I am new to Eastern Christian prayer - where to begin?

[Hesychios]

It depends on the degree of love with which you say the Akathist. One single moment of prayer in perfect love and disattachment from sin brings you closer to God than a whole lifetime of fasts mixed with human passions and attachment to sin (though it would certainly seem difficult to reach the state of perfection without such fasts - indulgences aren’t a “shortcut” to sanctity in any sense of the term). You need complete disattachment from all sin in order to receive a plenary indulgence; as I said, they aren’t shortcuts.

How does one achieve this detachment from sin? Pure chance, emotion, imagination?

How long do you need this detachment, for an instant? … an hour …a lifetime? As long as the akathist lasts?

The ages old method the desert fathers used is to master the passions, and that is hard work. In fact, for us complete detachment from sin is probably impossible, and once you think you’ve got it, you’ve just lost it.

If I were you I’d recommend doing the 300 days of fasting, hard labor and tears. With or without sins to confess.

I guess that’s the difference between your spiritual outlook and mine.

 

[kitkatty]

How does one achieve this detachment from sin? Pure chance, emotion, imagination?

How long do you need this detachment, for an instant? … an hour …a lifetime? As long as the akathist lasts?

The ages old method the desert fathers used is to master the passions, and that is hard work. In fact, for us complete detachment from sin is probably impossible, and once you think you’ve got it, you’ve just lost it.

If I were you I’d recommend doing the 300 days of fasting, hard labor and tears. With or without sins to confess.

I guess that’s the difference between your spiritual outlook and mine.

Well mastering the passions is hard work, in my case I`m sure it will be a lifetime and then some.But how would you know you really had mastered them, it would be possible to be deceived easily here I think.

 

[joejonesonline]

Why wouldn’t you just do the akathist out of love and the prayer and fasting for spiritual strength?

No reason not to. I was just trying to explain as best as I understand what the old days measurement meant.

Please keep me in your prayers.

Give thanks to the Lord for He is good.

 

[Hesychios]

Well mastering the passions is hard work, in my case I`m sure it will be a lifetime and then some.But how would you know you really had mastered them, it would be possible to be deceived easily here I think.

One should never assume they have mastered the passions. Never for one moment think you have achieved detachment of sin.

Always assume one is a piece of work.

 

[Alexander_Roman]

Actually, I think the best introduction to Eastern Christian prayer is the Coptic Agpeya or Office since it has absolutely NO variable parts.

The Seven Hours are prayed as they are given.

Here is a website that gives the complete text of the Coptic Agpeya:

www.agpeya.org

Alex

 

[Dolores_IHS]

Here’s a partial list of “don’ts” that I’ve heard:

First, you really shouldn’t act without the guidance a spiritual director - in other words, don’t start trying psychosomatic meditation techniques (navel-gazing, breath control) on your own. Many Orthodox writers even say not to say the Jesus Prayer without the guidance of a spiritual director.

Secondly, don’t say anything that is reserved for a priest - prayers that are obviously Eucharistic for example (usually more of a temptation for Western Christians where the “dry Mass” or Liturgy of the Presanctified is commonly said when a priest is not available, or privately as a devotional practice), but also any litanies, any prayer (such as the kontakia in the Akathistos) where the “alleluia” is proclaimed, and any blessings or prayers marked in the liturgical books as belonging to a priest (for example, the “for thine is the kingdom and the power and the glory” etc.).

Third, it is alien to our Eastern tradition to adore or venerate parts of Christ’s physical body in isolation to the rest of them (i.e., the Sacred Heart devotion). I don’t think this is heretical, because Roman Catholic spirituality uses the term “heart” differently than we do (they are worshiping not his physical organ or his nous; rather, the Sacred Heart devotion is a meditation on Christ’s love). It’s just not what we do, and since the East has its own integrity of method and symbolism, mixing images can lead to confusion.

Fourth, because Orthodox spirituality is firmly rooted in the “eye of the heart” or nous rather than in the imagination and reason, we should avoid using our imagination in prayer. Again, we should nonetheless recognize that our Roman Catholic brethren are more than capable of attaining great sanctity using such meditations (as they do in the Rosary and Stations of the Cross), but our spiritual method coming from the Eastern monastic fathers is different and for us to employ the imagination would lead to the danger of prelest (spiritual delusion). Using Western methods within an Eastern spirituality can be dangerous (and vice versa - just look at the way some Roman Catholics have misused the Jesus Prayer), and this is because each has their own integrity that needs to remain intact (not because one is “right” and the other is “wrong”).

So if you pray the Rosary (something given by St. Seraphim of Sarov to all his spiritual children), do not let your imagination build elaborate constructions of what you think the mysteries look like. That would be useful for inspiring loving emotions towards God, which is certainly a noble thing but a bit counter-productive to the rest of our spirituality (the chotki, and I will argue the Akathist and Liturgy) which is more kenotic in character, stripping us naked in our sins before God and purging us of our sins and our passions and all that stands between us and our God). This isn’t a problem for Roman Catholics since the Mass (at least in the Tridentine form) works with the emotions and reason elevating them up to heavenly mysteries rather than trying to “blow them away” with the transcendence of heavenly grace, but it is a problem for us. They’re cataphatic; we’re apophatic.

Instead, therefore, glorify and love the Theotokos in your heart when you pray the “Bogoroditse Devo”.

Those are the only four "don’t"s I’ve heard.

Wow, what an interesting post, I am really learning new things here! I like the holistic way the East venerates Christ; actually I have not been partial to devotions of certain images of Christ., but preferred seeing Him as one. For example, I have a picture of the Sacred Heart in my room, but I don’t have a particular devotion to it; I have the picture, because it is a beautiful image of Jesus which helps me hold conversation with Him. The same with our Lady – even though my patron saint is Our Lady of Sorrows (hence “Dolores”) I don’t pray to her as Our Lady of Sorrows a lot; I address her as Mother or Mama, and all images or icons of her are one and the same – Mother Mary!

It was quite a new concept to hear not to use imagination in prayer! How do you in the East pray then? For example, how do you approach the Jesus Prayer, compared to how Western Catholics approach it? When I pray it, I intend for it to sink into me to become an inner cry to God. How could the Jesus prayer be misused? And how do the Easterners pray the Rosary? I find the conventual Catholic manner difficult for me, because I have to concentrate on 1) praying the Hail Marys to Mother Mary, 2) the intention I am praying it for, as well as 3) the mystery I am supposed to meditate on – both to how it happened, and how it can be applied to the intention! In contrast, the Jesus Prayer is simpler and doesn’t require all this meditation, which has hardly ever come easily to me. I love to get down to the spirit of prayer, the living of prayer in our every breath.

And what on earth does cataphatic and apophatic mean I couldn’t find it in the dictionary and am very interested in learning what it means…

Another thing, about funerals: do the Eastern Christians bury their dead in a coffin like the Westerners, or in a shroud like the Muslims? In the Early Church they were in shrouds, but somewhere along history coffins were used instead. I love the concept of being buried in a linen shroud and buried like that; it reminds me of the Baptismal garment.

Dolores

 

[Dolores_IHS]

The reason you see the similarities in Eastern Christianity and Islam is because most if not all of the things you mentioned about liking in Islam was taken from Eastern Christianity. One should remember that Islam was founded in a time and place where Eastern Christianity was the norm.

The way Muslim women dress was the norm for all women in the area at the time,(still is for Eastern nuns), prostrations were and still are part of Eastern Christianity, removing shoes was and still is the norm in MANY Eastern churches and men and women worshiping in separate areas was the norm in East and Western Christianity until quite recently and is still practiced in a lot of places.

The book, Lost Christianity by Philip Jenkins goes into quite a bit of the history of this, well worth the read.

Oh, that’s interesting to hear! Even removing shoes and separate worship? Many times I was so desirous to take my shoes off at church! But in a Catholic Mass it would probably be confusing or inappropriate… it is so difficult to find a place which has all these things, so I just try to tolerate things where I have to and change things where I can. For example, I dress modestly in long skirts/dresses and wear a veil, and at home I pray unshod on a mat in front of my room’s prayer altar.

Dolores

 

[Dolores_IHS]

It should be true for all Eastern churches, but here in the United States most churches have pews (which are not used a whole lot - we sit only during the homily, Epistle, and a couple litanies, and some people only sit during the homily - but they can be rather constraining; we should be free to walk around and venerate the various icons during the Liturgy).

There are two kinds of prostrations - minor (bowing low to the waist and touching the floor) and great. A great prostration is the kind of prostration Muslims make that is probably a familiar image to you; they learned it from us. Usually in America we see people making minor prostrations upon entering the church and before communion, and often at the epiklesis (there are actually supposed to be two or three set times according to the Ruthenian bishops, but nobody knows when they are and uniformity on the part of the congregation is not a part of the Eastern tradition for anyone except the Old Believers). The Old Believers will make a great prostration upon entering the church and then again at the beginning of the Liturgy; we only make great prostrations when venerating the Cross on the second sunday of Great Lent and then again in October on the Triumph of the Life-Giving Cross (same feast as in the Western Church).

After Liturgy many people, especially women, will find an icon on the iconstasis to venerate and pray in a great prostration in front of it (it’s more common for men to stand).

We stand, and if you have the opportunity to come to Liturgy please do so as well; it is our gesture of reverence and would actually be more reverent than kneeling. Kneeling and standing have different meanings in the East than in the West; standing during Communion doesn’t feel as irreverent to me as it does in the Novus Ordo Roman Mass (where I kneel for Communion instead).

I also admire those things in Islam. My understanding is that the Copts do take their shoes off - I think it is a beautiful custom. The Old Believers separate men and women, and it is strongly encouraged everywhere for women to cover their head with a scarf or mantilla. The only non-Catholic Liturgy I have ever been to was at an Armenian Apostolic Church, and someone was standing at the back of the Communion line with a pile of mantillas (chapel veils) she gave to every woman who was not wearing one so that the would present themselves appropriately for Holy Communion. As far as I know only the Armenians made it mandatory, but it is really best no matter where you are (East or West) for the women to cover their head. In churches of the Roman Rite the mantilla is traditionally worn loose and resting on top of her head; in Eastern churches it is traditionally tied under the chin.

Well, we’re the ones they learned everything from! If the great prostration looks a lot like the Muslim prostration, and if their hand gestures sometimes look similar to the way we fold our arms across our breast while praying, there’s a pretty good historical reason for it!

Thanks for all the info! I am interested to hear how you find kneeling for Communion more reverent in the West and standing more reverent in the East. I stand for Communion as there is no altar rails in our parish, but would have also preferred to kneel. I do receive on the tongue, as there is freedom to choose this, so that makes up for not being able to kneel. I cannot speak for Easterners finding standing for Communion more reverent, as I have never been to a Divine Liturgy, but I believe you that it is more reverent in the East and would be fine with it at an Eastern Church. At least there are other reverent practices in your Liturgies which have been forgotten in the Novus Ordo Mass, e.g. chanting, modesty and veiling for women.

As a woman, I strongly believe in wearing a veil to Church and in private prayer, and have been doing so for at least four years now. Sadly I am still one of the very few women in my church who covers her head at Mass (if not the only one). I have never felt partial to Mantillas though, as I wear my veil in public, too (can you imagine a mantillaed woman at the mall? ;-D). In public or at church I wear large rectangular or square scarves tied in front under the chin, and draped over the shoulders, like Muslim women do, and at home I sometimes wear a smaller scarf tied behind my head especially when I am working, or if it is hot (like today!).

I see you mentioned Easterners fold their hands over their chest whilst praying. What other hand gestures do you have? I love also the cupped hand gesture I see Muslims use.

Dolores

 

[ciero]

The 300 days does not measure “time off” from purgatory, but instead, quantifies the merit received from performing the indulgenced act. Thus, 300 days means that the merit of the indulgence is equivalent to the merit received from 300 days of prayer and fasting.

Glory to Jesus Christ.

Do people really think this way? How SICK!

 

[Cecilianus]

Do people really think this way? How SICK!

I’ve never heard a Catholic who honestly thought that indulgences were “get out of jail free cards” - so no, I don’t think anyone really does think that way.

 

[Cecilianus]

Thanks for all the info! I am interested to hear how you find kneeling for Communion more reverent in the West and standing more reverent in the East. I stand for Communion as there is no altar rails in our parish, but would have also preferred to kneel. I do receive on the tongue, as there is freedom to choose this, so that makes up for not being able to kneel. I cannot speak for Easterners finding standing for Communion more reverent, as I have never been to a Divine Liturgy, but I believe you that it is more reverent in the East and would be fine with it at an Eastern Church. At least there are other reverent practices in your Liturgies which have been forgotten in the Novus Ordo Mass, e.g. chanting, modesty and veiling for women.

As a woman, I strongly believe in wearing a veil to Church and in private prayer, and have been doing so for at least four years now. Sadly I am still one of the very few women in my church who covers her head at Mass (if not the only one). I have never felt partial to Mantillas though, as I wear my veil in public, too (can you imagine a mantillaed woman at the mall? ;-D). In public or at church I wear large rectangular or square scarves tied in front under the chin, and draped over the shoulders, like Muslim women do, and at home I sometimes wear a smaller scarf tied behind my head especially when I am working, or if it is hot (like today!).

I see you mentioned Easterners fold their hands over their chest whilst praying. What other hand gestures do you have? I love also the cupped hand gesture I see Muslims use.

Dolores

I have seen the beautiful cupped hand gestures you see Muslims use at Divine Liturgy, but only from a Roman Catholic friend I brought who I think was in awe at the Liturgy and made the gesture spontaneously. I don’t think it’s a gesture common in our tradition; we’re usually too busy crossing ourselves.. I don’t usually pay too close attention to what other people are doing - it’s none of my business, and I want to give them the freedom to express themselves physically as freely as they need to in prayer without them feeling ostentatious because other people are looking. But when we’re not crossing ourselves, I was taught (by two Eastern Catholic priests who translated to the Catholic Church from Orthodoxy) to cross my arms over my breast in the position I mentioned. Other than that I don’t know of any other hand gestures, except that we cup our hands in order to catch crumbs when we receive the antidoron (the blessed bread cut from the same loaf as the Eucharist but not consecrated - an intermediary between the Body of Christ and His divinity which is uncreated and eternal, and the physical matter which we will then go on to receive in the rest of our day-to-day life; we give the antidoron almost as much outward veneration as the Eucharist though it is only blessed bread).

When I am serving as an acolyte when I am finished I go to the priest with cupped hands to receive his blessing on them before I touch my sticheron with them in order to remove it (just as I also receive his blessing before putting it on - and for that matter usually before I ever touch the censer as well. We like blessings.)

 

[Cecilianus]

Wow, what an interesting post, I am really learning new things here! I like the holistic way the East venerates Christ; actually I have not been partial to devotions of certain images of Christ., but preferred seeing Him as one. For example, I have a picture of the Sacred Heart in my room, but I don’t have a particular devotion to it; I have the picture, because it is a beautiful image of Jesus which helps me hold conversation with Him. The same with our Lady – even though my patron saint is Our Lady of Sorrows (hence “Dolores”) I don’t pray to her as Our Lady of Sorrows a lot; I address her as Mother or Mama, and all images or icons of her are one and the same – Mother Mary!

It was quite a new concept to hear not to use imagination in prayer! How do you in the East pray then?

I can’t answer the question how we in the East ought to pray - I recommend consulting two sources which will tell you more than you need to know: the Philokalia and the Apophthegmata Patrum (the latter book is also called “The Sayings of the Desert Fathers”; Sr. Benedicta Ward translated the edition I am familiar with). A short little book called “The Way of a Pilgrim” is also useful.

What I can tell you is how I pray - I strive to say exactly what I mean with my whole heart. When I say “Lord Jesus Christ, Son of God, have mercy on me, a sinner”, I am not meditating on Christ’s Passion or some other event (not that I want to give an overly strong impression that I think doing so is spiritually harmful under all circumstances, especially within the context of a Western approach to prayer), and I am certainly NOT repeating a mantra in order to “clear my mind” or some other New Agey **** like that; rather, I am striving to mean exactly what I say as clearly as I say it, as much as if I were addressing another human being face to face. And I try to “practice the presence of God” while doing so; I do not try to imagine God’s presence but rather perceive His presence through the “eyes of my heart” (St. Basil the Great’s term, from a prayer we sing after Liturgy).

For example, how do you approach the Jesus Prayer, compared to how Western Catholics approach it? When I pray it, I intend for it to sink into me to become an inner cry to God. How could the Jesus prayer be misused?

It sounds like you are approaching it correctly. If you want to see it misused, go to your local “Christian ashram” or “centering-prayer” center for lots of horrid examples. Wear a veil if you do so as it may remove the strong temptation to tear your hair out.

And how do the Easterners pray the Rosary? I find the conventual Catholic manner difficult for me, because I have to concentrate on 1) praying the Hail Marys to Mother Mary, 2) the intention I am praying it for, as well as 3) the mystery I am supposed to meditate on – both to how it happened, and how it can be applied to the intention! In contrast, the Jesus Prayer is simpler and doesn’t require all this meditation, which has hardly ever come easily to me. I love to get down to the spirit of prayer, the living of prayer in our every breath.

There is probably no set way that Easterners pray the Rosary, because strictly speaking the Rosary is not an Eastern devotion but a Western one which the East (mostly Eastern Catholics, but also Eastern Orthodox - as I said, St. Seraphim of Sarov gave it to all his spiritual children) picked up later. Our Marian devotion (sometimes misleadingly called the “Byzantine Rosary”) is the Akathistos Hymn, which was written by St. Romanos the Melodist about six or seven hundred years before the Rosary developed in the Dominican form. It contains twelve cycles in which a hymn called an “ikos” is sung praising the Theotokos for an event in her life, followed by a kontakion. I suppose this uses the “imagination” in a certain sense as do many prayers in our Liturgy of the Hours and the Divine Liturgy, but they are not regarded as distractions from prayer because they are formal praises which we express verbally and directly to the Theotokos rather than something we think about while saying something else.

I highly recommend printing off and using the Akathistos hymn; it is a beautiful prayer. You can find it here:metropolitancantorinstitute.org/sheetmusic/general/Akathist.pdf

But more directly in answer to your question, when I pray the Rosary I pray each mystery in honor of the event that it depicts. It is more spiritually profitable for me individually to do that rather than to try to imagine the events in great detail - that interposes too much of my own creation into the prayer. Instead, I try to mean and intend exactly what I am saying, and by doing so to glorify, love, and honor the Theotokos in my heart. I try to speak to her with as heartfelt love as I would my biological mother, which for me means speaking the actual words of the Hail Mary.

(Sometimes I use the Latin “Ave Maria”, in either Latin or English, and sometimes I use the “Bohoroditse Devo”, usually in English because my Ukrainian is downright awful to non-existent: “Rejoice, O Virgin Theotokos, the Lord is with thee! Blessed art thou amongst women, and blessed is the fruit of thy womb; for thou hast borne the Savior of our souls.”)

CONTINUED…

 

[Cecilianus]

And what on earth does cataphatic and apophatic mean I couldn’t find it in the dictionary and am very interested in learning what it means…

Ah, sorry.

In theology we distinguish three ways of approaching God and theology in general. In Latin, they are called the via affirmativa, via negativa, and via eminentiae. The ultimate source for this distinction is the Mystical Theology of St. Dionysious the Areopagite, traditionally regarded as the disciple of St. Paul converted at his sermon given on the altar to the “unknown God”. The via affirmativa or “cataphatic way” in Greek means the “way of affirming images”; we start from the lowest and basest of created material things (or even lower with phantasms and images) and say that in some way they resemble God; we then proceed up the “great chain of being” and affirm of all creatures from lowest to highest that their natures can be said of God in increasingly closer degree. Any time we say that God is something - whether this “something” is good, or true, or just, or three Persons in one Being, or conscious, or Being, or anything at all - whatever we are predicating of Him is an example of the cataphatic “affirmation of images” (qualified at least implicitly by our acceptance of the via eminentiae, which I’ll get to in a sec). Most Roman Catholic theology is cataphatic, and your theology is at its most glorious when it is most so. For example, your beautiful Preface of the Most Holy Trinity which they got rid of at Vatican II:

Vere dignum et justum est, aequum et salutare, nos tibi semper et ubique gratias agere: Domine sancte, Pater omnipotens, aeterne Deus: Qui cum unigenito Filio tuo, et Spiritu Sancto, unus es Deus, unus es Dominus, non in unius singularitate personae, sed in unius Trinitate substantiae. Quod enim de tua Gloria, revelante te, credimus, hoc de Filio tuo, hoc de Spiritu Sancto, sine differentia discretionis sentimus. Ut in confessione verae sempiternaeque Deitatis, et in personis proprietas, et in essentia unitas, et in majestate adoretur aequalitas. Quam laudant Angeli atque Archangeli, Cherubim quoque ac Seraphim: qui non cessant clamare quotidie, un voce dicentes: Sanctus, Sanctus, Sanctus, Dominus Deus Sabaoth. Pleni sunt caeli et terra gloria tua. Hosanna in excelsis. Benedictus qui venit in nomine Domini. Hosanna in excelsis.

It is truly meet and just, right and profitable for our salvation, that we should at all times and in all places, give thanks unto Thee, O holy Lord, Father Almighty, Everlasting God; Who, together with Thine Only-begotten Son, and the Holy Ghost, art one God, one Lord; not in the oneness of a single Person, but in the Trinity of one substance. For what we believe of Thy Son, the same of the Holy Ghost, without difference or inequality. So that in confessing the True and Everlasting Godhead, distinction in Persons, unity in Essence, and equality in Majesty may be adored. Which the Angels and Archangels, the Cherubim also and the Seraphim do praise: who cease not daily to cry out, with one voice saying: Holy, Holy, Holy Lord God of Hosts. Heaven and earth are full of Thy Glory. Hosanna in the highest. Blessed is He Who cometh in the Name of the Lord. Hosanna in the highest.

CONTINUED…

 

[Cecilianus]

But because God is infinitely far above any created thing we could possibly have based our language off of in order to even describe Him, we must complement the cataphatic way with the via negativa, or “apophatic way” - the “way of denial of images”. This method of theology starts with the highest of created things (the seraphim), denies that they are God or even that they can be compared to God, and proceeds down the great chain of being to lower beings, saying that the farther we go down the more strongly we have to say that God is unlike them. This approach will be found in St. Thomas Aquinas in a very attenuated form, but is found much more strongly in Western mystical theology (The Cloud of Unknowing, which despite its appropriation by “centering prayer” is in itself a very orthodox text, and also St. John of the Cross I would argue is apophatic), and it permeates the theology of the East. For apophatic theology, we do not use the created world as a means for figuring out what the Creator is like on the reasoning that we know the cause through the effects; instead, we can only know the ineffable God by personally communing with Him. In other words, instead of knowing about God as cataphatic theology does, apophatic theology demands that we know God.

You can see the emphasis on apophatic theology in our tradition by the following prayer, which takes the same liturgical place as does the Preface in your Liturgy. But instead of precise theological distinctions - “not in the oneness of a single Person, but in the Trinity of one substance” etc. - it focuses on paradox and apparent contradiction:

It is proper and right to sing to You, to bless You, to praise You, to thank You and worship You in every place of Your dominion: for You are God, ineffable, inconceivable, invisible, incomprehensible, ever existing yet ever the same, You and Your only begotten Son and Your Holy Spirit. You brought us out of nonexistence into being, and when we fell, You raised us up again, and left nothing undone until You led us into Your Heavenly kingdom. For all this we thank You and Your only begotten Son and Your Holy Spirit; for all things that we know and do not know, for the manifest and hidden benefits bestowed on us. We also thank You for this liturgy which You are pleased to accept from our hands, even though there stand before You thousands of Archangels and tens of thousands of Angels, Cherubim and Seraphim, six-winged, many-eyed, soaring aloft on their wings, Singing, shouting, crying out, and saying: Holy, holy, holy is the Lord of Hosts. Heaven and earth are filled with Your glory; hosanna in the highest. Blessed is He who comes in the name of the Lord. Hosanna in the highest.

Both ways are necessary in order to complement each other (they are both found in St. Dionysious), though the West tends to emphasize the cataphatic way or “way of affirmation of images” while the East tends to emphasize the apophatic way or “way of denial of images”. The West usually adds a third way, the via eminentiae, which attempts to resolve the two ways by saying that anything we say or predicate of God can only be found in Him in a higher or “eminent” fashion; in other words the terms we use of God are appropriate because they have pale imitations in the created realities but which ultimately are so far above the created realm as to not really mean the same thing. It is this “way of transcending the images” in which theologians speak of the “analogy of being” applied to God - we don’t want to say with the via affirmative that God is Being in a univocal way (with due apologies to Blessed John Duns Scotus) because we are also beings and there is no commeasurability between God and Creation, but we also don’t want to say with the mystics (St. Isaac of Syria, I think?) that God is Nothing because most people who are not in a mystical frame of mind would badly misunderstand that statement as to imply imperfection in God or even atheism, so instead we say that Being is said of God “analogically”.

This “analogy of being” is usually rejected in the East, because it’s usually perceived to imply commeasurability between God and Creation, which is precisely the problem that such phrasing sought to avoid. My personal view on the issue is that the language is badly posed; I also think that theology is clearer when the via eminentiae is avoided altogether and the cataphatic and apophatic ways are both boldly affirmed and the paradoxes of their conjunction fully embraced. Otherwise we tend to simply gloss over the apophatic way as a dialectical moment that we never really embrace the implications of, as I believe the theologians of the Roman Rite usually do. I don’t know if the via eminentiae is found is St. Dionysious, but I don’t think it is and it isn’t discussed a lot in the East.

Another thing, about funerals: do the Eastern Christians bury their dead in a coffin like the Westerners, or in a shroud like the Muslims? In the Early Church they were in shrouds, but somewhere along history coffins were used instead. I love the concept of being buried in a linen shroud and buried like that; it reminds me of the Baptismal garment.

Dolores

I’ve never been to a funeral of either Rite, so I’ll defer this question to somebody who knows the answer.

 

[crystal_waters]

My recommendation is to do two things.

(a) Buy a chotki (prayer rope) and pray the Jesus Prayer (“Lord Jesus Christ, Son of God, have mercy on me a sinner”). Do not use any psychosomatic meditation or breathing techniques or anything like that (those should only be done under the close supervision of a spiritual director as they can easily lead to spiritual delusion when used improperly, as they can have strong psychological effects). Just say the Jesus Prayer 150 times; maybe precede it with a Trisagios or some of our other prayers. Or google the Rule of St. Pachomius.

.

spiritual delusion and psychological effects? can you elaborate more on that please

also its the first time ive heard of chotki…are they specially for praying the jesus prayer or can you pray any prayer on them? where would i get a chotki?

 

[Cecilianus]

spiritual delusion and psychological effects? can you elaborate more on that please

It can be (mis)used to put your mind in a trancelike state similar to Transcendental Meditation and other Oriental meditation techniques. Yoga, which also uses breathing techniques, can also produce hallucinations similar to the experiences of real saints in prayer (visions of light, etc.), and when you are using psychosomatic aids to meditation it can be easy to induce one and confuse it with the other - leading you to think you have achieved a much greater degree of sanctity than you really have.

also its the first time ive heard of chotki…are they specially for praying the jesus prayer or can you pray any prayer on them? where would i get a chotki?

It’s a prayer rope made out of knots that’s usually used to pray the Jesus Prayer. Another prayer that can be said on it is “O Lord and Savior Jesus Christ, through the prayers of Thy Pure Mother and of all the saints, have mercy and save us”. I bought mine at an Orthodox bookstore, which is probably your best bet for finding one. Some Byzantine Catholic parishes have women there who know how to make them and will make them for their fellow parishioners.