If Jesus paid for our sins why are we still punished if we sin?

[timberland501]

I’m in a conversation and would like help articulating a point. objection I’m getting is below:

if Jesus paid for our sins why are we still punished if we sin? If Jesus paid for our sins “free and clear” then our sins are paid for.

Is it Jesus gave himself as a ransom to free us from sin and now we are in debt to Jesus?

 

[adf417]

This may help.

Sanctified for All Time | Catholic Answers Magazine

Peace!!!

 

[Vico]

I’m in a conversation and would like help articulating a point. objection I’m getting is below:

if Jesus paid for our sins why are we still punished if we sin? If Jesus paid for our sins “free and clear” then our sins are paid for.

Is it Jesus gave himself as a ransom to free us from sin and now we are in debt to Jesus?

Freed from slavery to sin, provided that one cooperates with the gift of grace.

John 8:34-36

34 Jesus answered them: Amen, amen I say unto you: that whosoever committeth sin, is the servant of sin. 35 Now the servant abideth not in the house for ever; but the son abideth for ever. 36 If therefore the son shall make you free, you shall be free indeed.

John 15:4

4 Abide in me, and I in you. As the branch cannot bear fruit of itself, unless it abide in the vine, so neither can you, unless you abide in me.

 

[JerryZ]

So Jesus payed for all of the sins of humanity past, present and future.
However the question is does that give you the RIGHT to keep on sinning?
Then you are really taking Jesus for a fool. Thinking that when we sin because Jesus payed the price we are not responsible for our actions.
Jesus restored humanity to GOD where IF we ABIDE in HIM as HE preached then we may partake of the divine glory something that human beings have absolutely no RIGHT to receive.

Also Jesus clearly stated to those who asked HIM what it entailed to follow HIM “PICK UP YOUR CROSS AND FOLLOW ME”.
HE did not say since I went to the cross for you now you can go an fool around.

Peace!

 

[Usagi]

Catholic theology of sin distinguishes between eternal punishment (in Hell) and temporal punishment
(in this world or in Purgatory).

Jesus died to save us from Hell. However, in this world our sins may still have negative consequences (costing us relationships, getting us locked up in prison, or whatever). And Jesus doesn’t just clear us of our sins without changing us – He also wants to make us the kind of people who don’t sin, to sanctify us. If not completed by death, that process of “cleaning up” can continue in the state we call Purgatory.

 

[Beryllos]

if Jesus paid for our sins why are we still punished if we sin? If Jesus paid for our sins “free and clear” then our sins are paid for.

It’s like this:
(Please Note: This uploaded content is no longer available.)

We are ransomed, but we like our jail.

 

[Genesis315]

Let’s say I steal a five dollar bill from you. I have sinned. Later, I am contrite, and I confess my sin with a contrite heart and am forgiven by God. Can I just say Jesus paid the price of my sin and walk away five dollars richer? Am I now totally clean? No–I still have the ill-gotten five dollars in my wallet. I still carry with me that injustice. What is the fruit worthy of my repentance for stealing? To give it back, or, if that is not possible, to give it as alms or make some other amends. A sin should not make me come out ahead–Jesus’ sacrifice does not mean we get to benefit from or perpetuate an injustice. I still need to expiate it.

Every sin carries with it some kind of stain of injustice, even if intangible, including honor we should have given to God which we did not. Yes, Christ reconciles us to God as only He can, but in, with, and through Christ, we should still try and give back to God what we should have given Him (even though we can’t really completely–it’s the good will in it that “satisfies”) just as we would our neighbor we have sinned against. Most priests assign prayer as a penance for this reason, since by it we give honor and love to God. Sometimes God exacts this Himself through chastisements, which bring His children the “fruit of justice.” (cf. Heb 12:11). This is what we call “temporal punishment” and the process of applying these expiatory and satisfying punishments after death is purgatory.

 

[goout]

Sin has consequences. Christ’s redemptive sacrifice does not take away the temporal suffering caused by sin, Christ defeats death and it’s eternal consequences.

The temporal consequences of sin are great motivation by the way. When I recognize the enduring harm my sin has caused to myself and others, it ought to chasten me.

 

[HomeschoolDad]

timberland501:

if Jesus paid for our sins why are we still punished if we sin? If Jesus paid for our sins “free and clear” then our sins are paid for.

It’s like this:
(Please Note: This uploaded content is no longer available.)

We are ransomed, but we like our jail.

I’m reminded here of how I see the difference between Protestantism and Catholicism:

In Protestantism, you are drowning 40 feet offshore, and Our Lord throws you a 50-foot rope.

In Catholicism, you are drowning 40 feet offshore, Our Lord throws you a 30-foot rope, and you are expected to swim the ten feet between you and the rope.

I mean nothing sacrilegious by this, I think it simply illustrates the difference between “salvation is offered to you in abundance, and you needn’t do anything other than believe and accept the gift” (Protestantism) and "you can be saved, Jesus made this possible, but you are expected to do your part, and keep doing your part — it’s not a ‘slam dunk’ " (Catholicism). Does this make sense?

For the Catholic, salvation is a lifelong struggle to live and die in God’s friendship.

 

[fhansen]

Because we’re not only forgiven but washed, cleansed, and made new creations enabled by the Holy Spirit to walk as children of God, meaning uprightly, in justice and truth, in obedience of Gods will. But we’re still not forced to obey any more than Adam was at the beginning.

But we’re expected to live this way; the New Covenant was never about relieving man of the obligation to be righteous but rather about finally giving us the true means to that righteousness, in partnership with God.

“Apart from Me you can do nothing”. John 15:5
Adam had thought otherwise. We’re here to learn how wrong Adam was. Man was made for communion with God. Here’s the most important New Covenant prophecy, from Jeremiah 31:33-34 where a new direct and personal knowledge of God, forgiveness of sin, and fulfillment of the law by Him are all part of our coming into this new right standing with Him.

“I will put my law in their minds
and write it on their hearts.
I will be their God,
and they will be my people.
No longer will they teach their neighbor,
or say to one another, ‘Know the Lord,’
because they will all know me,
from the least of them to the greatest,”
declares the Lord.
“For I will forgive their wickedness
and will remember their sins no more.”

The definition of that righteousness that He gives us is primarily love, which fulfills the law by its nature (Rom 13:10). But this relationship or communion with God, that justifies, or causes righteousness in us, can be broken, by our walking unjustly, by persistently sinning in some grave or serious manner IOW. Mortal sin is said to oppose love, and destroy love in us. But, with God’s desire for all of us to be with Him, His forgiveness is ever present if we have a true change of heart and wish to return. The sacrament of Reconciliation/Confession serves that purpose, of course. Our wills are never taken out of the equation; the more we will in agreement with Gods will, the more righteous or just we are. That’s what He wants for us and the fulfillment of the Greatest Commandments have the same objective.

 

[Gorgias]

I’m reminded here of how I see the difference between Protestantism and Catholicism:

In Protestantism, you are drowning 40 feet offshore, and Our Lord throws you a 50-foot rope.

In Catholicism, you are drowning 40 feet offshore, Our Lord throws you a 30-foot rope, and you are expected to swim the ten feet between you and the rope.

I see it a little differently. In Protestantism, there’s the belief that God simply plucks you out of the water without any action on your part. In Catholicism, you get a 50 foot rope, thrown directly to you; you’re asked to hang on, but it’s God’s effort to pull you to shore. It’s up to you to hold on, though.

Similar perspective on the cartoon: the key is already in the lock and the door’s open. Some folks can’t turn away from the bars and the bread that seems out of reach, though.

 

[HomeschoolDad]

HomeschoolDad:

I’m reminded here of how I see the difference between Protestantism and Catholicism:

In Protestantism, you are drowning 40 feet offshore, and Our Lord throws you a 50-foot rope.

In Catholicism, you are drowning 40 feet offshore, Our Lord throws you a 30-foot rope, and you are expected to swim the ten feet between you and the rope.

I see it a little differently. In Protestantism, there’s the belief that God simply plucks you out of the water without any action on your part. In Catholicism, you get a 50 foot rope, thrown directly to you; you’re asked to hang on, but it’s God’s effort to pull you to shore. It’s up to you to hold on, though.

That’s another way of looking at it. I know you know this, but in Protestantism, while it is foreseen that the saved sinner will do good works — the fruit of his having been saved and having the grace of the Holy Spirit in him — nothing he “does” could “save” him (we probably share that part). And not just that, but nothing that he “does” can make him holier or increase the grace he has, whereas in Catholicism, you most certainly can grow in holiness and merit. (Somebody please correct me if I’m not seeing that correctly.)

 

[Justin_Mary]

I’m in a conversation and would like help articulating a point. objection I’m getting is below:

if Jesus paid for our sins why are we still punished if we sin? If Jesus paid for our sins “free and clear” then our sins are paid for.

Is it Jesus gave himself as a ransom to free us from sin and now we are in debt to Jesus?

If you look at God’s law as restrictive or contrary to life, you are a slave, thinking in terms of reward & punishment.

Jesus freed us from that slavery, showed us we are sons of the Living God. His law then leads to life. True life He wishes us to live abundantly.

So we shouldn’t look at it as punishment, but refinement.

 

[Everest]

I’m in a conversation and would like help articulating a point. objection I’m getting is below:

if Jesus paid for our sins why are we still punished if we sin? If Jesus paid for our sins “free and clear” then our sins are paid for.

Is it Jesus gave himself as a ransom to free us from sin and now we are in debt to Jesus?

Protestants don’t seem to understand the difference between Redemption and Salvation. Jesus did not save us on the Cross. He redeemed everyone and gave us the chance to live lives true to his teachings and if true to the end we will be saved if we die in a state of grace.

 

[redcatholic]

Because milk still has to be cleaned up.
Let me explain,
If you come over to my house and you are thirsty and I offer you a glass of milk, you are careless with the way you handle it and you drop it shattering the glass and spilling milk everywhere, you will apologize, feel shame, and say you are sorry. I will of course, forgive you, but there is still a big mess on my floor. Yes, I can get on my hands and knees and clean it up for you but you, as a gracious guest will clean it up.

 

[Dan_Defender]

nothing that he “does” can make him holier or increase the grace he has, whereas in Catholicism, you most certainly can grow in holiness and merit.

You are correct. Just ask what about spiritual growth? and you will get a blank stare from a Protestant.

 

[HomeschoolDad]

HomeschoolDad:

nothing that he “does” can make him holier or increase the grace he has, whereas in Catholicism, you most certainly can grow in holiness and merit.

You are correct. Just ask what about spiritual growth? and you will get a blank stare from a Protestant.

Not sure I would go that far — Protestants do have the concept of being a “baby Christian” when one is first saved and/or baptized — but if I’m understanding their thinking correctly, you go straight from hell-bound sinner to child of God going straight to heaven in one instant, with the latter never changing (at least among the OSAS crowd).

I read a pretty pathetic obituary, obviously written well before the fact (possibly by the departed himself), about how he was going to “shake the Master’s hand”, as well as meet all of his friends, some of whom were celebrities (he was a big country music fan and knew these people), not a word about being pierced to the core, utterly shaking, dumbstruck, and overcome by being in the presence of the Beatific Vision.