I don't *love* the Latin Mass

  • Thread starter Thread starter babochka
  • Start date Start date
Status
Not open for further replies.
B

babochka

Guest
… but I want to.

I am a cradle Byzantine (Ruthenian) Catholic, so I didn’t grow up with horrible liturgy. I have great appreciation for a well-done Ordinary Form Roman Rite Mass. Attending the Chrism Mass at the local Cathedral is one of the highlights of the year for me. My children attend a non-parish based faith formation program, and the Masses celebrated there are reverent and beautiful. I strongly prefer ad orientem worship. I love chant and I don’t mind that the Mass is in Latin.

I love good liturgy and I’ve given it a fair shot. I’ve attended a handful of low Masses, 4 High Masses, and this weekend I attended a wedding, which was a Missa Cantata. All the Masses have been at one of the premier FSSP parishes in the country, and the High Masses have featured a talented choir that chanted beautifully. It was transcendent. Overall, however, it was just ok. The Mass seems so inaccessible to me and I’m really trying to understand what I’m missing and what others love so much about it.

I have trouble following the Mass and find myself spending a lot of time trying to figure out where we are in the Mass and trying to follow. I’ve tried to put down the books and just take it all in, but it hasn’t really helped. I don’t know how to immerse myself in the Mass, to make myself a part of it. In the Byzantine Divine Liturgy, we immerse ourselves in the liturgy because we have a clearly defined role. The deacon/priest leads us in prayer, and we respond, “Lord Have Mercy”. The priest has inaudible prayers, but they occur simultaneously with the prayers and hymns of the people, which are a necessary part of the liturgy. How does one immerse oneself in the TLM?

I understand the purpose of silence in the Roman Rite, and although my Rite does not utilize silence in the liturgy, I appreciate the opportunity for prayer that it affords.

I think the part I struggle with the most is the inaudible reading of the epistle and gospel, while facing the altar. These are called “lessons”, but what is the lesson in them if they are not proclaimed to the congregation? I fully understand the prayers that are offered to God by the priest should be offered to God alone, but to whom are the epistle and gospel being read?

I’ve tried to keep this post respectful and I hope that ensuing conversation about this stays respectful. I’m really trying to “get it” and I would appreciate any insight that you can give.
 
I’m interested in other people’s responses. Personally I’m the kind of person who thinks abstractly that I would love the Extraordinary Form, but I’ve only been able to attend two, a High Mass and a Low Mass, and I had difficulty getting “into” it. I spent too much time and effort just trying to figure out what was going on, like what part of the mass the priest was at. I know everyone says not to do that, but I felt that I first needed some basic idea of what was going on in the sanctuary before I could really engage in the almost private prayerfulness which seems to be the norm for laypeople at this form of the liturgy. Most people at both masses did not even say the et cum spiritu tuos. As someone who grew up Methodist and has otherwise experienced only the OF (and a Byzantine Divine Liturgy), it was a bit of a culture-shock. I can understand why the sudden liturgical changes must have seemed like a total revolution to ordinary laypeople, and why they polarized people to the point that it seems almost all Catholics who actually lived through that time are bitterly hostile to either the new or the old form of the mass.

I think it probably just takes long-term emersion to really start to “get” the old-time Roman Liturgy. It would probably be spiritually healthy for must of us Latin Catholics to have an appreciation for our liturgical roots, even if we don’t end up regular Latin Mass-goers. I’m not sure it is so necessary for a Byzantine Catholic though. If the Latin Mass seems alien and inaccessible to you, well you come from a different tradition after all. It’s not the same as feeling alienated from your own liturgical tradition.
 
I enjoy attending the Latin Mass occasionally. The oratory that has it has an excellent choir and I love to hear them. It’s always reverent and it’s a beautiful church. I don’t know if I would want it to be my Mass every weekend because I think I’d miss singing along and I agree with the OP that I feel like more of a spectator. I do understand most of the Latin and the bits I don’t, I can read in the missal. I also haven’t found the particular priest’s homilies to be particularly inspiring. Don’t get me wrong. He’s doing his job. He talks about the message of the gosple reading. It’s just that the priest at my regular parish has a way of relating it to life in a unique way that I personally find helpful. I also don’t have to deal with any of the irreverence and liturgical abuses that other posters frequent post about at my home parish. The priest is extremely reverent during the Eucharist and you can tell that he is really praying what he’s saying and it makes it easier for the parishoners not to lose focus on what going on at the altar.
 
babochka said:
I think the part I struggle with the most is the inaudible reading of the epistle and gospel, while facing the altar. These are called “lessons”, but what is the lesson in them if they are not proclaimed to the congregation? I fully understand the prayers that are offered to God by the priest should be offered to God alone, but to whom are the epistle and gospel being read?
Click to expand...
You are correct that many of the parts are intended to be either inaudible or at least “submissa voce.” (Session 22 of the Council of Trent explained why.) However, AFAIK, the epistle and gospel don’t fall into that category. I don’t know the history of epistle reading but the gospel in the EF is read to the liturgical north, because north was where the barbarians thrived. You probably noticed too that the gospel and epistle are read on different sides of the alta, although in the solemn Masses both are read away from the altar.
 
A good prayer/lections singer will sing them loudly while preserving the quality of the sound.

I recently watched the Mass for the 25th anniversary of the FSSP and from what I can tell, the Gospel was sung quite loudly–although not obnoxiously–while still preserving the deacon’s quality of voice and singing. Same goes for the Epistle with the subdeacon.
 
At all of the Extraordinary Masses I have attended, the Epistle and the Gospel were exclaimed first in Latin, then exclaimed in English- followed by an English homily (exception is when I am in Montreal, then the Epistle and Gospel are exclaimed in French- sometimes followed by the English, followed by a French homily- sometimes followed by a shortened English homily).

I don’t know why a priest wouldn’t exclaim the Epistle and Gospel in the vernacular…
 
babochka said:
… but I want to.

I am a cradle Byzantine (Ruthenian) Catholic, so I didn’t grow up with horrible liturgy. I have great appreciation for a well-done Ordinary Form Roman Rite Mass. Attending the Chrism Mass at the local Cathedral is one of the highlights of the year for me. My children attend a non-parish based faith formation program, and the Masses celebrated there are reverent and beautiful. I strongly prefer ad orientem worship. I love chant and I don’t mind that the Mass is in Latin.

I love good liturgy and I’ve given it a fair shot. I’ve attended a handful of low Masses, 4 High Masses, and this weekend I attended a wedding, which was a Missa Cantata. All the Masses have been at one of the premier FSSP parishes in the country, and the High Masses have featured a talented choir that chanted beautifully. It was transcendent. Overall, however, it was just ok. The Mass seems so inaccessible to me and I’m really trying to understand what I’m missing and what others love so much about it.

I have trouble following the Mass and find myself spending a lot of time trying to figure out where we are in the Mass and trying to follow. I’ve tried to put down the books and just take it all in, but it hasn’t really helped. I don’t know how to immerse myself in the Mass, to make myself a part of it. In the Byzantine Divine Liturgy, we immerse ourselves in the liturgy because we have a clearly defined role. The deacon/priest leads us in prayer, and we respond, “Lord Have Mercy”. The priest has inaudible prayers, but they occur simultaneously with the prayers and hymns of the people, which are a necessary part of the liturgy. How does one immerse oneself in the TLM?

I understand the purpose of silence in the Roman Rite, and although my Rite does not utilize silence in the liturgy, I appreciate the opportunity for prayer that it affords.

I think the part I struggle with the most is the inaudible reading of the epistle and gospel, while facing the altar. These are called “lessons”, but what is the lesson in them if they are not proclaimed to the congregation? I fully understand the prayers that are offered to God by the priest should be offered to God alone, but to whom are the epistle and gospel being read?

I’ve tried to keep this post respectful and I hope that ensuing conversation about this stays respectful. I’m really trying to “get it” and I would appreciate any insight that you can give.
Click to expand...
“Getting it” will take time. Once you can follow the Mass and know what part of Mass is happening, then the rest will fall into line. You will only need a missal for the proper prayers (those that change each day).

It is not necessary that you be silent during the responses. I routinely say the servers responses, but I say them in a low voice so as not to disturb those around me. I also sing with the choir when I know the piece. Again no problem there.

The beauty of the EF is that almost every action has a symbolic meaning. You are also uniting yourself with the same Mass that almost all of the saints experienced. You could travel to France and attend Mass with St. Joan of Arc and it would be the same Mass. This simple character is just one reason why the EF transcends time. At least for me, that was one very special character.

There is also zero abuses with any of the EF Masses I have been to. None. If I am traveling and need to attend Mass I seek out an EF Mass as I can be assured that it will be the same Mass I attend at home. No local personality inserted into the Mass.
 
babochka said:
… but I want to.
I think the part I struggle with the most is the inaudible reading of the epistle and gospel, while facing the altar. These are called “lessons”, but what is the lesson in them if they are not proclaimed to the congregation? I fully understand the prayers that are offered to God by the priest should be offered to God alone, but to whom are the epistle and gospel being read?
Click to expand...
I’ve never witnessed the Epistle or Gospel being read inaudibly at a traditional Latin Mass, except maybe at one Mass I attended where it was the first time that priest celebrated the Extraordinary Form publicly. Sometimes the Last Gospel is said inaudibly, however.
 
PatienceAndLove said:
At all of the Extraordinary Masses I have attended, the Epistle and the Gospel were exclaimed first in Latin, then exclaimed in English- followed by an English homily (exception is when I am in Montreal, then the Epistle and Gospel are exclaimed in French- sometimes followed by the English, followed by a French homily- sometimes followed by a shortened English homily).

I don’t know why a priest wouldn’t exclaim the Epistle and Gospel in the vernacular…
Click to expand...
I am guessing that the word you want is proclaimed, since we are speaking about liturgy (and volume). 😉

The readings are always read aloud at Low Mass and sung aloud at High Mass. Most churches will have the priest read the epistle and gospel in the vernacular immediately before the sermon, but these are not liturgical proclamations, i.e., they are not actually part of the Order of Mass. There is no requirement that they be done, and I have met a couple of priests who prefer not to do them. Many places will read the vernacular at Sunday and holy day Masses, but not weekday Masses, since there is generally no sermon.
 
Well, I do love the traditional Mass (in Latin). We have a young man that sings in our little choir, who is a Byzantine Catholic and loves Gregorian chant. So he comes to our Masses just to sing.

In fact his Byzantine priest occasionally comes to our Masses too.
 
For me the read Low Mass was an acquired taste. I really wasn’t crazy about it at first. Once I started learning a lot of the prayers I began to like it a lot more.

The Missa Cantata was love at first sight.
 
If you are not comfortable with it and it doesn’t reach you spiritually, then don’t go. A lot of people actively hate it. At least you are respectful about it…
 
I think it helps a lot to read the Proper elements at home, before Mass, and be acquainted with them beforehand – especially the Epistle and Gospel. Also to have the missal prepared with its ribbons, bookmarks, etc., and have the personal intentions and prayers for the living and dead in mind, and other important readings and themes. Or come to church 20 minutes earlier than usual and do these things in a pew while kneeling or sitting.

The Mass is so intimate. Finding the intimacy is so important.

~ Frank

.
 
Status
Not open for further replies.
Back
Top