How to use 1950's Daily Missal

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Not all Masses are dialogue Masses. Some low Masses are celebrated without dialogue. High Masses have dialogue between priest and server relatively muted while the schola sings in the background; the people chime in at many fewer points.
So that was the norm back in the day? You just went to mass and mostly watched the priest, he and the server said the mass and you just watched? Doesn’t sound like much as far as participating in the mass.

In reading through the missal, the mass is beautiful, but if it is only one sided (the priest doing all the work) that seems really odd to me. Maybe that is because I am so used to the non tridentine mass.

So, basically, go to the mass, grab a missal, try and follow along if you can hear the priest and then go home. Okay… I won’t question it, but that seems really odd.

John
 
So that was the norm back in the day? You just went to mass and mostly watched the priest, he and the server said the mass and you just watched? Doesn’t sound like much as far as participating in the mass.

In reading through the missal, the mass is beautiful, but if it is only one sided (the priest doing all the work) that seems really odd to me. Maybe that is because I am so used to the non tridentine mass.

So, basically, go to the mass, grab a missal, try and follow along if you can hear the priest and then go home.
John
I don’t know where you’re getting your information from, but do know in the 50’s my Polish dad taught me to respond “Et cum spiritu tuo” before I learned a word of English.
 
So that was the norm back in the day? You just went to mass and mostly watched the priest, he and the server said the mass and you just watched?
High Masses were the exception rather than the rule. Most Masses were low. I don’t know the relative proportion of dialogue vs. non-dialogue low Masses but I’m given to understand that, at least in the United States, participation was fairly strong among ethnic Italians, Poles, Mexicans, etc. Among Irish, not so much, a lingering artifact of vicious English persecution (where being heard celebrating Mass meant torturous execution, so silence became the norm).

Even at High Masses, “just watching” is not the ideal. The old Mass is an organic experience: the body of Christ comes together and each has its own unique, vital, essential function to discharge. The priest pronounces the consecration and offers the sacrificial victim; the deacon (if one is present) proclaims the Gospel and assists the priest in preparing and purifying the vessels; the subdeacon (if one is present) proclaims the epistle; the servers prepare the altar at the various stages of the liturgy; the schola offers music; the congregation prays. Like different organs of the body, each one carries out a different function in pursuit of a common end: the flourishing of the whole organism (which, for us, is accomplished by the worship of God). So, again, your job at the Mass is prayer and contemplation. If it’s a dialogue Mass then repetition of the server’s responses is the form of prayer which is taken; but the idea that you can only pray at Mass if you, personally, are saying the responses or singing the songs is, to say the least, very recent, and very much opposed to the kind of communal worship to which the old Mass is calling you. It’s primarily a contemplative experience.
In reading through the missal, the mass is beautiful, but if it is only one sided (the priest doing all the work) that seems really odd to me. Maybe that is because I am so used to the non tridentine mass.

So, basically, go to the mass, grab a missal, try and follow along if you can hear the priest and then go home. Okay… I won’t question it, but that seems really odd.

John
Why would you grab a Missal? I thought the whole point of going was that you already have one and want to try it out (though there’ll be some modest differences since the TLM Missal in use today is from 1962, and there were some changes made between then and the 50s).

You can question whatever you want, but if you don’t go into it with an open mind, you’re not going to get much out of it.

It didn’t appeal to me much when I first went (my first TLM was a low Mass), but I recall my girlfriend at the time (who came with me) saying that it “wasn’t what Mass is supposed to be.” She meant that it was silent and stoic and reserved and hierarchical, not user-friendly and chatty and accessible like the ordinary form of the Mass she was used to. I thought to myself “Well, if that’s not what Mass is supposed to be, how did no one notice as much for 2000 years or so?” I couldn’t quite shake that thought or answer that question and I eventually came to the conclusion that I was missing something, that there was something I wasn’t getting, and that if I didn’t “like” or “prefer” the old Mass (and just thinking along those terms gave me the shivers even then, as if my likes or preference are worth anything), it was only because I was a sinner who liked and preferred the wrong things. So I kept going on occasion, here and there, where time and travel permitted, and found the things I hadn’t gotten the first time. Now I prefer it exclusively, and am a better man for it.

That’s the attitude which it commands of you: self-evacuation. Putting your likes and preferences aside and approaching it on its terms, not yours. Deferring to the judgment of history and the far-superior sanctity and piety of your ancestors. It lays you bare in your smallness and frailty and ignorance. On the other hand, it offers you a rootedness in tradition and history and an experience of transcendence utterly unlike anything else you will encounter in the world.
 
… So, again, your job at the Mass is prayer and contemplation. …
Again, that is where I am confused… where am I supposed to say prayers during the mass? I know in the non-tridentine mass, I say the Our Father, Profession or faith, etc. With this though, I feel i will be going in and sitting on my hands he whole time.

I’m not saying it is a bad mass. It was alive and well from the 1500’s from what I understand, so it it could last all those years, it has to be good. I guess I’m just looking for something of a “user’s guide” on what I need to say or do during the mass. I’m used to singing, saying the parts with conviction that I know we are to say, and attentively listening to the priest and deacon at mass.

Anyhow, I’m not saying I am going in with a closed mind. If that was the case, I wouldn’t even be going. I just am confused and I want to get the most out of the experience.

John
 
Again, that is where I am confused… where am I supposed to say prayers during the mass? I know in the non-tridentine mass, I say the Our Father, Profession or faith, etc. With this though, I feel i will be going in and sitting on my hands he whole time.

I’m not saying it is a bad mass. It was alive and well from the 1500’s from what I understand, so it it could last all those years, it has to be good. I guess I’m just looking for something of a “user’s guide” on what I need to say or do during the mass. I’m used to singing, saying the parts with conviction that I know we are to say, and attentively listening to the priest and deacon at mass.

Anyhow, I’m not saying I am going in with a closed mind. If that was the case, I wouldn’t even be going. I just am confused and I want to get the most out of the experience.

John
Much of the Mass is to be spent in silent prayer by those in attendance. The “user’s guide” you need is already in your possession; the Missal you found. Take it with you and follow along. One doesn’t need to be a Classical Scholar to attend an Extraordinary Form Mass. As a Cantor I can tell you if you want to sing there’s no Mass better to attend than an Extraordinary Form High Mass.
 
Much of the Mass is to be spent in silent prayer by those in attendance. The “user’s guide” you need is already in your possession; the Missal you found. Take it with you and follow along. One doesn’t need to be a Classical Scholar to attend an Extraordinary Form Mass. As a Cantor I can tell you if you want to sing there’s no Mass better to attend than an Extraordinary Form High Mass.
I would LOVE to attend a high mass in this form, but it appears that all are done as a low mass. The two parish’s in my area that do have the Latin mass I had to explain what a high mass was to the secretary as they were not sure.

I’ll just go an keep my heart open for our Lord.

John
 
How we express our participation in the Extraordinary Form of the Mass is two fold. It is exterior and interior.

The ideal exterior expression of our participation in the liturgy is through song. In an ideal world every Extraordinary Form Mass would be sung, and the laity would join in the chant and sing the liturgy too. This is rare, however, and there are movements in the Church that are working to restore this ideal participation of the liturgy.

But the principal means of participation at the Extraordinary Form is an interior participation. There are ministers appointed by the Church to celebrate the Mass and the liturgy (the priest who offers the Holy Sacrifice and his ministers who assist in the ritual). When you’re at the Ordinary Form of the Mass you don’t say “this is my body” with the priest, do you? You don’t hold your hands over the bread and wine. At that moment you participate by uniting your thoughts and your heart with what is going on at the altar. Most of the Canon (Eucharistic Prayer) is like that,

Generally you do the same throughout the entire Extraordinary Form. When the priest is at the foot of the altar humbly listen to him. He is confessing his sins, he is acknowledging his own wretchedness before ascending to the altar. Respect his public humiliation and then unite your own with his in your soul. Pope Saint Pius X gave us a “user guide” when he said that the “Holy Mass is a prayer itself, even the highest prayer that exists. Is is the Sacrifice dedicated by our Redeemer at the Cross, and repeated every day on the Altar. If you wish to hear the Mass as it should be heard, you must follow with eye, heart, and mouth all that happens at the Altar. Further, you must pray with the priest the holy words said by him in the Name of Christ and which Christ says by him. You have to associate your heart with the holy feelings which are contained in these words and in this manner you ought to follow all that happens on the Altar. When acting in this way, you have prayed Holy Mass.”

To be honest, it takes a lot more to actively assist at the Extraordinary Form over the Ordinary Form. You really have to apply yourself.

When you go to the Mass hopefully it’ll be a High Mass which means it will be sung, there will be incense, etc. Or it may be a Low Mass. Everything will be in Latin, but the Scriptures will likely be re-read by the priest before the homily. I recommend that you don’t follow too closely in your missal. Focus rather on what’s going on at the altar. Read your missal in the days preceding Mass to get an idea of what’s going on. And then just enjoy the beautiful experience!

In Jesus and Mary,
OS.
 
Great thread… just what I needed to hear.

A local parish has been “taken over” by 2 FSSP priests celebrating the Tridentine Mass. I go to daily Mass but can’t always attend the Tridentine and 3 times a week have to attend the Novus Ordo Mass.

This is getting confusing as in the NO we celebrated St. Therese yesterday, Oct 1st, but will celebrate it again tomorrow, Oct 3rd in the Tridentine Mass…… I also pray the LOTH and it is based on the NO calendar so another confusion.

That said I am very much drawn to the Tridentine Mass. yes the daily Mass is hard to follow sometimes. It has taken me about 2 months to know what’s going on, begin to understand some of the prayers, and follow along closely. While the daily Mass is silent it is much more contemplative. I was told you pray the Mass so while silent very active. I have a 1962 Missal (Baronius Press version) that is a big help and there is a small red pamphlet available at the church that is a great primer.

I like the idea I know what to expect. I am away at school and had trouble finding a contemplative parish. Back home I attend a Benedictine Abbey for Mass. The typical parish is hit and miss with clapping, birthday blessings, modern music, bad art etc… The Tridentine is spot on traditional. YMMV…

I’d like to hear from others on the out of sync nature of the 2 Masses. Do you still attend both or concentrate on one? Do you read both Epistles and Gospels? How else does one incorporate it into ones prayer life smoothly?

Thansks,

El paso
 
Thanks all for the advice. I think I might search YouTube to see if they have any video’s of the Low Mass and the High Mass so I can take a look at what it might be like. This I think would help me be ready for what to experience so I can concentrate on the beauty of the mass more and what is happening. If I find any video’s I will post the link back so others who might stumble upon this later and who are so inclined can look at them too.

A few more questions about the mass though. Do you receive communion differently than you do with the modern mass?

Also, must the ladies wear the head coverings (not sure what they are called)?

Thanks again,

John
 
Again, that is where I am confused… where am I supposed to say prayers during the mass? I know in the non-tridentine mass, I say the Our Father, Profession or faith, etc. With this though, I feel i will be going in and sitting on my hands he whole time.
You can say the responses along with the servers if it is a dialogue Mass (try to follow along to see what other people are doing if you’re unsure; chime in if they start making the responses). Otherwise, you can pray silently, interiorly.
A few more questions about the mass though. Do you receive communion differently than you do with the modern mass?

Also, must the ladies wear the head coverings (not sure what they are called)?

Thanks again,

John
The expectation is that you will receive communion kneeling and on the tongue. If there’s no altar rail available to kneel at, they may use the front row of pews as kneelers. The priest will come to you and say “Corpus Domini nostri Jesu Christi custodiat animam tuam ad vitam aeternam, amen” (“May the body of our Lord Jesus Christ bring your soul to everlasting life, amen”) and place the host in your mouth; you don’t need to say anything in response.

Women are not strictly required to wear chapel veils, but it is appropriate to that form of the Mass and strongly encouraged. They may have extras laying around, usually in a basket in the narthex or something similar.
 
I’m a convert. I came into the church February of 1970. I experienced my first TLM in 1974. After all these years I have finally found a church to attend that does the TLM exclusively and I now go there exclusively.

Yes, on the rare occasion when bad weather prevents me from driving the 80 miles each way to the TLM, I will attend the local parish for the OF Mass.

Over the years I have fallen in love with the old Mass. It has become second nature for me. Periodically I will treat myself to the Solemn High Mass but its a 120 miles drive each way. So I normally settle for the low Mass.

It can get confusing for new folks when trying to figure out which Feast they are celebrating. That’s why I always keep calendars for both Forms on my office wall.
 
…Could someone tell me what week I should be looking at for this coming Sunday (October 5th, 27th Week of Ordinary time) so I know where I should be in the book when my wife and I try and go to a Tridentine mass this weekend. …
As it turned out, the Mass I attended was actually for Our Lady of the Rosary (“external solemnity”). I don’t know if that was done at the discretion of the celebrant or if it is required by the rubrics.

Dan
 
In the EF, Mass for the external solemnity of the Holy Rosary may be celebrated on the Sunday closest to the feast, if the celebrant desires. The same provision is made on the Sundays closest to Corpus Christi and Sacred Heart.
 
So I went to Immaculate Conception church in Cleveland this weekend and they had a high solemn mass… it was very beautiful. I did take my Mom’s old Missal with me, but they also had these nice red missal’s that had the whole mass in it, plus explanations in the margins… this was nice as it indicated where the bells would ring, when to stand, kneel, sit and some other background information. My Mom’s missal didn’t have much of this. Are there any new missal’s for the 1962 format that have this background info, but also all the readings, gospel’s etc like you do in the St Joseph Missal from the 1950’s and 1960’s?

I have to admit, I wanted to follow along the whole time, but it was really difficult. With the choir singing, you could not hear the priest with what he was saying, but that was okay. At a point, I just resigned myself to enjoy the mass and try and follow as best as we could.

Now I really wish I would have taken Latin in High School as opposed to taking German. Oh well…

My one question though is how do you say “et cum spiritu tuo”… I have the “et cum” part, but the “spiritu tuo” part sounds almost like they are omiting the “tuo” from it. Doe it just all run together?

God bless,

John
 
I would recommend that you not try to follow in the missal the next few times. Read through the Mass propers for the day (readings, collects, antiphons) before you go to Mass, but don’t try to follow the priest in the missal during the Mass. In time, when you feel more comfortable with the flow, you can get this. Meanwhile, knowing that the EF Mass follows the same general flow as the OF Mass, just prayerfully observe and take it all in. Jot down questions or thoughts that you may have.

Most missals do provide the type of info that you saw in the red missalettes, so it is unfortunate that yours did not. If you need a new one, certainly the Baronius Missal or the new St. Edmund Campion Missal would do nicely.
 
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