Intimate Relations in Marriage

[MeOnly]

Ok. Forgive me for being confused. I’m reading other posts here so all contraceptive is a sin. I can understand that. I thought that sex was something to be shared between a husband and wife as expressing their love for one another in addition to procreation. Am I correct in stating that all other sexual acts are sinful? Performing acts out of love and pleasure is wrong?

Thanks!

 

[chevalier]

You need to make difference between sings of physical affection and sexual activities. Nothing wrong about the former, but the latter are supposed to be tied to marital intercourse. Cutting it at foreplay is considered sinful.

 

[Feanaro_s_Wife]

MeOnly:

Ok. Forgive me for being confused. I’m reading other posts here so all contraceptive is a sin. I can understand that. I thought that sex was something to be shared between a husband and wife as expressing their love for one another in addition to procreation. Am I correct in stating that all other sexual acts are sinful? Performing acts out of love and pleasure is wrong?

Thanks!

Performing acts (even if out of love) for pleasure that do not end up in a completed “marital act” is wrong.

As long as you intend to have intercourse with the man “finishing” inside of his wife, then you are free to express your love in almost any way you wish.

Yes, each act must be open to life. But the other two important points are that they be unitive and pleasurable for both people.

The book “The Good News About Sex and Marriage” by Christopher West will do a much better job of explaining this than I have. Check it out.

Malia

 

[tuopaolo]

My understanding is that extra-intercoursal sexual acts were wrong only if brought to “completion.”

 

[Thepeug]

tuopaolo:

My understanding is that extra-intercoursal sexual acts were wrong only if brought to “completion.”

That’s what I understand as well.

 

[TZiggy]

Interesting question!

I have a personal spin to this question. My wife and I follow the churches teaching on contraception, but due to medical reasons can’t trust NFP. For the same medical reasons, getting pregnant could very well endanger my wifes life.

How does the church look at “finished” acts of intimacy when intercourse for the rest of our fertile life could potentially leave four kids without a mother.

Praying, daily rosaries, talks with priests, talks with doctors, it’s been a two year walk with our own personal cross. It all looks pretty black and white until you live in the gray! Maybe someone out there has an answer.

 

[rayne89]

TZiggy:

Interesting question!

I have a personal spin to this question. My wife and I follow the churches teaching on contraception, but due to medical reasons can’t trust NFP. For the same medical reasons, getting pregnant could very well endanger my wifes life.

How does the church look at “finished” acts of intimacy when intercourse for the rest of our fertile life could potentially leave four kids without a mother.

Praying, daily rosaries, talks with priests, talks with doctors, it’s been a two year walk with our own personal cross. It all looks pretty black and white until you live in the gray! Maybe someone out there has an answer.

I feel for you, and will keep you and your wife in my prayers. If you can not use NFP, and can not have children than you must be celibate until your wife goes thru menopause. That doesn’t mean no affection ofcourse.
I have a very serious heart problem that will we require a transplant in a few years. We have one daughter who’s nine. Another pregnancy would almost certainly be fatal for me. I have used NFP since we had our daughter and trusted in God.
Are you saying her medical condition makes NFP signs unreliable? Have you consulted with the Couple to Couple league?
May God give you abundant grace to sustain you during this difficult time. God Bless.

 

[TZiggy]

Thank you for your prayers!

NFP unreliability comes both from her physical condition, AND our schedule. Given the right conditions, we might be able to make sense of her charts. Unfortunately, I travel a great deal. Our two youngest 3yrs and 1.5yrs still get up regularly in the wee hours. When I’m gone, this prevents my wife from taking an accurate temperature (which is about the only indicator we have to follow). Even without the early morning munchkins, her temperature is erratic.
She’s a convert, (and a very wonderful and supportive person I might add), but my convictions are putting stress (not dangerous stress) on a strong marraige. It’s difficult to believe God wills this.
Despite many varied opinions, I’ve not been able to discern Gods Will in this matter.

 

[demolitionman65]

My understanding is that extra-intercoursal sexual acts were wrong only if brought to “completion.”

That is correct; virtually all “extra-intercoursal” activities are OK, so long as the intent is “completing” within the wife. An “accident” outside the wife -I expect- if they intended intercourse would be OK; so long as it was a one-time occurence.

 

[Thepeug]

TZiggy:

It’s difficult to believe God wills this.
Despite many varied opinions, I’ve not been able to discern Gods Will in this matter.

T,

Your situation really sounds like a tough one. I think discernment is far easier with the guidance of a priest or a pastoral counselor. Internet forums can offer sound opinions, but in this instance, you’ll want to seek advice from someone who’s trained in such matters, and both priests and pastoral counselors certainly fit the bill. Also, remember that God gives each of us the gift of an individual conscience, and we our called to form that conscience and exercise it while always being mindful of Church teachings. Pray often, listen to God in prayer, seek some professional advice in the matter, and I’m sure everything will work out. I’ll be praying for you and your wife.
God bless,
Chris

 

[tuopaolo]

demolitionman65:

That is correct; virtually all “extra-intercoursal” activities are OK, so long as the intent is “completing” within the wife. An “accident” outside the wife -I expect- if they intended intercourse would be OK; so long as it was a one-time occurence.

My understanding though was that even if one (whether husband or wife) doesn’t intend “completion” within intercourse, that it is still OK as long as “completion” is also not intended outside of intercourse, allowing for occasional accidents as you mentioned. Maybe I’m not being very clear with all these euphemisms

 

[felra]

TZiggy:

Thank you for your prayers!

NFP unreliability comes both from her physical condition, AND our schedule. Given the right conditions, we might be able to make sense of her charts. Unfortunately, I travel a great deal. Our two youngest 3yrs and 1.5yrs still get up regularly in the wee hours. When I’m gone, this prevents my wife from taking an accurate temperature (which is about the only indicator we have to follow). Even without the early morning munchkins, her temperature is erratic.
She’s a convert, (and a very wonderful and supportive person I might add), but my convictions are putting stress (not dangerous stress) on a strong marraige. It’s difficult to believe God wills this.
Despite many varied opinions, I’ve not been able to discern Gods Will in this matter.

Here are a few passages from the Catechism of the Catholic Church that help us understand our role in seeking to be guided by Church teaching to properly inform and form our conscience to know and do God’s will (but by the grace of God).

“In the formation of conscience the Word of God is the light for our path, we must assimiliate it in faith and prayer and put it into practice. We must also examine our conscience before the Lord’s Cross. We are assisted by the gifts of the Holy Spirit, aided by the witness or advice of others and guided by the authoritative teaching of the Church.” (CCC 1785).

“Man is sometimes confronted by situations that make moral judgements less assured and decision making difficult. But he must always seriously seek what is right and good and discern the will of God expressed in divine law. To this purpose, man strives to interpret the data of experience and the signs of the times assisted by the virtue of prudence, by the advice of competent people, and by the help of the Holy Spirit and his gifts. Some rules apply in every case: -One may never do evil so that good may result from it;” (CCC1787, 1788, 1789).

Note: I have had to discard “the witness or advice of others” and and seek “the advice of competent people” who are “guided by the authoritative teaching of the Church” in my own personal experience to know and do God’s will in similiar challenging situation in my life (including discarding the “bad” pastoral advice/“opinions” of priests that contradicted authoritative Church teaching).

God bless.