How should the Church deal with Confirmations/Communions

[sevenswords]

Not sure if this has been asked a million times or not?
This past Saturday we had the privilege of taking our eldest son to make his confirmation, we discussed the meaning a lot and how best to prepare for the day and sat in the front row and watched as he and his class mates of 30 kids made their confirmation. It was all i could do to sit still in the church as two grown men sat behind me and talked the whole way through mass and when the church verbally together reject satan as we recite our baptismal vows, the guy behind me loudly said No so he was rejecting God and yet stood with his hand on the child’s shoulder as God parent when she received the oil and blessing.
The next day being Sunday we went to mass and as I expected none of the kids that made their confirmation the day before were there,except one who was the alter girl.
So my question is this, Is the confirmation of a child who never goes to mass and never intends on going to mass again valid?
I mean these kids are brought up Atheists and live like Atheists
what is the church to do as i feel it is a mockery to God to have a whole bunch of Atheists line up and receive the Holy Eucharist, would it happen with any other religion?
Just looking for other view points as I feel hopeless watching the church pews get emptier every year and only used for social occasions.
God Bless

 

[1ke]

So my question is this, Is the confirmation of a child who never goes to mass and never intends on going to mass again valid?

Yes it is valid. It is the bishop who does the confirming, not the candidate.

As to whether it is fruitful or not, that’s a different question.

what is the church to do as i feel it is a mockery to God to have a whole bunch of Atheists line up and receive the Holy Eucharist

You do not know that these children are “atheists”.

The Church already has in place canons that address the readiness of the candidates vis-a-vis preparation, disposition, and pastor recommendation. If that is not being done where you are, then talk to the pastor or the diocesan Curia office rather than throwing around wild accusations on the internet.

 

[Vico]

…

Well, sacraments received are not always fruitful. Remember the parable of the sower explained.

The Parable of the Sower Explained, Mark 4:

13 And he saith to them: Are you ignorant of this parable? and how shall you know all parables? 14 He that soweth, soweth the word. 15 And these are they by the way side, where the word is sown, and as soon as they have heard, immediately Satan cometh and taketh away the word that was sown in their hearts. 16 And these likewise are they that are sown on the stony ground: who when they have heard the word, immediately recieve it with joy. 17 And they have no root in themselves, but are only for a time: and then when tribulation and persecution ariseth for the word they are presently scandalized. 18 And others there are who are sown among thorns: these are they that hear the word, 19 And the cares of the world, and the deceitfulness of riches, and the lusts after other things entering in choke the word, and it is made fruitless. 20 And these are they who are sown upon the good ground, who hear the word, and receive it, and yield fruit, the one thirty, another sixty, and another a hundred.

 

[Ann_Stanton]

Confirmation is valid. Perhaps, the young people were away that weekend and went to a different church. The Holy Spirit may inspire them to practice their faith.

 

[Dlee]

The next day being Sunday we went to mass and as I expected none of the kids that made their confirmation the day before were there,except one who was the alter girl.

As you expected? Pretty judgmental ahead of time. How do you know they didn’t attend Mass at a different time or parish?

I mean these kids are brought up Atheists and live like Atheists
what is the church to do as i feel it is a mockery to God to have a whole bunch of Atheists line up and receive the Holy Eucharist,

Again, how do you know this?
As for the man who answered “no” perhaps he that he was supposed to answer No -
Don’t project your negative attitudes to your son.
The bishop performed the confirmations and they are valid.

 

[His_helpmeet]

In some rural communities where there are “cluster” or “mission” parishes, many parishes may do Confirmation together so the bishop only has to come once because there are so few candidates from each parish. These young people would be attending Mass in their home parishes.

 

[Tis_Bearself]

The situation you describe with the dad making a mockery out of the whole thing is regrettable and I wish it didn’t occur. (Although as someone else mentioned, perhaps the man simply got confused as to what he was supposed to say - it happens.)

However, let’s hope that for some of those kids, the Holy Spirit will take root despite whatever is going on with the parents. We see people on this very forum who say they had some Catholic training as kids but didn’t really learn to practice their faith till some point in adulthood, so it could happen.

Also, does your parish have only one Mass per day? Is it possible that some of those confirmed kids were at other Masses? Could they have been out of town with their families and maybe going to some other church for the weekend? Might they actually be members of some other parish who just came over for the confirmation ceremony?

It is generally a bad idea to try to monitor someone’s Mass attendance. I attend at least a dozen different Catholic churches regularly because of my job and travel schedule. If someone from any one of those churches was looking to see when I came to church, they would be seeing me a few times a month and some Sundays not at all…because I am attending someplace else.

 

[twf]

Was the confirmation Mass late Saturday afternoon (4 pm or later)? If so, it was likely already a Sunday Mass of obligation… thus there would be no need for everyone to come back Sunday morning.

 

[Reuben_J]

I would say that is outrageous. I am not saying that it is not true but to witness at such display of unbelieve and indifference in such a formal and important Sacrament (all Sacraments are important btw) is truly saddening.

In our diocese, I am pretty sure most other dioceses do, Confirmation candidates would go through a process of formation prior to receiving the Sacrament. At least when the day comes, one will not see such spectre.

 

[ConfusedLucy]

Rightly or wrongly there are a lot of cultural Catholics who expect to participate in sacraments as a right of passage. I also don’t think it’s judgemental to not expect to see many of these teens at mass when it’s a frequent phenomenon.

 

[sevenswords]

Thank you all for your (name removed by moderator)ut, I am glad most of you find this scandalous but will add more to clear up some of your questions on the matter
I live in a small parish I know every child and every parent, none go to mass and have not done so for years. The kids while good and holy children are never brought to mass and through conversations with my children find that some are no better than Atheists an example, Jesus is dead how could he be God? the teachers are not much better and I have had to correct some a few times.
The next parish over the priest practically told parents they better attend mass if they want their kids confirmed, it was even in the paper as a scandal that a priest would come out with a statement like that. needless to say he(Bishop) confirmed the kids without the parents respecting his request.
So I did not say this lightly I am stating a fact that kids today are being confirmed without faith, oh to answer another point the priest does come to the school, but my son told me they all made fun of him when he left. so what do you think? Does the church have a position on this or are priests left to make threats towards parents with no authority to back up his threat?
I know it is heart breaking and I know i don’t know the hearts of people and don’t mean to judge but I see it clearly a great falling away from the church and I do pray for the return of the family to mass but just wanted to know what the church position is in these cases and when my daughter got confirmed a few years back it was the same story, the church is being used for a social occasion
and I’m sorry to say the man behind me knew what he was saying he was rejecting Christ openly in Church.
God bless you all.

 

[Rob2]

Not sure if this has been asked a million times or not?

It may have been , but thanks for asking again .

I was involved with Catholic education for many years , and unfortunately the picture you describe is pretty normal .

As for your question “How should the Church deal with Confirmations/Communions ?”

The Western Church should return to the traditional practice of celebrating the three sacraments of initiation in one ceremony as the Eastern Catholic Churches still do .

 

[Reuben_J]

Something has to be done so that at least those children for Confirmation undergo some formation and maybe regular Catechism.

The priest can make a local ruling to come out with conditions with regards to attending formation classes before Confirmation.

At least these parents want their children confirmed. So it is likely they will follow the pre-Confirmation classes or whatever, to help the children catechised.

The question probably whether the parish, being small, has the resources to do it.

 

[1ke]

Does the church have a position on this or are priests left to make threats towards parents with no authority to back up his threat?

As I already indicated, the Church does have canons pertaining to confirmation, and the priest can decline to recommend them to the bishop and delay confirmation for those who are not ready or properly disposed to the sacrament.

 

[phil19034]

It was all i could do to sit still in the church as two grown men sat behind me and talked the whole way through mass and when the church verbally together reject satan as we recite our baptismal vows, the guy behind me loudly said No so he was rejecting God and yet stood with his hand on the child’s shoulder as God parent when she received the oil and blessing.

This is horrible.

Did you tell father? If not, I would. Even though it’s too late, perhaps he can use this as an example when talking to parents about picking sponsors in the future.

 

[sevenswords]

Thats interesting thank you.

 

[sevenswords]

Hi Phil yes im going to talk to the priest about it as it has been suggested that he can enforce the authority of the church. the thing is I can’t see anything being done about it as the priest we have is a very shy man and new to the parish, he is very reserved and keeps to himself, I keep inviting him to dinner but he never makes it and I think it’s because of his shyness. This is not a new thing it has been going on for years in a lot of parishes, but perhaps it is all part of the great falling away as prophecy told us would happen towards the last days, maybe we are close to the great Apostasy?

 

[vallancec]

I feel the best thing we can do is pray for people and to be the best example of our faith as we can be. I have never understood people who have their children confirmed if they are not going to mass themselves. I wish I did have the answers but since I don’t I leave it in Gods hands.

 

[TheLittleLady]

The next parish over the priest practically told parents they better attend mass if they want their kids confirmed, it was even in the paper as a scandal that a priest would come out with a statement like that.

Mass cannot be coerced. We don’t hold Sacraments for children hostage until the parents jump through hoops.

 

[Blessedwithfive]

Mass cannot be coerced. We don’t hold Sacraments for children hostage until the parents jump through hoops.

I am not sure stating that you need to attend Mass to be Confirmed is would be considered coerced.