Intercessory prayer -- how would you respond?

[jc413]

In a parenting forum I frequent online (mostly Protestant) a discussion has started up about the Catholic Church’s teaching on intercessory prayer (it started as a discussion on the movie “The Passion” – go figure!).

After I, and another member, clarified that Catholics do NOT believe in praying TO Mary or the saints (as in worshipping) but believe in praying for their intercession, someone wrote the following response:

“The problem with asking someone (Mary or any other saint)to pray for you is NOT found in the Bible. I don’t care if they’re praying TO the saints or asking the saints to pray FOR them. It’s NOT IN THE BIBLE.”

I know Catholics believe in tradition, and we do not believe in sola scriptura. However, I also believe she is wrong, but I don’t know how to respond. Help! Thanks.

 

[Crusader]

jc413:

In a parenting forum I frequent online (mostly Protestant) a discussion has started up about the Catholic Church’s teaching on intercessory prayer (it started as a discussion on the movie “The Passion” – go figure!).

After I, and another member, clarified that Catholics do NOT believe in praying TO Mary or the saints (as in worshipping) but believe in praying for their intercession, someone wrote the following response:

“The problem with asking someone (Mary or any other saint)to pray for you is NOT found in the Bible. I don’t care if they’re praying TO the saints or asking the saints to pray FOR them. It’s NOT IN THE BIBLE.”

I know Catholics believe in tradition, and we do not believe in sola scriptura. However, I also believe she is wrong, but I don’t know how to respond. Help! Thanks.

Catholic Christians believe in Sacred Tradition as opposed to man-made customs, disciplines or “traditions.” The notion that everything God gave us is located in the Bible is simply not biblical. She’s following a man-made custom.

In any event, the prime example of the Bible illustrating that we should seek Mother Mary’s intercession is the Hail Mary which comes from the Gospel of Luke:
*Hail Mary, full of grace, the Lord is with thee. *(Luke 1:27, 28). *Blessed art thou among women, and blessed is the fruit of thy womb. *(Luke 1:42, Luke 1:48)…

 

[Todd_Easton]

Catholic Answers has a paper on this, part of which is qouted below (www.catholic.com/library/Praying_to_the_Saints.asp):

The Bible directs us to invoke those in heaven and ask them to pray with us. Thus in Psalms 103, we pray, “Bless the Lord, O you his angels, you mighty ones who do his word, hearkening to the voice of his word! Bless the Lord, all his hosts, his ministers that do his will!” (Ps. 103:20-21). And in Psalms 148 we pray, “Praise the Lord! Praise the Lord from the heavens, praise him in the heights! Praise him, all his angels, praise him, all his host!” (Ps. 148:1-2).

I would also recommend Patrick Madrid’s book, Any Friend of God’s Is a Friend of Mine: A Biblical and Historical Explanation of the Catholic Doctrine of the Communion of Saints, (Basilica Press, 1996)

 

[Nana_Rose]

Great question!! I get this all the time too, and I tell them this.
“Have you ever asked anyone to pray for you? I mean your pastor or a friend, a family member?” Of course they usually always say sure. Then I ask them…“Are those who die in Christ not alive in Christ?” Of course they agree. Then I say, “This is the body of Christ, the communion of saints, the church here on earth and in heaven, and just as you would ask your pastor or any christian you respect to pray for you we ask those in heaven, our other brothers and sisters in Christ to pray for us too.” I’m sure they won’t refute that with the Bible! Also, the Bible does mention that the prayers of the righteous avail much. Not sure where that is in the Bible…the old testament I think, and who is more righteous than those who have made it home!?

 

[PioMagnus]

JESUS TALKING TO THE DEAD!!!

-Since the Christians that bring this up to you would never think that Jesus would commit a sin (and they’d be right) you’d imagine that an acusation of Jesus commiting necromancy (talking to the dead) would offend them.

Well…Let’s take a look and see what Jesus did, shall we?

Mt. 17:3-5 and Lk 9:30-31

Jesus talks to two saints. They are both dead (Elijah can be argued over, since he was taken up in a whirlwind, so focus on Moses). Jesus talks with them, which would be the sin of necromancy, wouldn’t it?

Well, the very fact that Jesus did this tells us that it is NOT always a sin to “speak with the dead”–Why? Well, in this case it can be said that he is speaking with those who are “Alive in Christ.”

Let’s look to scripture for more evidence supporting The Saints…

Look in Revelation (Can’t remmber exactly where) where it speaks of the prayers of the rightious being like incense or something like that. That should help you out alot.

I don’t have time to type it all up here, but if you look for the book Scriptural Catholicism by Steven L. Kellmyer you will get answers on this, and a wide variety of “where’s that” questions. It’s hard to find though.

-PM

 

[Toni]

Intercession of the Virgin Mary CC 969, 1434, 2156, 2683.

The Angelus is Biblical, The Magnificat.
Jim Caviezel said in the last moments of Christ life that he gave Mary to all of us as a mother and it is in obedience to Christ to ask her to intercede for us. The quote is biblical but I am sure the understanding your friend may not agree with.
In teaching children I always ask them who is the first person your run to when your hurt, when you want or need something? They always answer their moms. As we go to our Mother in Heaven to intercede for us.Great lesson and the point always makes its home to the parents, even the non catholic!

 

[jeffreedy789]

as a former protestant, i can tell you that they will not accept any of the scriptures that have been mentioned thus far as support (proof, they would think of it) for the concept of the communion of saints.

the answer is, there is no strong Biblical support. if there were, protestants would practice it. basically, almost every issue that protestants do not believe in that catholics do is a matter of whether the Bible clearly says it or not.

one poster had a good idea, the one i usually use - to point out that your friend probably asks living people to pray for them. then i point out that, provided you believe that people who have died are still ‘alive’ and can ‘hear us’, that they’re the best people in the world to ask for intercession, because they a) are free from the presence of sin, b) have (arguably) more time to pray than we do, c) are probably free from distraction, and d) will not gossip about our requests!

also, i’d point out that the creed, which has been around for… quite some time (google it to find out) has the communion of saints in it, and that the concept we’re discussing is the communion of saints.

then, if i were you, i would drop it. you’re probably not going to change alot of minds regarding the issue, and will only ostracize yourself from the discussion with your ‘crazy catholic beliefs’.

God bless you in your discussions.