’s a persuasive argument, however, I was reading John 6:60-71, specifically 6:64 *“But there are some of you who do not believe.” Jesus knew from the beginning the ones who would not believe and the one who would betray him." *talking about his disciples who have fallen away because of his discourse on “eating His flesh” which seems to indicate they were his disciples but really did not believe. I know he might cite this as proof of his argument that, although disciples, they were not really “saved” and that’s why they fell away.
I would counter this by saying that Jesus was God, therefore he had knowledge and could see the heart of a person and knew who would be saved and who would not be saved, but we, ordinary fallible human beings, could not really judge the sincerity of a person who says they are a follower of Jesus.
How else might this argument be neutralized, that people who turn away from Jesus were not really true believers in the first place, and as a result once saved, always saved. How can I explain to him that John 6:64 does not support this?
Thanks Sean
I am in a discussion with my friend who is an evangelist Christian. So, we’re having a good discussion.
One of his arguments is that a Christian can never lose his salvation. When I show him verses of people that have stopped following Jesus, he says that’s because they were never really saved in the first place.
I don’t think that’s a persuasive argument, however, I was reading John 6:60-71, specifically 6:64 *“But there are some of you who do not believe.” Jesus knew from the beginning the ones who would not believe and the one who would betray him." *talking about his disciples who have fallen away because of his discourse on “eating His flesh” which seems to indicate they were his disciples but really did not believe. I know he might cite this as proof of his argument that, although disciples, they were not really “saved” and that’s why they fell away.
I would counter this by saying that Jesus was God, therefore he had knowledge and could see the heart of a person and knew who would be saved and who would not be saved, but we, ordinary fallible human beings, could not really judge the sincerity of a person who says they are a follower of Jesus.
How else might this argument be neutralized, that people who turn away from Jesus were not really true believers in the first place, and as a result once saved, always saved. How can I explain to him that John 6:64 does not support this?
Thanks Sean