Is this true about Allah?

[R_not]

**chrisse, Jesus was crucified as much as he was only nailed on the cross. That is all. No more. He came down alive from the cross and that is what Quran tells. You people have purposely made up things. On the one hand you have Jesus as God. Then you say that Jesus died. It means your God dies too?

Then you have more than double role for Jesus to cover up all sides of weakness of your arguments. You ask any Muslim, any sect. They all believe that Jesus never died on the cross. Not a single Muslim will believe that Jesus was killed or died on the cross.
Remember that Crucifixion means death on the cross. Not just putting up, nailing on the cross.

The quran admits the claim (belief) of the Jews and the christians that Jesus was killed on the cross. But Quran says that is not true.**

And this is why the koran is worthless to us except as a book to tell us the battle tactics against us.

No matter how often you bring up your fairy tales doesn’t mean that they are true. It won’t be true tomorrow or next week and those fairy tales weren’t true today or yesterday.

Several people wrote not only of Jesus’s death, but one even wrote of His Resurrection who had no reason to do so. They were not believers of Christ’s Word.

I wrote this before but with you planten things have to be repeated and repeated.

Jesus’ crucifixion was written about by not only his prophets, but also includes Josephus (37-97AD) a Jewish historian who was ordered by Pontius Pilate to record the crucifixion of Jesus. He also mentions Jesus appearing to the apostles on the 3rd day.
Lucien, a Greek satirist (120-180AD) was a critic of the Christians and Christ; and Tacitus (55-117AD) who was a great historian of Rome both wrote about the Crucifixian of Jesus.

maybe one day a spark will light up in your head and you will realize that it was the illiterate pagan who didn’t know the Religion of the Jews and also the Religion of the Christian and it is he, mohammed, who got it all wrong.

 

[Pax_Vobiscum_57]

Arabic Christians call their God Allah.

Not in the same context. See quote below.

**chrisse, Jesus was crucified as much as he was only nailed on the cross. That is all. No more. He came down alive from the cross and that is what Quran tells. You people have purposely made up things. On the one hand you have Jesus as God. Then you say that Jesus died. It means your God dies too?

Then you have more than double role for Jesus to cover up all sides of weakness of your arguments. You ask any Muslim, any sect. They all believe that Jesus never died on the cross. Not a single Muslim will believe that Jesus was killed or died on the cross.
Remember that Crucifixion means death on the cross. Not just putting up, nailing on the cross.

The quran admits the claim (belief) of the Jews and the christians that Jesus was killed on the cross. But Quran says that is not true.**

And by what authority is the Quran correct over eyewitnesses to the event?

 

[chrisse]

Allah - The Greatest of All Deceivers
One of allah’s most beautiful names was The Greatest Deceiver. Of course, we believe that is Satan. Al Azhar has subsequently removed that from the list. However, allah is indeed a liar and is proud of it. After apparently sending the Christians his “word”, he then deceives the Christians (and apparently it’s our fault, both according to allah, muslims, and our very own Sister Amy).
Quote:
Sura 4 [157] That they said (in boast), “We killed Al-Masih 'Isa the son of Maryam, the Messenger of Allah”; but they killed him not, nor crucified him, but so it was made to appear to them, and those who differ therein are full of doubts, with no (certain) knowledge, but only conjecture to follow, for of a surety they killed him not.
Tafsirs explaining this verse :

ibn Abbas
Quote:
(And because of their saying: We slew the Messiah Jesus son of Mary, Allah’s messenger) Allah destroyed their man Tatianos. (They slew him not nor crucified, but it appeared so unto them) Allah made Tatianos look like Jesus and so they killed him instead of him; (and lo! those who disagree concerning it) concerning his killing (are in doubt thereof) in doubt about his killing; (they have no knowledge thereof save pursuit of a conjecture) not even conjecture; (they slew him not for certain) i.e. certainly they did not kill him,
al Jalalyn
Quote:
And for their saying, boastfully, ‘We slew the Messiah, Jesus son of Mary, the Messenger of God’, as they claim: in other words, for all of these [reasons] We have punished them. **God, exalted be He, says, in repudiating their claim to have killed him: And yet they did not slay him nor did they crucify him, but he, the one slain and crucified, who was an associate of theirs [the Jews], was given the resemblance, of Jesus. In other words, God cast his [Jesus’s] likeness to him and so they thought it was him [Jesus]. **And those who disagree concerning him, that is, concerning Jesus, are surely in doubt regarding, the slaying of, him, for some of them said, when they saw the slain man: the face is that of Jesus, but the body is not his, and so it is not he; and others said: no, it is he. They do not have any knowledge of, the slaying of, him, only the pursuit of conjecture (illā ittibā‘a l-zann, is a discontinuous exception) in other words: ‘instead, they follow conjecture regarding him, that which they imagined [they saw]’; and they did not slay him for certain (yaqīnan, a circumstantial qualifier emphasising the denial of the slaying).
Not only is allah a liar, he deliberately misleads people so they can be in error and according to allah must die on this earth and be doomed to hell.

allah is NOT YHWH

 

[pismopal]

Eucharisted, Good question from you.

Our God is Allah. He does not lie and would not die. What do you say about your god please?

I say I agree with you…our G-d is not allah. Your allah is the hand puppet of Arabic supremism. The Christian G-d is the G-d of love, forgiveness and salvation, not the god of wrath, turmoil, hatred and Arab supremism.

 

[planten]

I say I agree with you…our G-d is not allah. Your allah is the hand puppet of Arabic supremism. The Christian G-d is the G-d of love, forgiveness and salvation, not the god of wrath, turmoil, hatred and Arab supremism.

**pismopal, your God is the most angry God full of wrath, revenge and hatred. He did not love His own son Jesus and did the maximum damage to Jesus. Is that called a lovng God? Surely not. That case of Jesus was not Love at all.

Or would you say that Jesus (as a god) was punishing himself?? You have got nothing sensible in all these matters.

And to punish an innocent, sinless man (Jesus) for the sins of others? It could never be justified. What do you say please???
**

 

[geometer]

** And to punish an innocent, sinless man (Jesus) for the sins of others? It could never be justified. What do you say please???
**

This is way off topic. Allah would probably be The Greatest Deceiver if all of Islam are deceived. Otherwise according to the Koran he lied about that…

 

[R_not]

**pismopal, your God is the most angry God full of wrath, revenge and hatred. He did not love His own son Jesus and did the maximum damage to Jesus. Is that called a lovng God? Surely not. That case of Jesus was not Love at all.

Or would you say that Jesus (as a god) was punishing himself?? You have got nothing sensible in all these matters.

And to punish an innocent, sinless man (Jesus) for the sins of others? It could never be justified. What do you say please???
**

God asked Abraham to sacrifice his son. God called a halt to it because he asked of someone else to do the ultimate sacrifice. God did the ultimate sacrifice.

I would say that nothing in islam is about sacrifice, but it is indeed about slaughter - of anyone who disagrees with muslims/islam.

Are you not able to talk about your god, allah, without comparing the God of Israel to it? I do think that all by itself it certainly cannot stand on its own. It needs mohammed’s help quite often - the thread called ‘Muhammad committed shirk many times’ goes over how often mohammed had to help allah out!

 

[chrisse]

This is way off topic. Allah would probably be The Greatest Deceiver if all of Islam are deceived. Otherwise according to the Koran he lied about that…

Allah lied about being the greatest deceiver of all because he isn’t able to deceive everyone.

 

[R_not]

For the muslims who are unable to remember their own texts:shrug::

“and [they] deceived and Allah deceived and Allah is the best of deceivers” Sura 3:54

Qur’an 9:3 “Allah and His Messenger dissolve obligations.”

Qur’an 66:2 “Allah has already sanctioned for you the dissolution of your vows.”

Qur’an 5:41 “Whomever Allah wants to deceive you cannot help. Allah does not want them to know the truth because he intends to disgrace them and then torture them.”

Qur’an 40:32 “O my People! I fear a Day when there will be mutual wailing. No one shall defend you against Allah. Any whom Allah causes to err, there is no guide. That is how Allah leads the skeptic astray.”

It would make me wonder if with predestination in islam if allah will keep its promise if someone becomes a martyr for allah. Basically, if a person is already predestined to hell - he might be killing himself just to get to hell faster. Or doing good works, or anything in islam - who knows if allah will keep its word and just not let one bypass predestination and just let you go to hell anyway.

 

[geometer]

It would make me wonder if with predestination in islam if allah will keep its promise if someone becomes a martyr for allah. Basically, if a person is already predestined to hell - he might be killing himself just to get to hell faster. Or doing good works, or anything in islam - who knows if allah will keep its word and just not let one bypass predestination and just let you go to hell anyway.

Well, I guess it all just goes downhill from here…

 

[Pax_Vobiscum_57]

I would say that nothing in islam is about sacrifice, but it is indeed about slaughter - of anyone who disagrees with muslims/islam.

I think you’ve summed it up quite nicely. Muslims do not appreciate the Omnipotence or Metaphysical aspects of God. Their god is not much higher on the food chain than an imam.

 

[pismopal]

**pismopal, your God is the most angry God full of wrath, revenge and hatred. He did not love His own son Jesus and did the maximum damage to Jesus. Is that called a lovng God? Surely not. That case of Jesus was not Love at all.

Or would you say that Jesus (as a god) was punishing himself?? You have got nothing sensible in all these matters.

And to punish an innocent, sinless man (Jesus) for the sins of others? It could never be justified. What do you say please???
**

I don’t need to say anything…Jesus said it all. You don’t believe what He said so what good would it do for me to speak for Him. God the Father sacrificed His Son for us. Many of you muslims sacrifice your own children at the alter of hatred…it’s no wonder that the message of love will be missed by many muslims. I wish it were possible to softball the message but it seems not to be possible.

 

[R_not]

I don’t need to say anything…Jesus said it all. You don’t believe what He said so what good would it do for me to speak for Him. God the Father sacrificed His Son for us. Many of you muslims sacrifice your own children at the alter of hatred…it’s no wonder that the message of love will be missed by many muslims. I wish it were possible to softball the message but it seems not to be possible.

That is a very good point. And they are more than happy to sacrifice them so THEY can be one of the named to be saved. I find that so abominably selfish that I can’t even believe it sometimes. The martyr/shahid is told they can name up to 70 people to be saved. No one has said if all of this bypasses their predestination though.

(as reference for anyone who has not heard an ex-muslim PLO tell about all of this martyrdom stuff - the celebration, the promises, etc. If you have heard this - then ignore this, it is only for those who don’t know where I get my information:

Walid Shoebat Shoebat’s experiences with what he was taught in islam..
Select the program that says, Talking It Over, PART 1 December 13, 2008.)