Is a mass valid if priest is in the state of mortal sin?

[Galnextdoor]

I know this has probably been addressed somewhere on this thread, but I can’t find it. As long as the proper liturgical language and rubrics are followed, is the mass said by a priest valid? For instance, when I was young, a priest would molest me and then say mass the next morning. Was that mass valid? He always made fun of the people like St. Thomas Aquinas and St. Augustine. He said that St. Thomas Aquinas was a bloated glutton who had OCD. He said that St. Augustine had fun all his life and then when he got tired of it, he turned around and tried to make it so nobody else could.

If a priest says mass, then in his sermon says that we should stop being petty and arguing about issues like abortion, gay marriage, sex before marriage. That arguing about issues like this just make us divisive, That getting stuck on issues like these is narrow-minded. The Catholic church has become narrow minded and we need to accept and love all people regardless of what side of these issues people are on. God’s heaven has many rooms and if God has room for people of all sides of issues, we should too. If he says that the bishops are wrong to consider abortion the important issue in elections, because social justice was more important, does that effect the validity of any of the sacraments he performs?

I guess what I want to know is can a priest say or do anything before, during the sermon, or after the mass that would invalidate the mass he says as long as all the prayers are said properly?

 

[Rolltide]

The idea that a priest being in a state of sin can invalidate a Mass or a sacrament is a heresy known as Donatism. As long as all the prayers said are correct, and the priest is in fact validly ordained, then everything else is valid. The reason this is considered a heresy is simply because ALL humans are sinners. Exactly how much personal sin would one have to commit in order for a Mass to be invalid? How could you ever possibly know for sure if your priest was not in a state of sin? (Is it even truly possible for a priest to be 100% free from sin, other than going to Confession immediately before saying Mass?) Imagine finding out you had a priest that had committed a crime that went unreported for years. Did all of the hundreds of baptisms he performed suddenly become nullified? Are all those people running around out there believing they’re part of the Catholic Church with valid baptisms, in fact, unbaptised, with none of their sins forgiven? Would the church, upon learning of the crime, have to desperately track down all of these people and rebaptise them? Of course not!

 

[Saber_Mom]

I do not know the answer to your question, but I am heartbroken that your priest molested you when you were young. I will pray for you. I’m so sorry.

 

[Jelrak_TB]

I know this has probably been addressed somewhere on this thread, but I can’t find it. As long as the proper liturgical language and rubrics are followed, is the mass said by a priest valid? For instance, when I was young, a priest would molest me and then say mass the next morning. Was that mass valid? He always made fun of the people like St. Thomas Aquinas and St. Augustine. He said that St. Thomas Aquinas was a bloated glutton who had OCD. He said that St. Augustine had fun all his life and then when he got tired of it, he turned around and tried to make it so nobody else could.

If a priest says mass, then in his sermon says that we should stop being petty and arguing about issues like abortion, gay marriage, sex before marriage. That arguing about issues like this just make us divisive, That getting stuck on issues like these is narrow-minded. The Catholic church has become narrow minded and we need to accept and love all people regardless of what side of these issues people are on. God’s heaven has many rooms and if God has room for people of all sides of issues, we should too. If he says that the bishops are wrong to consider abortion the important issue in elections, because social justice was more important, does that effect the validity of any of the sacraments he performs?

I guess what I want to know is can a priest say or do anything before, during the sermon, or after the mass that would invalidate the mass he says as long as all the prayers are said properly?

Yes it is totally valid. Sorry to hear that you were molested. I sincerely hope it did not cause you a lot of grief having such a poor leader as your role model…

 

[phil_at_dayboro]

Thank you for asking this Question, it’s one I had thought of asking myself,
I could raise several scenarios,but the answers seem to cover it all,
I think if a person is really concerned about the wrongdoings of a particular priest,
They could always have wedding vows renewed , I have been told you shouldn’t
be re baptised , but why not if it makes you as an individual feel better,
I see no reason not to reconfirmed your commitment to your faith if it makes you feel better

 

[Antegin]

I am so sorry you were molested by a priest. I hope you have been able to find counseling and assistance from your diocese. That priests’ sin will be addressed by God, but if the Church lost you because of his misdeeds, it would be tragic indeed.

 

[powerofk]

As stated before, the Mass is still considered valid (there really is no way for most in the congregation, if any, to know if the priest is in a state of mortal sin, anyway). However, as priests are required to partake of communion (under both species, may I add) before anyone else may partake of communion, he brings judgment upon himself by saying Mass in a state of mortal sin.

And as everyone else has said, due to the actions of this priest, you have been given a heavy cross to bear. Continue to pray, seek the help of a good Catholic counselor, and don’t let the actions of this one unworthy priest sway you from the Truth of the Church.

 

[Vico]

As stated before, the Mass is still considered valid (there really is no way for most in the congregation, if any, to know if the priest is in a state of mortal sin, anyway). However, as priests are required to partake of communion (under both species, may I add) before anyone else may partake of communion, he brings judgment upon himself by saying Mass in a state of mortal sin.

And as everyone else has said, due to the actions of this priest, you have been given a heavy cross to bear. Continue to pray, seek the help of a good Catholic counselor, and don’t let the actions of this one unworthy priest sway you from the Truth of the Church.

CIC Canon law covers that situation, prohibiting celebration without a grave reason and non opportunity to confess, but then an act of*** perfect contrition ***is needed:
Can. 916 A person who is conscious of grave sin is not to celebrate Mass or receive the body of the Lord without previous sacramental confession unless there is a grave reason and there is no opportunity to confess; in this case the person is to remember the obligation to make an act of perfect contrition which includes the resolution of confessing as soon as possible.

 

[powerofk]

CIC Canon law covers that situation, prohibiting celebration without a grave reason and non opportunity to confess, but then an act of*** perfect contrition ***is needed:
Can. 916 A person who is conscious of grave sin is not to celebrate Mass or receive the body of the Lord without previous sacramental confession unless there is a grave reason and there is no opportunity to confess; in this case the person is to remember the obligation to make an act of perfect contrition which includes the resolution of confessing as soon as possible.

Of course, technically, then, under this circumstance, the person would no longer be in a state of mortal sin. However, there’s two main stumbling blocks to this:

(1) As stated in the canon, part of the act of perfect contrition includes the resolution of confessing as soon as possible;

(2) It is easy to delude oneself into believing that one has made an act of perfect contrition, when, in fact, due to our fallen nature, true acts of perfect contrition are nearly impossible, especially if a person has a habit of committing the same sin. In the case of the OP, it is extremely unlikely that the priest made an act of perfect contrition.

 

[Inquiringperson]

I know this has probably been addressed somewhere on this thread, but I can’t find it. As long as the proper liturgical language and rubrics are followed, is the mass said by a priest valid? For instance, when I was young, a priest would molest me and then say mass the next morning. Was that mass valid? He always made fun of the people like St. Thomas Aquinas and St. Augustine. He said that St. Thomas Aquinas was a bloated glutton who had OCD. He said that St. Augustine had fun all his life and then when he got tired of it, he turned around and tried to make it so nobody else could.

If a priest says mass, then in his sermon says that we should stop being petty and arguing about issues like abortion, gay marriage, sex before marriage. That arguing about issues like this just make us divisive, That getting stuck on issues like these is narrow-minded. The Catholic church has become narrow minded and we need to accept and love all people regardless of what side of these issues people are on. God’s heaven has many rooms and if God has room for people of all sides of issues, we should too. If he says that the bishops are wrong to consider abortion the important issue in elections, because social justice was more important, does that effect the validity of any of the sacraments he performs?

I guess what I want to know is can a priest say or do anything before, during the sermon, or after the mass that would invalidate the mass he says as long as all the prayers are said properly?

The first thing I want to say is, I am truly sorry that you had to suffer abuse by a priest with a twisted mind. I do hope that you’re not emotionally scarred right now. May God bless you and keep you in his loving embrace.

The second thing I want to bring up is the theological concept called “ex opere operato”. This means that sacraments are wrought by the power of God and NOT wrought by the holiness of the priest.

From the Catechism of The Catholic Church
CCC 1128:

This is the meaning of the Church’s affirmation that the sacraments act ex opere operato (literally: “by the very fact of the action’s being performed”), i.e., by virtue of the saving work of Christ, accomplished once for all. It follows that “the sacrament is not wrought by the righteousness of either the celebrant or the recipient, but by the power of God.” From the moment that a sacrament is celebrated in accordance with the intention of the Church, the power of Christ and his Spirit acts in and through it, independently of the personal holiness of the minister. Nevertheless, the fruits of the sacraments also depend on the disposition of the one who receives them. From this link: vatican.va/archive/ccc_css/archive/catechism/p2s1c1a2.htm

A simple definition of “ex opere operato” from To Save a Thousand Souls: A Guide for Discerning a Vocation to Diocesan Priesthood (By the way, this book holds the nihil obstat and the imprimatur, so it is church approved).
To Save a Thousand Souls:

Whether a particular priest is a great saint or a terrible sinner, the sacrament he validly celebrates still takes effect. This is known in theology as ex opere operato. It is a Latin expression meaning sacraments confer the grace they signify, regardless of the virtue of the priest (or recipient) of the sacrament

Does this answer your question?

 

[Neofight]

Why do so many people confuse VALID with ILLICIT?

 

[z_0101]

I know this has probably been addressed somewhere on this thread, but I can’t find it. As long as the proper liturgical language and rubrics are followed, is the mass said by a priest valid? … ?

This question was recently asked on the Catholic Radio…

Short answer, the Mass is Valid, the Priest needs to go to the Bishop and seek reconciliation.

From EWTN (note the highlight bellow is by my hand, not the original text):
(EWTN):: When a Priest Is in Mortal Sin

When a Priest Is in Mortal Sin

ROME, 8 FEB. 2005 (ZENIT)
Answered by Father Edward McNamara, professor of liturgy at the Regina Apostolorum Pontifical University.

Q: If a priest is in the state of mortal sin, is his Mass and/or consecration of the Eucharist viable? I understand someone would not know if a priest is in this state, but Our Lord would know. — A.A., Springfield, Massachusetts
<<…>>
The reason is: Christ is the principal actor of the sacraments, so they are efficacious even when performed by an unworthy minister. As St. Thomas Aquinas says: Christ may act even through a minister who is spiritually dead.
However, a priest who has fallen into mortal sin, but who is unable to make his confession despite his desire to do so, may celebrate Mass for the benefit of the faithful without adding a further sin of sacrilege.
<<…>>

You should visit the EWTN link above for the full context as there are some requirements.

As for this priest’s past actions… these are his sins, not yours, not the Church’s, and as a Shepard that has hurt one of God’s flock…
Forgive as in the Our Father, for if you cannot, then this injury will never heal. This doesn’t mean to forget, just forgive.

Matthew 18:6
"If anyone causes one of these little ones–those who believe in me–to stumble, it would be better for them to have a large millstone hung around their neck and to be drowned in the depths of the sea.

Jeremiah 23:1-6
1"Woe to the shepherds who are destroying and scattering the sheep of My pasture!" declares the LORD. 2Therefore thus says the LORD God of Israel concerning the shepherds who are tending My people: “You have scattered My flock and driven them away, and have not attended to them; behold, I am about to attend to you for the evil of your deeds,” declares the LORD.…

Our Lord knows the truth and will see into the soul. Have faith that justice and mercy will be done according to His will.

 

[Galnextdoor]

This question was recently asked on the Catholic Radio…

Short answer, the Mass is Valid, the Priest needs to go to the Bishop and seek reconciliation.

From EWTN (note the highlight bellow is by my hand, not the original text):
(EWTN):: When a Priest Is in Mortal Sin

You should visit the EWTN link above for the full context as there are some requirements.

As for this priest’s past actions… these are his sins, not yours, not the Church’s, and as a Shepard that has hurt one of God’s flock…
Forgive as in the Our Father, for if you cannot, then this injury will never heal. This doesn’t mean to forget, just forgive.

Matthew 18:6
"If anyone causes one of these little ones–those who believe in me–to stumble, it would be better for them to have a large millstone hung around their neck and to be drowned in the depths of the sea.

Jeremiah 23:1-6
1"Woe to the shepherds who are destroying and scattering the sheep of My pasture!" declares the LORD. 2Therefore thus says the LORD God of Israel concerning the shepherds who are tending My people: “You have scattered My flock and driven them away, and have not attended to them; behold, I am about to attend to you for the evil of your deeds,” declares the LORD.…

Our Lord knows the truth and will see into the soul. Have faith that justice and mercy will be done according to His will.

Thank you for your post. The quote by St. Thomas Aquinas about a priest being spiritually dead and still being able to say mass was helpful.

 

[Vico]

…

If he is saying that arguing is petty, then that could be true. Also we should accept and love all people regardless of what side of these issues people are on. However the Church teaches that it is love to teach the truth so we must maintain the objective sinfulness of certain behaviors, that you mentioned, such as abortion, gay marriage, and sex before marriage. It is necessary to oppose immoral laws.

 

[QNDNNDQDCE]

Sounds like the priest in question was projecting his own sinfulness more than anything.