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WalkWithMe123
Guest
Is she divorced? Do we know if she received an annulment? I’m not trying to pry, I just know that she is a very devout Catholic and I would be a bit disappointed if she didn’t.
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EasterJoy
Guest
Where did you hear she was getting a divorce? I don’t remember hearing anything like that.
Having said that, there are morally permissible reasons for two Catholics in a valid marriage to obtain a civil divorce. While we ourselves must not choose or counsel anyone else to choose divorce in the absence of a sufficiently serious reason, in the absence of evidence or their testimony to the contrary charity usually requires that we assume that Catholics who divorce do have a legitimate reason excusing them. It is only when they are trying to establish that they are free to attempt marriage again that they are bound to seek a decree of nullity for the first attempt at marriage. If she has obtained a civil divorce, it is fine to be disappointed–as I am sure the couple would be!–but you are not forced to believe she has committed any moral transgression.
Having said that, there are morally permissible reasons for two Catholics in a valid marriage to obtain a civil divorce. While we ourselves must not choose or counsel anyone else to choose divorce in the absence of a sufficiently serious reason, in the absence of evidence or their testimony to the contrary charity usually requires that we assume that Catholics who divorce do have a legitimate reason excusing them. It is only when they are trying to establish that they are free to attempt marriage again that they are bound to seek a decree of nullity for the first attempt at marriage. If she has obtained a civil divorce, it is fine to be disappointed–as I am sure the couple would be!–but you are not forced to believe she has committed any moral transgression.
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robwar
Guest
What is your source on that?
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WalkWithMe123
Guest
Sorry about not having the source, here is where i read it.
680news.com/2013/04/17/genocide-survivor-now-us-citizen-says-enemy-tribe-member-saved-her-taught-her-to-forgive/
Ilibagiza’s life now is not so different from other Americans. She’s divorced and bringing up her two children — a 14-year-old girl and an 11-year-old boy — on Manhattan’s East Side.
680news.com/2013/04/17/genocide-survivor-now-us-citizen-says-enemy-tribe-member-saved-her-taught-her-to-forgive/
Ilibagiza’s life now is not so different from other Americans. She’s divorced and bringing up her two children — a 14-year-old girl and an 11-year-old boy — on Manhattan’s East Side.
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robwar
Guest
Yes, I read the article and it is hard to know anything of what happen based on one sentence in a secular article. Without any more details on the marriage, who filed etc, the best one can summarize is that this is very sad and let’s keep her and the children in our prayers. Remember that with no fault divorce, someone can end up divorced that never wanted it and tried their best to save the marriage. That shouldn’t take away from her message and testimony she has which is pretty powerful about forgiveness in the middle for loosing your family. She reminds me of Corrie Ten Boom and what happen to her family during WWII.
The article’s one sentence which tried to frame it as she is just like everyone else, divorced really doesn’t do her any justice in what happen to her marriage.
The article’s one sentence which tried to frame it as she is just like everyone else, divorced really doesn’t do her any justice in what happen to her marriage.
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EasterJoy
Guest
There are also legitimate and morally-permissible reasons for Catholics to seek a civil divorce. I trust entirely that she will not seek to remarry unless her first attempt at marriage is declared null. In the meantime, let us wish the best for her, because she is in a hard situation, no matter how she got there.
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PMGermaine
Guest
I’ve just finished reading Immaculee’s incredible, life-changing book, Left to Tell**. I also read Our Lady of Kibeho.My life has been difficult with numerous health issues of long standing for my son and myself. I rely on prayer to cope and as long as I’m faithful, God and Our Blessed Mother have given me such peace and strength. Lately we had some setbacks and I couldn’t shake a great sadness and it became a time of such difficulty in praying. I prayed to God and asked Him if I were meant to seek something deeper in my faith and was I missing something? The next day I had an ad from my email re Immaculee’s first book. I couldn’t believe the 743 Five-star reviews and how it deepened people’s faith and changed their lives! I felt this was God’s answer and I am almost finished with this wonderful book! I have reached a level in my faith that has brought me great peace and really deepened my faith in God! Immaculee is a blessing! This book has given me far more strength than I could imagine, deepened my faith and am absolutely awed by God’s love for us!
I wish to add to the questions/comments on her being divorced and any disappointment. For about 4 years I put together annulment cases for the Catholic Church and helped many divorced couples obtain annulments. It was during a time of great sadness in my life with my son’s illness and a day didn’t pass where I didn’t cry going to and from work (my release). I had to try to be strong for my son! I want to say, based on my experience, that no one can make a comment of being disappointed regarding a divorce or feel it reflects negatively on the person. You cannot obtain a Catholic annulment without first having a civil divorce. The vast majority of annulment cases I worked on had very good reasons for obtaining a divorce/annulment and they were granted. The few that I received (very few) that did not have a valid reason…I explained to the party(ies) why there wasn’t a valid reason. I did so many cases in that period of time and it was amazing how each was different and rather than condemn an individual to a lifetime of living with a person where the marriage is irretrievably bronken is wrong and something that Jesus would be so compassionate about. I cannot give examples of any case I worked on, but each and every one went through judges (canonical lawyers who were also priests). I only felt sad that Immaculee had to experience this additional cross in her life after all she’d been through. Only God can truly see into someone’s heart and Immaculee needed to get a divorce before seeking an annulment. If she does not remarry she doesn’t need to get an annulment. If she does wish to remarry then she would seek an annulment. Think of the many lives she has touched for the better! I can truly say that her book (ordering every one she’s written but have read Our Lady of Kibeho already) came as an answer to a prayer and has helped me so much. I recommend Left to Tell for Everyone! Pray for her and do not judge. Think of the countless people she has helped!
I wish to add to the questions/comments on her being divorced and any disappointment. For about 4 years I put together annulment cases for the Catholic Church and helped many divorced couples obtain annulments. It was during a time of great sadness in my life with my son’s illness and a day didn’t pass where I didn’t cry going to and from work (my release). I had to try to be strong for my son! I want to say, based on my experience, that no one can make a comment of being disappointed regarding a divorce or feel it reflects negatively on the person. You cannot obtain a Catholic annulment without first having a civil divorce. The vast majority of annulment cases I worked on had very good reasons for obtaining a divorce/annulment and they were granted. The few that I received (very few) that did not have a valid reason…I explained to the party(ies) why there wasn’t a valid reason. I did so many cases in that period of time and it was amazing how each was different and rather than condemn an individual to a lifetime of living with a person where the marriage is irretrievably bronken is wrong and something that Jesus would be so compassionate about. I cannot give examples of any case I worked on, but each and every one went through judges (canonical lawyers who were also priests). I only felt sad that Immaculee had to experience this additional cross in her life after all she’d been through. Only God can truly see into someone’s heart and Immaculee needed to get a divorce before seeking an annulment. If she does not remarry she doesn’t need to get an annulment. If she does wish to remarry then she would seek an annulment. Think of the many lives she has touched for the better! I can truly say that her book (ordering every one she’s written but have read Our Lady of Kibeho already) came as an answer to a prayer and has helped me so much. I recommend Left to Tell for Everyone! Pray for her and do not judge. Think of the countless people she has helped!
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holyrood
Guest
Thank you for giving this view. Over the course of my marriage, I had three priests advise me they would petition for annulment if I filed for divorce–based on continuing lies, an episode of abandonment, other women, emotional/verbal abuse, threats of physical abuse, backstabbing, and more. He never showed that side of himself to me before we married.
Even then, I didn’t file until I found out he was also helping himself to money out of my bank account, which was the only safety net we had, and until I all but audibly heard God telling me NOW in very stark, clear terms. I discovered in the divorce proceedings that he’d lied horribly about debt, too. Divorce was necessary to legally separate our finances, separate me from that debt, and allow me to keep a roof over my children’s heads. I absolutely believe his house of cards would have crashed soon and we would have lost our home. It would have been virtually impossible to find a place to house our large family in that case.
I know that there are people who make all sorts of judgments about me. I hear from people that my own mother is telling people none of this stuff really happened, that I’m imagining things. My son’s friend was railing at his mother that I divorced poor Mr. ____ over nothing because I think he cheated and he really didn’t. My nephew shouted some ugly things at me last month (I posted about it here) that clearly showed me he feels the same, and I’m sure he’s getting his opinions from my family. My (former) MIL sent me a nice note assuring me she ‘holds no grudges against me.’
Someone I recently met made a rather caustic comment about ‘jagged morality,’ that I follow the Church’s teaching on contraception, yet filed for divorce.Fortunately, I’m entirely at peace with my decision. The more I had priests telling me, “This isn’t a marriage,” the more I looked at what marriage should be, and realized XH was NOT helping me get closer to God, but rather destroying me emotionally with all his tearing down.
Funny thing is, it’s only since I filed that he himself has started going back to Mass. Sadly, I think divorce was all that was going to reach him, and I’m well aware that he may still be playing games behind my back, yet I think I see him growing as a person as a result of this. I genuinely pray for him and hope that he finds happiness and peace.
Divorce is a really hard subject, because I fully believe in sacramental and lifelong marriage, and yet I also look at my mother and how bitter and resentful she is after 50 years in a semi-abusive marriage, and how badly it’s impacted all of us in the family, and I can’t believe that staying married was a good decision for her, or for my dad, who might also have had to face his abusive ways had she put her foot down.
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PMGermaine
Guest
Thank you for sharing your experience and I am glad that my words helped. I saw countless tragic incidents of couples living in a marriage which was damaging to the children…very damaging. As I said, I am not allowed to discuss any details of any of the cases I worked on, but I felt so sad to see what so many people had to suffer in marriages that were entered into without one of the parties really aware (as in your case) of some very destructive qualities in the other party.
Let us all remember the very well known incident of the “religious” hypocrites who tested Jesus about stoning the woman caught in adultery and His comment “Let he who is without sin cast the first stone.” I also think of Jesus saying “Judge not, lest ye be judged.” There are many examples in the Bible where we are told ONLY God can judge as only God can read a person’s heart. I think we all witness people who gossip about another’s life without knowing all the facts. I am so very sorry you do not have the support of some of your loved ones; I had a similar situation with my parents: my dad was wonderful and a loving man who tried his utmost to follow the teachings of Christ. After all, didn’t Jesus say the second greatest commandent after Loving God is to Love your neighbor as yourself? He didn’t make exceptions; he even talked about how easy it is to love our friends but those who have hurt us…no it’s not easy. Sadly a family member of mine was very condemning of others without knowing any facts. Just the thought that someone got a divorce was a terrible thing. But I believe the example of my dad and others taught me how important compassion and understanding are and that is what God wants all of us to do. It’s very healing to have someone reach out to you and try to help; of all the jobs I had had in my life, helping people seeking an annulment (because they were in a lot of pain in having to go back and rehash all the painful reasons why) was the most gratifying because their gratitude for some understanding meant a lot to me and made me feel I was doing some good.
God will give you the strength to overcome those who are hurting you now for your decision. I believe there groups for divorced Catholics and I think if you could find a good group like that, it would help you a lot. Sometimes non-family members can turn out to be of greatest comfort to us. See if you can find a group like that in your area and may Jesus and Mary bring you healing and the ability to forgive those who are hurting you. I have learned in my life when I didn’t think it possible to forgive someone, by asking God to help me and give me the strength to forgive, He always did help me and getting rid of the anger really unburdens you! Sorrow can linger but finding a group or a friend and knowing that God is your best friend does work!
Let us all remember the very well known incident of the “religious” hypocrites who tested Jesus about stoning the woman caught in adultery and His comment “Let he who is without sin cast the first stone.” I also think of Jesus saying “Judge not, lest ye be judged.” There are many examples in the Bible where we are told ONLY God can judge as only God can read a person’s heart. I think we all witness people who gossip about another’s life without knowing all the facts. I am so very sorry you do not have the support of some of your loved ones; I had a similar situation with my parents: my dad was wonderful and a loving man who tried his utmost to follow the teachings of Christ. After all, didn’t Jesus say the second greatest commandent after Loving God is to Love your neighbor as yourself? He didn’t make exceptions; he even talked about how easy it is to love our friends but those who have hurt us…no it’s not easy. Sadly a family member of mine was very condemning of others without knowing any facts. Just the thought that someone got a divorce was a terrible thing. But I believe the example of my dad and others taught me how important compassion and understanding are and that is what God wants all of us to do. It’s very healing to have someone reach out to you and try to help; of all the jobs I had had in my life, helping people seeking an annulment (because they were in a lot of pain in having to go back and rehash all the painful reasons why) was the most gratifying because their gratitude for some understanding meant a lot to me and made me feel I was doing some good.
God will give you the strength to overcome those who are hurting you now for your decision. I believe there groups for divorced Catholics and I think if you could find a good group like that, it would help you a lot. Sometimes non-family members can turn out to be of greatest comfort to us. See if you can find a group like that in your area and may Jesus and Mary bring you healing and the ability to forgive those who are hurting you. I have learned in my life when I didn’t think it possible to forgive someone, by asking God to help me and give me the strength to forgive, He always did help me and getting rid of the anger really unburdens you! Sorrow can linger but finding a group or a friend and knowing that God is your best friend does work!
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Dorothyoz
Guest
I went to a full day retreat this weekend led by Immaculee. It was awesome.
I wanted to address the issue of divorce as I am living a nightmare that I never thought could happen to us.
We were happily married for 32 years when my husband told me he needed space and a year later told me he no longer wanted to be married to me. Our priest talked to him without any success and we are legally separated. I filed to protect myself financially. We have not lived together for 4 years.
I am standing for my covenant marriage and have been blessed by finding two sites in particular of people who believe in the covenant of marriage. The world tells me I am wrong, that I should date and that God wants someone else for me. God tells me to wait and trust in His almighty power.
I am positive that my husband is having a mid life crisis. This is a perfect storm of childhood issues, biochemical and hormonal issues, stress and a spiritual battle.
“Be alert and of sober mind. Your enemy the devil prowls around like a roaring lion looking for someone to devour.” 1 Peter 5:8.
If anyone else is facing this incredibly painful and destructive thing in their family and would like to discuss with me, I am new to this forum and not sure how it works, but I would be glad to listen and perhaps share some of what I have learned over the last 4 years.
God bless you and your families.
I wanted to address the issue of divorce as I am living a nightmare that I never thought could happen to us.
We were happily married for 32 years when my husband told me he needed space and a year later told me he no longer wanted to be married to me. Our priest talked to him without any success and we are legally separated. I filed to protect myself financially. We have not lived together for 4 years.
I am standing for my covenant marriage and have been blessed by finding two sites in particular of people who believe in the covenant of marriage. The world tells me I am wrong, that I should date and that God wants someone else for me. God tells me to wait and trust in His almighty power.
I am positive that my husband is having a mid life crisis. This is a perfect storm of childhood issues, biochemical and hormonal issues, stress and a spiritual battle.
“Be alert and of sober mind. Your enemy the devil prowls around like a roaring lion looking for someone to devour.” 1 Peter 5:8.
If anyone else is facing this incredibly painful and destructive thing in their family and would like to discuss with me, I am new to this forum and not sure how it works, but I would be glad to listen and perhaps share some of what I have learned over the last 4 years.
God bless you and your families.
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