Indulgences: Help please!

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Marie5890

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Only been in communion since Easter Vigil '07.

There still is an area of Catholicism that I find questionable (if not, if I were being honest as to where I am at, dopey sounding)

It’s the idea of indulgences. It sounds so legalistic to the point of not taking into account God’s love and mercy.

It seems, in my view, focusing on “works” and “hoop jumping”

Please forgive me if I sound disrespectful. I dont mean to be. But rather my question over this is in earnest.

It sounds dopey to my naive mind.
Thanks for listening and explaining . 🙂
 
Only been in communion since Easter Vigil '07.

There still is an area of Catholicism that I find questionable (if not, if I were being honest as to where I am at, dopey sounding)

It’s the idea of indulgences. It sounds so legalistic to the point of not taking into account God’s love and mercy.

It seems, in my view, focusing on “works” and “hoop jumping”

Please forgive me if I sound disrespectful. I dont mean to be. But rather my question over this is in earnest.

It sounds dopey to my naive mind.
Thanks for listening and explaining . 🙂
I would like to say something being honest with your thoughts and confession are the best feeling ever. Because GOD already knows what we are going to say so say it with your heart and cleanse your soul. GOD wants us to be able to talk to him all the time just whisper to him and talk to him he will hear you!!!
 
Thanks Stephe!

To be honest, this just re-enforces my thoughts about the hoop-jumping over mercy however. 😦

The Pharisee vs tax collector parable. 😊
 
Marie, would it help if I said that indulgences have nothing to do with the forgiveness of sins, ie: the sins must already be forgiven in order to receive an indulgence? the indulgences are just to repair the effects that the sins had on our souls… such as: greater attachment to the world, less love for God, more self will, etc.
 
‘And God indeed having winked at the times of this ignorance, now declareth unto men, that all should everywhere do penance.’

Acts of the Apostles 17:30

Every sin owes a debt of penance. We are to, as repentant sinners do penance for our sins throughout all our lives.

Just like criminals being due a certain amount of corporal punishment for their crimes, a certain number of strokes of the cane, a certain number of days of harsh prison confinement, etc. In fact precisely so. It is a debt of punishment, which God holds us to.

There are traditional penances for sins that give an idea of what penance one is held to by God for each sins, these are given in the Penitentials or Liber Poenitentiales. 🙂

Every time we go to Confession the priest assigns us a penance. This is not the whole penance due to the sin, it is only a part, in these times due to human weakness normally only a very small part. We are expected to make up the rest on our own.

Penances can be and are most fittingly the opposite of what what the sin is. If we have sinned through gluttony, we should fast and give up even good food we could eat without sin, if we have sinned through anger, we should be meek and give up even lawful anger, sinned through a love of comfort, give up comforts and do what is difficult, etc…

Traditional penances are also, corporal and internal mortification, pilgrimages, prayers, etc. 🙂

The old indulgences given with numbers of days, years, etc. reflect the amount of time necessary to spend in penance to expiate various sins.

For example, St. Charles Borromeo, Archbishop, giving instructions to his priests on penances proscribes penance guidelines as follows: “Depending upon the circumstances, adultery is a sin requiring penance for five, seven, or even ten years.” “Children who curse their parents should be given a penance of bread and water for forty days.” etc.

‘So I say to you, there shall be joy before the angels of God upon one sinner doing penance.’

Luke 15:10

These examples should give an idea of the true measure of penance due. We can look back through the ages to the early Church for this consistent example, that can become somewhat obscured in an aberrant times of laxity like this.

The saints practiced penitential acts throughout their lives, and Christ’s life was one of sorrow and penance, though He was innocent. The merit of these penances considered all together were superabundant, more than enough.

Since there is an overflowing treasury of penance through Christ and His saints…

So, we can ask for indulgences, so that their penances can make up for ours.

What this means is, the stripes we are due, the pains we are due, someone else has done, and we ask for the indulgence of God and the Church that they pay our just punishment instead of us.

And so the Church gives indulgences to certain prayers and acts, which gives them additional penitential worth to make up for the penalty due our sins. She calls upon the indulgence of Heaven for those on earth.

The Holy Souls in purgatory did not sufficient do penance in this life.

Therefor, they are detained in purgatory to be punished and make up for the lack of penance they did not do in this life.

We can ask that the indulgences we gain on this earth towards the punishment we are due for our sins, be applied to them too, to shorten their time in purgatory.

Since purgatorial penance is far more terrible than the penance we do in this life, this is a very charitable and worthwhile act, and we gain friends in Heaven by this charity.

So it is very simple. We are due punishment, the saints did more than enough penance, Christ did so, we substitute their punishments for ours, letting them take the strokes we are due.

If this troubles a person, letting others take on what is our just punishment, that is understandable… It is what we should be doing for others more than relying on ourselves. And should make a person all the more penitential, so rather than only gaining indulgences, one is part of the gift of them in the next life. 🙂

God’s mercy is applied to us in regards to penances through indulgences and our penitential acts… We do owe a true debt to justice… especially as long as we have any attachment to sin.

This is what the way of the Cross that Christ walks and calls us to walk too is about. We recognize we are sinners. We recognize we have to do penance, and sin no more, as Christ calls us to do.

Penance is both a debt, and the good but bitter medicine that corrects us and teaches us to avoid sinning in the future.

“No, I say to you; but except you do penance, you shall all likewise perish.”

Luke 13:5
 
‘And God indeed having winked at the times of this ignorance, now declareth unto men, that all should everywhere do penance.’

Acts of the Apostles 17:30

Every sin owes a debt of penance. We are to, as repentant sinners do penance for our sins throughout all our lives.

Just like criminals being due a certain amount of corporal punishment for their crimes, a certain number of strokes of the cane, a certain number of days of harsh prison confinement, etc. In fact precisely so. It is a debt of punishment, which God holds us to.

There are traditional penances for sins that give an idea of what penance one is held to by God for each sins, these are given in the Penitentials or Liber Poenitentiales. 🙂

Every time we go to Confession the priest assigns us a penance. This is not the whole penance due to the sin, it is only a part, in these times due to human weakness normally only a very small part. We are expected to make up the rest on our own.

Penances can be and are most fittingly the opposite of what what the sin is. If we have sinned through gluttony, we should fast and give up even good food we could eat without sin, if we have sinned through anger, we should be meek and give up even lawful anger, sinned through a love of comfort, give up comforts and do what is difficult, etc…

Traditional penances are also, corporal and internal mortification, pilgrimages, prayers, etc. 🙂

The old indulgences given with numbers of days, years, etc. reflect the amount of time necessary to spend in penance to expiate various sins.

For example, St. Charles Borromeo, Archbishop, giving instructions to his priests on penances proscribes penance guidelines as follows: “Depending upon the circumstances, adultery is a sin requiring penance for five, seven, or even ten years.” “Children who curse their parents should be given a penance of bread and water for forty days.” etc.

‘So I say to you, there shall be joy before the angels of God upon one sinner doing penance.’

Luke 15:10

These examples should give an idea of the true measure of penance due. We can look back through the ages to the early Church for this consistent example, that can become somewhat obscured in an aberrant times of laxity like this.

The saints practiced penitential acts throughout their lives, and Christ’s life was one of sorrow and penance, though He was innocent. The merit of these penances considered all together were superabundant, more than enough.

Since there is an overflowing treasury of penance through Christ and His saints…

So, we can ask for indulgences, so that their penances can make up for ours.

What this means is, the stripes we are due, the pains we are due, someone else has done, and we ask for the indulgence of God and the Church that they pay our just punishment instead of us.

And so the Church gives indulgences to certain prayers and acts, which gives them additional penitential worth to make up for the penalty due our sins. She calls upon the indulgence of Heaven for those on earth.

The Holy Souls in purgatory did not sufficient do penance in this life.

Therefor, they are detained in purgatory to be punished and make up for the lack of penance they did not do in this life.

We can ask that the indulgences we gain on this earth towards the punishment we are due for our sins, be applied to them too, to shorten their time in purgatory.

Since purgatorial penance is far more terrible than the penance we do in this life, this is a very charitable and worthwhile act, and we gain friends in Heaven by this charity.

So it is very simple. We are due punishment, the saints did more than enough penance, Christ did so, we substitute their punishments for ours, letting them take the strokes we are due.

If this troubles a person, letting others take on what is our just punishment, that is understandable… It is what we should be doing for others more than relying on ourselves. And should make a person all the more penitential, so rather than only gaining indulgences, one is part of the gift of them in the next life. 🙂

God’s mercy is applied to us in regards to penances through indulgences and our penitential acts… We do owe a true debt to justice… especially as long as we have any attachment to sin.

This is what the way of the Cross that Christ walks and calls us to walk too is about. We recognize we are sinners. We recognize we have to do penance, and sin no more, as Christ calls us to do.

Penance is both a debt, and the good but bitter medicine that corrects us and teaches us to avoid sinning in the future.

“No, I say to you; but except you do penance, you shall all likewise perish.”

Luke 13:5
This is the best explanation I have seen/heard on indulgences. I have had such a hard time understanding them and getting my head around the explanations I have recd. There are people in my church that shy away from the topic. Granted the word can bring up negative images, buying indulgences etc.

Thank you for posting this.
 
Shin,

The is the best explanation I have heard or read thus far. I still have some meditating and praying on it, but you have given me a solid foundation of understanding to start from.

I thank you for taking the time to go into the lengthy explanation.
Have a bless day.

God Bless.
 
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