Is the "Nordic model" of Social Democracy Compatible with Church teachings?

[Ditat_Deus]

My questions are based on the following:

European social democracy particularly the “Nordic model” is hailed as an ideal form of government and countries like Finland, Norway, and Iceland are considered the happiest people in the world. (Although one fault with them is that they are the most promiscuous in the world and are largely protestant.)

Social Democracy is not to be confused with Democratic Socialism which is socialism achieved by democratic means.

From my limited understanding it is a socialist government with a capitalist economy.

The values that it holds seem to be good based on these videos that I found on YouTube.

youtube.com/watch?v=OvJ8YDma7Wk

youtube.com/watch?v=s_9Kix4tFzk

youtube.com/watch?v=Jv3hMfTTCfY

I have searched the forums to see if there were any questions similar to mine however I don’t think none answered my question sufficiently.

My question is; Does the church oppose this type of government since it doesn’t seem Communistic or Marxist and is it the type of Socialism that popes like Pius IX and Leo XIII condemned?

My other question is this: What are the positive aspects of this type of Government and more importantly what are the negative aspects that are incompatible with the Church’s teaching?

Can you also suggest any books/documents that I can read to help my understanding of this issue since I am really interested in this governing style and I wish to develop my own philosophy based on its positive traits that is fully coherent to the Church’s social teaching.

Thanks in advance,

Samuel

 

[Theo520]

My questions are based on the following:

European social democracy particularly the “Nordic model” is hailed as an ideal form of government and countries like Finland, Norway, and Iceland are considered the happiest people in the world. (Although one fault with them is that they are the most promiscuous in the world and are largely protestant.)
Samuel

I believe much of their happiness is correlated with the homogeneity in their culture. The high uniformity among their population minimizes many conflicts seen in other countries.

 

[Kenny_Kamel]

Happiness is subjective first and foremost. I would also like to point out that these countries also tend to have higher-than-normal rates for depression and suicide. There may be merits to countries such as Finland having a world renowned educational system and social safety net but they also have extremely high taxation. Also professional upward mobility is rough no matter how much education you may have. The government will provide any Finnish citizen with the means to live and unlimited educational opportunities, while this may sound great it engenders complacency which is not healthy.

Below is a quote of mine from another thread describing a friend’s situation in Finland.

One of my best friends is from Finland and she has struggled with lack of employment opportunities beyond entry level positions. She has the equivalent of two American Masters Degrees and is working on a Law Degree. She has moved from her hometown of Pyhajoki to Tampere to get a job that didn’t work out and she went back to school. She then moved from Tampere to Rovaniemi to get a job that didn’t work out and she went back to school. Last year she moved to Helsinki and we’ll see how things go. This is her life over the past 9 years.

 

[anon67074017]

It does not appear to be compatible since Nordic model governments promote same-sex marriage and abortion. Nations that use the Nordic model also tend to be quite secular humanist.

 

[Hatikvah]

Yay, go welfare states! (Then turn to Venezuela…)

 

[PaulfromIowa]

Social Democracy is not to be confused with Democratic Socialism which is socialism achieved by democratic means.

From my limited understanding it is a socialist government with a capitalist economy.

A “socialist government with a capitalist economy” is a contradiction. What they are really talking about is a mixed socialist/capitalist economy, which is what we have in most countries today. The question is how much government and how much private enterprise. Socialists tend to want more government and less private ownership. Libertarians/capitalists tend to want limited government and more private enterprise.

The Church does not teach on governmental or economic models. Christians are focused primarily on the City of God, not the City of Man, as St. Augustine put it.

As you probably know, Christians should oppose abortion of innocent children, euthanasia, suicide, and other crimes against Life. Those politicians who advance such crimes as legitimate choices should be rejected.

 

[ShrodingersCat]

Happiness is subjective first and foremost. I would also like to point out that these countries also tend to have higher-than-normal rates for depression and suicide.

That may in part be because of the significant lack of light in the winter in the North (that’s just a guess though).

 

[Kenny_Kamel]

That may in part be because of the significant lack of light in the winter in the North (that’s just a guess though).

I agree that is a factor. I would submit to you that social complacency is the main reason based on what I know. In Finland, under the current social welfare system, you could literally live out your entire life being sustained by the government and go to university indefinitely. If you want to get a job you have to compete with every other overeducated person out there.

I have encouraged my aforementioned friend to come to America because their level of education alone would be a huge advantage in this country but they seem to have become to attached to everything their country offers for its citizens. They have asked me to move to Finland but to get a job as a foreigner you MUST have some highly specialized level of experience and education just to get a foot in the door. If you don’t speak Finnish, one of the two most difficult languages to learn for native English speakers, that also stacks the deck against you.

 

[Ditat_Deus]

Thank you all for your replies. However to rephrase my question, is the Nordic model’s philosophy compatible with catholic social teaching? I understand that abortion and homosexual “marriage” are laws which can be repealed. However the underlying philosophy on which the system runs, is it compatible with church teaching? I think every Pope from Pius IX to Benedict XVI condemned socialism(excluding John Paul I since he died in a month of assuming the office) , however democratic socialism seems different to the socialist governments of Cuba and Venezuela.

 

[anon67074017]

Thank you all for your replies. However to rephrase my question, is the Nordic model’s philosophy compatible with catholic social teaching? I understand that abortion and homosexual “marriage” are laws which can be repealed. However the underlying philosophy on which the system runs, is it compatible with church teaching? I think every Pope from Pius IX to Benedict XVI condemned socialism(excluding John Paul I since he died in a month of assuming the office) , however democratic socialism seems different to the socialist governments of Cuba and Venezuela.

The Nordic model is not compatible if it is based on socialism. Democratic socialism is basically Marxism instituted by the voters instead of a revolution. It is still secular materialist.