Is suicide black and white?

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levi86

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Without getting into whether suicide is wrong or not I have a question.

Suicide is when someone knowingly and intentionally takes their own life. We can all agree that many forms of suicide aren’t instantaneous, while others are. This means that suicide is relative in that respect. Suicide is also an attempt to shorten ones life, it doesn’t matter how much life one would lose, if a 120 year old committed suicide they may only lose a few years but It’s still suicide.

Now consider a smoker who smokes very heavily, he knows that there is a VERY high probability that he will contract a fatal condition as a result, at the very least it will decrease his life span dramatically. My question is, if someone partakes in an activity that they know will dramatically reduce their lives is it not a form of suicide?

I hope nobody gets too worked up over this, its just a thought I had 🙂

God bless
Levi
 
No it’s not the same at all. A soul who is suicidal is in a lot of pain either emotional, physical or spiritual. This person wants an end to the pain but does not want to die. You see dying is not the wanted end result, ending the pain is the wanted end result. Smoking is not the same at all.
 
But what if someone smokes or partakes in dangerous activities because they don’t really wish to live that long? I know a person who drinks like a fish and smokes like a chimney because he says, and I quote, “I don’t want to live past 40”.

Is that more of what you were asking initially Levi?
 
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levi86:
Without getting into whether suicide is wrong or not I have a question.

Suicide is when someone knowingly and intentionally takes their own life. We can all agree that many forms of suicide aren’t instantaneous, while others are. This means that suicide is relative in that respect. Suicide is also an attempt to shorten ones life, it doesn’t matter how much life one would lose, if a 120 year old committed suicide they may only lose a few years but It’s still suicide.

Now consider a smoker who smokes very heavily, he knows that there is a VERY high probability that he will contract a fatal condition as a result, at the very least it will decrease his life span dramatically. My question is, if someone partakes in an activity that they know will dramatically reduce their lives is it not a form of suicide?

I hope nobody gets too worked up over this, its just a thought I had 🙂

God bless
Levi
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Suicide is always an act of selfishness, you take the gift that God gave to them. As for smoking it does refer to not smoking and using herbs to releive stress or are addictive.
 
I dont know about the whole smoking and drinking so i dont live til im old thing, but i do smoke. (So do some of the seminarians I know) I dont want to contract lung cancer but i understand that there is a chance of it. I wouldnt consider myself suicidal.
 
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BryPGuy89:
Suicide is always an act of selfishness, you take the gift that God gave to them. As for smoking it does refer to not smoking and using herbs to releive stress or are addictive.
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No…suicide is not an act of selfishness…it’s an act of despair and hoplessness that is magnified by the assistance of the evil one…satan. A person in this state of despair is vulnerable and is not in their normal frame of mind.
 
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joyfulmess:
No…suicide is not an act of selfishness…it’s an act of despair and hoplessness that is magnified by the assistance of the evil one…satan. A person in this state of despair is vulnerable and is not in their normal frame of mind.
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The evil one creates a selfish desire in you, to take something that is not truely your own and destroy it, is selfish. Despair and hoplessness open the door to this selfish view not lead to it.
 
This feeling of despair and hoplessness is a temporary state and can be overcome, its the critical point during when someone decides to take action. They don’t want to die they just want the pain they are feeling to stop. It has nothing to do with selfishness, only survival.
 
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joyfulmess:
This feeling of despair and hoplessness is a temporary state and can be overcome, its the critical point during when someone decides to take action. They don’t want to die they just want the pain they are feeling to stop. It has nothing to do with selfishness, only survival.
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Ok, let me change my wording I guess, the act of suicide is the selfish action, the despair and hopelessness can lead to this selfish action. I can’t speak of what the pain and so on is like because I have never been in despair or hopelessness position. I have come to view the taking of the life of oneself is selfish and taking the life of another is stealing. The life belongs to only one and that one will choice when it has come to it’s end.
 
What about the suicide victim, and I do mean victim, who has committed suicide because of a chemical imbalance or blood clot in the brain?? It wasn’t selfish, it was illness, and many suicides are caused by mental illnesses. The person honestly doesn’t know what they are doing, or if they do, they see it as the only way to stop things. Depression, another leading cause of suicide, may seem temporary to those that don’t suffer from it, but it’s very debilitating, and very life controlling. And contrary to what TV drug ads may say, it’s not always curable. Often, for people who suffer from depression, to them the only answer is death. Very sad, but very true. But not selfish…just a poor soul that’s been cheated out of a life that could be good.

Did you know, that according to psychologists and other experts, that all people think about suicide at some point? It may be a fleeting thought, “what would they do without me?”, a sorrowful thought,“Why not me?”, “I wish I were dead”, “I can’t go on.”…etc. Most people won’t act on it, and many won’t even give it a second thought…like it was stupid, and at the moment, but it does happen. Kind of scary though, but it does make one less judgemental. When I was youth director, I took lots of suicide and grief counseling classes. The mind is an interesting place to visit, especially at 2AM, and a crying teen is on the phone supposedly with a gun. Suicide isn’t selfish at that point…it’s part of life, and despair, and very, very frightening. Let’s not judge others too quickly!

Blessings.
 
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aria13:
What about the suicide victim, and I do mean victim, who has committed suicide because of a chemical imbalance or blood clot in the brain?? It wasn’t selfish, it was illness, and many suicides are caused by mental illnesses. The person honestly doesn’t know what they are doing, or if they do, they see it as the only way to stop things. Depression, another leading cause of suicide, may seem temporary to those that don’t suffer from it, but it’s very debilitating, and very life controlling. And contrary to what TV drug ads may say, it’s not always curable. Often, for people who suffer from depression, to them the only answer is death. Very sad, but very true. But not selfish…just a poor soul that’s been cheated out of a life that could be good.

Did you know, that according to psychologists and other experts, that all people think about suicide at some point? It may be a fleeting thought, “what would they do without me?”, a sorrowful thought,“Why not me?”, “I wish I were dead”, “I can’t go on.”…etc. Most people won’t act on it, and many won’t even give it a second thought…like it was stupid, and at the moment, but it does happen. Kind of scary though, but it does make one less judgemental. When I was youth director, I took lots of suicide and grief counseling classes. The mind is an interesting place to visit, especially at 2AM, and a crying teen is on the phone supposedly with a gun. Suicide isn’t selfish at that point…it’s part of life, and despair, and very, very frightening. Let’s not judge others too quickly!

Blessings.
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I would have to say that majority of suicide victums are not clinicly problemed. The average person with no mental or social problems are more likely to commit suicide. In Japan average students who just crumble under pressure and here in America do it to escape.
 
These days just about anything you do can shorten your own life. Eating too much fatty food, too much sugar, too much caffine, crossing the street on a red light, driving too fast, and maybe even watching too much tv.

I personnally do not think these activities are suicidal. They are a bit irresponsible, and taken to any extremes they may also be sinful.

The Church used to teach that all suicides were mortal sins, and anyone who commmitted suicide was not allowed a Catholic burial.

It has long since backed off from that and rightly so. Since depression has been diagnosed as a real illness and uncontrollable in many circumstances, the Church has now recognized that many suicide victims can not control their actions.

Even very stable level minded folks are not immune to suicide. I personnally have never comtemplated suicide and I hope I never will. Yet I too was at one time almost a victim of suicide.

It was literally a split second decision, I was barely aware of what I was doing, and quite delusional. I had not gotten a decent nights sleep for a few days, I was NOT on drugs or any medication.

Everyone who knew me was totally surprised including myself, I would have never thought I was capable of such an attempt but it happened anyway. My guardian angel saved me from myself.

I did not consider myself depressed, I was under some heavy pressure from work but I thought I had it under control. I can only explain it as a combination of sleep deprivation, and a morbid curiousity and fear about dying. I was a lapsed Catholic at the time, so I am really glad I survived to change my life around, and return to the Church.

That was more than 20 years ago, and nothing even close has ever happened again. I am very careful about getting enough rest and how my thinking is.

So NO I do not think suicide is a black and white type thing. There may be many reasons for it. Some have control of their thoughts and actions and others may not.
 
wcKnight…I agree with you completely. Suicide has many faces. It cannot be stereotyped. It is the least understood emotion of all human suffering because of its many many intricate facets and because of the taboo that is attached to it. For many years the Catholic religion taught us that this is a mortal sin. The fifth commandment says “Thou shalt not kill”. Things have changed now because the Catholic church teaches us that our salvation is not based on the final act preceeding our death. Salvation is based on our faith and the works we accomplished throughout our life. God in His Infinite Mercy, looks into our heart and soul and we are judged on our good works among other things. There are many things in this world we cannot understand but by our faith and accomplishments we are saved. Blessings :blessyou:
 
Hello Levi,

You have asked the same question that, as a smoker, I have asked myself time after time without any answer forthcoming. Is it the committing of slow suicide? It certainly damages the body and the smoker is aware of that and yet smokes anyway. As far as it being suicide there are two things that I think about it. First thing is “intent”, the second is much more difficult, if not impossible to answer and that is: even in the last split second before death if we ask for forgiveness does Jesus forgive us. Is it ever too late to realize that you are wrong about something.
What I finally figured out, in regard to addiction in general, but smoking in my case, is this; there is no logic that can be applied to addicition. Quitting is nothing but shear will and is black and white in that you either are quitting or you are not, no inbetween.
Annemarie
 
BryPGuy89 said:
Ok, let me change my wording I guess, the act of suicide is the selfish action, the despair and hopelessness can lead to this selfish action. I can’t speak of what the pain and so on is like because I have never been in despair or hopelessness position. I have come to view the taking of the life of oneself is selfish and taking the life of another is stealing. The life belongs to only one and that one will choice when it has come to it’s end.
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I think the fact that you said yourself that you can not speak of what the pain ans so on is like because you have never been in despair or hopelessness position is the very reason you can not see suicide as anything but selfish. If you have ever experienced that pain or hopelessness, you would not be so quick to use the words “selfish” and “stealing”. You would also realize suicide is NOT black and white. I pray you never feel that desperation that can lead some to take their own lives.
 
I don’t think that we can judge those who have committed suicide and who (very terribly unfortunately) might in the future. The act is very wrong, and often is seen to be very selfish because of the hurt that loved ones are filled with - but there are sometimes severe, emotional feelings that might be linked with a chemical imbalance. People with chemical imbalances are capable to committing a mortal sin by suicide, but many with chemical imbalances might be severly depressed. Earthly pain is temporary. Suicide is not good, period. But, we are not God. We do not know who goes to Heaven and who goes elsewhere. Peace.
 
77Nick777 said:
I don’t think that we can judge those who have committed suicide and who (very terribly unfortunately) might in the future. The act is very wrong, and often is seen to be very selfish because of the hurt that loved ones are filled with - but there are sometimes severe, emotional feelings that might be linked with a chemical imbalance. People with chemical imbalances are capable to committing a mortal sin by suicide, but many with chemical imbalances might be severly depressed. Earthly pain is temporary. Suicide is not good, period. But, we are not God. We do not know who goes to Heaven and who goes elsewhere. Peace.
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God bless :signofcross:

David
 
From the Catechism:
Suicide
2280 Everyone is responsible for his life before God who has given it to him. It is God who remains the sovereign Master of life. We are obliged to accept life gratefully and preserve it for his honor and the salvation of our souls. We are stewards, not owners, of the life God has entrusted to us. It is not ours to dispose of.
2281 Suicide contradicts the natural inclination of the human being to preserve and perpetuate his life. It is gravely contrary to the just love of self. It likewise offends love of neighbor because it unjustly breaks the ties of solidarity with family, nation, and other human societies to which we continue to have obligations. Suicide is contrary to love for the living God.
2282 If suicide is committed with the intention of setting an example, especially to the young, it also takes on the gravity of scandal. Voluntary co-operation in suicide is contrary to the moral law.
Grave psychological disturbances, anguish, or grave fear of hardship, suffering, or torture can diminish the responsibility of the one committing suicide.
2283 We should not despair of the eternal salvation of persons who have taken their own lives. By ways known to him alone, God can provide the opportunity for salutary repentance. The Church prays for persons who have taken their own lives.
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