Is this the REAL way of interpreting

  • Thread starter Thread starter Paris_Blues
  • Start date Start date
Status
Not open for further replies.
P

Paris_Blues

Guest
See, when I used to read the NT back when I was attending a Protestant church, yes, of course we had our own interpretations (which I think is dangerous in a way!), why I even had my OWN!!! :banghead:

John 20:22-23 says something like, 22 And when he had said this, he breathed on them, and said to them, “Receive the Holy Spirit. 23 If you forgive the sins of any, they are forgiven; if you retain the sins of any, they are retained.” 24 ,

See, when I read this, I took it like, if we as individuals forgive eachother, then the are forgiven but if we retain them, etc. etc. But now that I’m catching on to Catholicism, the Scripture points to the PRIESTS!!! Priests to forgive sins! But what about we, to forgive eachother? Doesn’t the Scripture apply to that as well or just to the Priests to forgive? Or BOTH???

See what I mean when it comes to interpreting Scripture? Now I’m thinking that the Scripture was talking about the Church, not individuals…do I make sense here or am I confusing?:o
 
In that particular passage Jesus is conferring upon the Apostles and their successors the power to forgive (or not forgive) sins.

In other passages he also commands that we as individuals forgive others. But when we forgive, it is only forgiveness withh respect to the wrong that has been done to us. It does not objectively remove sin from the other person’s soul. The priest in the sacrament of Penance does objectively take away sin from our souls.
 
Hmmmm…well, what if a priests decides NOT to forgive a sin from someone just to be mean? And that person was extremely humble and sorry and Christ knew it, etc. but that priest decided not to forgive just to make that person miserable (not that they would but “what if”)? Would that sin be forgiven or not even though the person was 100% sorry and humble?
 
Paris Blues:
Hmmmm…well, what if a priests decides NOT to forgive a sin from someone just to be mean? And that person was extremely humble and sorry and Christ knew it, etc. but that priest decided not to forgive just to make that person miserable (not that they would but “what if”)? Would that sin be forgiven or not even though the person was 100% sorry and humble?
Click to expand...
Priests are not the highest rung in the Catholic Church. A person who is denied absolution has the right of appeal, first to the bishop of his diocese.

A priest who capriciously or maliciously denied absolution would be committing a mortal sin himself, and would not remain a priest long.
 
I have never known a priest to deny absolution arbitrarily or capriciously.

But as a matter of fact, if a priest should deny you absolution, there is nothing to prevent you from going to confession to another priest.

In fact, if a priest were mean to you or yelled at you, you could simply walk out of the confessional and seek out a different priest.
 
Jesus did not give individuals the option of retaining sins committed against us. In fact, he warned us that we are in for judgment if we do not forgive our brother from the heart. As individuals, we have no right to retain sins.

The John passage could only mean conferral of sacramental authority because we see Jesus breathing on them and give them the Holy Spirit in this context. God does not breathe on people lightly. In fact, the only other time God breathed on someone was to confer life on Adam. This shows that Jesus is also conferring a kind of life on his apostles that night, namely his own, and that of the Holy Spirit, by whose authority they can forgive and retain sins.

We can see later in the Acts of the Apostles the necessity of succeeding to the position vacated by an apostle, hence the succession of this power as well.
 
The priest is given the charism BY CHRIST of acting in persona OF Christ.

2 things are necesssary for us to admit to the priest when we confess our sins…

not only the fact that we are sorry…

but ALSO the fact that we intend to never, ever, EVER in a MILLION YEARS! to commit that sin again (that is what’s called “a firm purpose of amendment”).

If the priest determines that you don’t really mean BOTH of those things, then he cannot absolve you of your sin.

Hope that helps.
 
40.png
JimG:
I have never known a priest to deny absolution arbitrarily or capriciously.

But as a matter of fact, if a priest should deny you absolution, there is nothing to prevent you from going to confession to another priest.

In fact, if a priest were mean to you or yelled at you, you could simply walk out of the confessional and seek out a different priest.
Click to expand...
Jim, I have a 45 year old son who was denied absolution about 4 years ago. My son didn’t go back to confession. He wasn’t mad, but he was hurt. What are you going to do when the Catholic Priest denies absolution?
 
40.png
JimG:
In that particular passage Jesus is conferring upon the Apostles and their successors the power to forgive (or not forgive) sins.
Click to expand...
This is what I was always taught this verse means because Jesus was talking to his apostles. At this point he was giving them the power to forgive peoples sins as he did. This is the basis of our confession or reconcilliation.
 
Paris Blues:
See, when I used to read the NT back when I was attending a Protestant church, yes, of course we had our own interpretations (which I think is dangerous in a way!), why I even had my OWN!!! :banghead:
Click to expand...
How did the first century christians, taught directly by the Apostles interpret the scriptures. These were tought by Peter, John, Paul and the others. We can read them and find out the deposite of faith, handed on directly from the Apostles.
 
Paris Blues:
See, when I used to read the NT back when I was attending a Protestant church, yes, of course we had our own interpretations (which I think is dangerous in a way!), why I even had my OWN!!! :banghead:

John 20:22-23 says something like, 22 And when he had said this, he breathed on them, and said to them, “Receive the Holy Spirit. 23 If you forgive the sins of any, they are forgiven; if you retain the sins of any, they are retained.” 24 ,

See, when I read this, I took it like, if we as individuals forgive eachother, then the are forgiven but if we retain them, etc. etc. But now that I’m catching on to Catholicism, the Scripture points to the PRIESTS!!! Priests to forgive sins! But what about we, to forgive eachother? Doesn’t the Scripture apply to that as well or just to the Priests to forgive? Or BOTH???

See what I mean when it comes to interpreting Scripture? Now I’m thinking that the Scripture was talking about the Church, not individuals…do I make sense here or am I confusing?:o
Click to expand...
Well, I should’ve been more specific. I should’ve said something like, do Protestants know that that Scripture was actually pointing to the Priests to forgive sins (if that’s the case)? I mean, I know some Protestants would take that Scripture like, oh, well, we should forgive people then (and they might not know that it was the Priests who can do that). Do I make sense?
:o
 
Exporter said:
*******************************************************************************
Jim, I have a 45 year old son who was denied absolution about 4 years ago. My son didn’t go back to confession. He wasn’t mad, but he was hurt. What are you going to do when the Catholic Priest denies absolution?
Click to expand...

I cannot tell you why he was denied absolution – and in fact, for you or him to give out information that might allow us to discuss this would be a mortal siin – even the person confessing must respect the seal of the confessional.

But has he been to the Bishop?
 
40.png
JimG:
I have never known a priest to deny absolution arbitrarily or capriciously.

But as a matter of fact, if a priest should deny you absolution, there is nothing to prevent you from going to confession to another priest.

In fact, if a priest were mean to you or yelled at you, you could simply walk out of the confessional and seek out a different priest.
Click to expand...
I couldn’t personally see this happening either, but my mom said it did happen to her… the priest was in a really bad mood or something. She just went to another priest.
 
40.png
exoflare:
I couldn’t personally see this happening either, but my mom said it did happen to her… the priest was in a really bad mood or something. She just went to another priest.
Click to expand...
Speculating, a person who argues with his confessor on a de fide issue would expect to not receive absolution – because the failure to accept dogma is a sin, and he would be committing that sin right in the confessional.
 
vern humphrey:
Speculating, a person who argues with his confessor on a de fide issue would expect to not receive absolution – because the failure to accept dogma is a sin, and he would be committing that sin right in the confessional.
Click to expand...
Yeah, I know… in this case, it was just missing church once through no fault of her own (her parents were both unable to drive her) when she was a kid, and the priest still refused to “forgive” her. Go fig.
 
40.png
exoflare:
Yeah, I know… in this case, it was just missing church once through no fault of her own (her parents were both unable to drive her) when she was a kid, and the priest still refused to “forgive” her. Go fig.
Click to expand...
How can you possibly know that? The seal of the confessional is binding on both confessor and confessee. Neither one can tell you what happened in there.
 
Well, I should’ve been more specific. I should’ve said something like, do Protestants know that that Scripture was actually pointing to the Priests to forgive sins (if that’s the case)? I mean, I know some Protestants would take that Scripture like, oh, well, we should forgive people then (and they might not know that it was the Priests who can do that). Do I make sense?
Click to expand...
While in protestant Churches I was told it means to go and teach the forgiveness of Christ, in other words, go spread the gospel.

But I do know what you mean about how the closer God draws you to the Catholic church, things seem to become, Well, obvious. I remember reading those verses from John one day and just crying :crying: my eyes out. I thought, is it really that simple Lord? We really are meant to confess to a priest.

But I will also tell you this Paris. I know you have many doubts that seem to keep coming back. I have to tell you, I find that my Protestant roots are kind of like the smoking habit I kicked. I go along fine for awhile, and then out of nowhere, I start to doubt (or want to smoke) even though I know neither is good or right for me. But I just hang on the the truth that God revealed to me. For me, “the church is the pillar and foundation of truth”. as well as “…the church will withstand the gates of hell.” If the Catholic Church is no longer the foundation of truth, or the church has fallen, then Scripture is a lie. If Scripture is a lie, Christ is not my Savior. Either the church still is the pillar and foundation or it isn’t. Where do you go if the promises in the Bible are not true?

Once you make the jump, you will truly wonder why it took so long. Today, as a Catholic Christian, I can experience that same “first love” I had with Christ, when I had my born again experience in a protestant Church, EVERYTIME I go to Mass and receive communion. I renew my committment to Christ with every single Mass.

God Bless,
Maria
 
Status
Not open for further replies.
Back
Top