I have a question about the sign of the cross

[tori2323]

Is there a huge difference between

“In the name of the Father, and of the Son, and of the Holy Ghost?”

and

“In the name of the Father, the Son, and the Holy Ghost?”

does omitting the “of” make a huge difference? Do I need to worry about that? I’ve heard some priests use it after they finish reading the Gospel at the homily.

I’ve also heard that using the second one at baptism invalidates the sacrament. I’m just confused, and I would appreciate some clarification.

Thanks in advance!

 

[phil19034]

The first is liturgically correct (both before and after Vatican II).

The 2nd is shorthand. Though to be honest I think I personally often say: “In the name of the Father, AND the Son, and the Holy Ghost/Spirit” when going fast (missing 2 OFs)

And I think I sometimes even pray: “In the name of the Father, Son, and Holy Ghost/Spirit” when going really fast (missing 2 THEs and 2 OFs)

I never really noticed it until I read this.

I think all are fine by yourself. But now that we know it, it would be good to slow down and try to say it properly.

I’ve also heard that using the second one at baptism invalidates the sacrament. I’m just confused, and I would appreciate some clarification.

I regards to this, I’m not 100% sure and would defer to a devout priest or canon lawyer.

God Bless

 

[FiveLinden]

As far as the English is concerned each has the same meaning.

 

[Beryllos]

Looking at the Latin, In nomine Patris, et Filii, et Spiritus Sancti, we see that the nouns all have the genitive ending, which signifies “of” each person.

So the English translation follows the Latin. This doesn’t answer the question of the significance of the triple “of.” I’m still wondering.

 

[Bithynian]

This doesn’t answer the question of the significance of the triple “of.” I’m still wondering.

Ultimately it’s an issue of English style. Generally, English avoids unnecessary repetition of conjunctions and prepositions where they can be reasonably inferred, otherwise it can appear to be stilted: ‘I saw flocks of ducks, and of geese, and of swans’ compared to ‘I saw flocks of ducks, geese and swans’.

At the same time, historical English translations of liturgical expressions have typically proceeded very literally. Often, the ‘peculiarity’ of the translation becomes the stylistic norm through time and constant use.

This is quite a common liturgical phenomenon. For example, the Nicene Creed in Greek, Latin and English begins with a Hebraicism: ‘believe in’. This reflects the Hebrew verb אמן aman ‘to believe’ using a preposition בּ b, whereas the Latin verb credere and Greek verb πιστεύειν pisteuein universally took a dative without a preposition.

 

[Diaconia]

Nope, no huge difference.

The others have explained the linguistical differences.

There is also no difference to saying “Ghost” or “Spirit” both are correct translations (in English) of the Third Person of the Holy Trinity.

In the East, we often refer to the Third Person as “the All Holy Spirit.” (emphasis mine)

Thanks for praying so thoughtfully that you let the words wash over you,
Deacon Christopher