Islamic Lawyers Urge Death Sentence For Convert

[jakasaki]

News articles such as this one just saddens me. Posting here for thoughts, comments and discussions. Thank you!

Lead story - Thursday February 26, 2009

EGYPT: ISLAMIC LAWYERS URGE DEATH SENTENCE FOR CONVERT

In case on whether he can legally change religion, Christian is accused of ‘apostasy.’

ISTANBUL, February 26 (Compass Direct News) –

In the latest hearing of a Muslim-born Egyptian’s effort to officially convert to Christianity, opposing lawyers advocated he be convicted of “apostasy,” or leaving Islam, and sentenced to death.

More than 20 Islamic lawyers attended the hearing on Sunday (Feb. 22) in Maher Ahmad El-Mo’otahssem Bellah El-Gohary’s case to obtain identification papers with Christianity designated as his religious affiliation. Two lawyers led the charge, Ahmed Dia El-Din and Abdel Al-Migid El-Anani.

“[El-Din] started to talk about the Quran being in a higher position than the Bible,” one of El-Gohary’s lawyers, Said Fayez, told Compass. “[El-Din said] **people can move to a higher religion but not down, so people cannot move away from Islam because it is highest in rank.” **

Memos submitted by opposing lawyers asserted that cases such as El-Gohary’s form part of a U.S. Zionist attack on Islam in Egypt, that Christianity is an inferior religion to Islam and that Copts protect and defend converts from Islam at their own peril.

“We received 150 pages from them that talked about religion,” said Fayez. “We are not in a position to talk about religion, we are only talking about the law.”

There is more to this article if you wish to continue reading it.

compassdirect.org/en/display.php?page=lead&lang=en&length=long&idelement=&backpage=&critere=&countryname=&rowcur=

 

[brigantine]

My only thought is I’m not surprised. This is what muslims do and I would have been surprised if his decision was respected and he was left to live his life. That would have shocked me!

 

[ralphinal]

Islam teaches that there is no compulsion in religion. So, that mean the threat of death to those who leave is not compelling.

I am confused

 

[Jay53]

Islam teaches that there is no compulsion in religion. So, that mean the threat of death to those who leave is not compelling.

I am confused

From the article:

Despite a constitution that grants religious freedom, legal conversion from Islam to another faith remains unprecedented. Hegazy, who filed his case on Aug. 2, 2007, was denied the right to officially convert in a Jan. 29, 2008 court ruling that declared it was **against Islamic law for a Muslim to leave Islam. **
The judge based his decision on Article II of the Egyptian constitution, which enshrines Islamic law, or sharia, as the source of Egyptian law. The judge said that, according to sharia, Islam is the final and most complete religion and therefore Muslims already practice full freedom of religion and cannot return to an older belief (Christianity or Judaism).

I agree. How in the world is this not compulsion in religion? I’m still waiting in the other thread for Sister Amy or any Muslims (besides planten ) to condemn the killing of apostates simply for leaving their religion. Sister Amy claimed that it is sometimes acceptable - I’m assuming she meant in cases of treason, but I have yet to see it acknowledged that any Muslim is free to change their religion and practice it openly.

May God protect this man and his family and give him the strength to endure this trial.

 

[Middleman]

Islam is a worrisome religion that seems to be at odds with Western values of religious tolerance and diversity.

 

[OneTrueCathApos]

Where is Muslim Woman now?

 

[jakasaki]

Where is Muslim Woman now?

I realy haven’t seen any of our muslim members around for a while even the 2 news ones which joined about a week ago.

One of them was muslima_### and the other was muslima_### but they both had different numbers.

 

[inJESUS]

there was a case in Egypt were the judge said to a woman convert to Christianity " if i could, i’d kill you myself".

 

[jakasaki]

there was a case in Egypt were the judge said to a woman convert to Christianity " if i could, i’d kill you myself".

Yes, I remember that… It only happened just a while ago…

 

[OneTrueCathApos]

there was a case in Egypt were the judge said to a woman convert to Christianity " if i could, i’d kill you myself".

I just find it funny how Muslims claim Islam is a peaceful religion. They really make fools out of themselves.

 

[chrisse]

Islam is a vile, disgusting cult of the worst kind. It cannot withstand truth, it cannot withstand exposure. It can only stand by lies, deceit, hypocrisy and the ever present threat, explicit or implicit, of violence ranging the full gamut from thuggery to slaughter.

That has been it’s history. Even the so-called “peaceful” times were not peaceful for it’s enslaved and dhimmi inhabitants, nor for its non-muslim neighbours. Razias were a constant threat for raids for slaves and slaughter. I believe it was Marco Polo who said :

Islam’s borders are bloody borders

Marco Polo, of course, is a racist and a bigot

 

[agangbern]

Islam teaches that there is no compulsion in religion. So, that mean the threat of death to those who leave is not compelling.

I am confused

Don’t be confused. This news simply further confirm the long standing truth that Muslims treat Christians as their mortal enemies, and that generally they are liars! Even their Quran is simply a product of an imagination that contradicts many facts of history. 5:21 of their Quaran is one example of that lie!

 

[chrisse]

Islam teaches that there is no compulsion in religion. So, that mean the threat of death to those who leave is not compelling.

I am confused

Then also join us here where we are discussing abrogation. I’m doing this in parts, the link is to the first one.

Can’t guarantee you won’t still be confused though.

 

[jakasaki]

Islam is a vile, disgusting cult of the worst kind. It cannot withstand truth, it cannot withstand exposure. It can only stand by lies, deceit, hypocrisy and the ever present threat, explicit or implicit, of violence ranging the full gamut from thuggery to slaughter.

That has been it’s history. Even the so-called “peaceful” times were not peaceful for it’s enslaved and dhimmi inhabitants, nor for its non-muslim neighbours. Razias were a constant threat for raids for slaves and slaughter. I believe it was Marco Polo who said :

Marco Polo, of course, is a racist and a bigot

Yes, not only was Marco Polo a racist and a bigot but so was Winston Churchill

How dreadful are the curses which Mohammedanism lays on its votaries! Besides the fanatical frenzy, which is as dangerous in a man as hydrophobia in a dog, there is this fearful fatalistic apathy.

The effects are apparent in many countries.

Improvident habits, slovenly systems of agriculture, sluggish methods of commerce, and insecurity of property exist wherever the followers of the Prophet rule or live.

A degraded sensualism deprives this life of its grace and refinement; the next of its dignity and sanctity.

The fact that in Mohammedan law every woman must belong to some man as his absolute property, either as a child, a wife, or a concubine, must delay the final extinction of slavery until the faith of Islam has ceased to be a great power among men.

Individual Moslems may show splendid qualities, but the influence of the religion paralyses the social development of those who follow it.

No stronger retrograde force exists in the world.

Far from being moribund, Mohammedanism is a militant and proselytizing faith. It has already spread throughout Central Africa, raising fearless warriors at every step; and were it not that Christianity is sheltered in the strong arms of science, the science against which it had vainly struggled, the civilization of modern Europe might fall, as fell the civilization of ancient Rome.

– Sir Winston Churchill (The River War, first edition, Vol. II, pages 248-50 [London: Longmans, Green & Co., 1899]).

 

[ralphinal]

For the record, I am not really confused. I am saying that for effect.

The Native Americans in movies had a saying “White man speak with forked tongue.” I wonder what they would say about Muslims.

 

[inJESUS]

Yes, I remember that… It only happened just a while ago…

correct.

 

[Sam_777]

Those lawyers are right, death is the punishment if someone leaves Islam, here are direct authentic hadiths about the death punishment for the apostasy:

Sahih Bukhari, Volume 9, Book 84, Number 57:
“Some Zanadiqa (atheists) were brought to 'Ali and he burnt them. The news of this event, reached Ibn 'Abbas who said, "If I had been in his place, I would not have burnt them, as Allah’s Apostle forbade it, saying, ‘Do not punish anybody with Allah’s punishment (fire).’ I would have killed them according to the statement of Allah’s Apostle, 'Whoever changed his Islamic religion, then kill him.’”
(E) (A)

Sahih Bukhari, Volume 9, Book 84, Number 58:
“…Behold: There was a fettered man beside Abu Muisa. Mu’adh asked, “Who is this (man)?” Abu Muisa said, “He was a Jew and became a Muslim and then reverted back to Judaism.” Then Abu Muisa requested Mu’adh to sit down but Mu’adh said, "I will not sit down till he has been killed. This is the judgment of Allah and His Apostle (for such cases) and repeated it thrice. Then Abu Musa ordered that the man be killed, and he was killed…”
(E) (A)

Sahih Muslim, Book 016, Number 4152:
“'Abdullah (b. Mas’ud) reported Allah’s Messenger (may peace be upon him) as saying: It is not permissible to take the life of a Muslim who bears testimony (to the fact that there is no god but Allah, and I am the Messenger of Allah, but in one of the three cases: the married adulterer, a life for life, and the deserter of his Din (Islam), abandoning the community.”
(E) (A)

However, the solace is no better than Lord Jesus words:
“Blessed are those who are persecuted because of righteousness, for theirs is the kingdom of heaven.” Matthew 5:10

 

[agangbern]

Those lawyers are right, death is the punishment if someone leaves Islam, here are direct authentic hadiths about the death punishment for the apostasy:

Sahih Bukhari, Volume 9, Book 84, Number 57:
“Some Zanadiqa (atheists) were brought to 'Ali and he burnt them. The news of this event, reached Ibn 'Abbas who said, "If I had been in his place, I would not have burnt them, as Allah’s Apostle forbade it, saying, ‘Do not punish anybody with Allah’s punishment (fire).’ I would have killed them according to the statement of Allah’s Apostle, 'Whoever changed his Islamic religion, then kill him.’”
(E) (A)

Sahih Bukhari, Volume 9, Book 84, Number 58:
"*…Behold: There was a fettered man beside Abu Muisa. Mu’adh asked, “Who is this (man)?” Abu Muisa said, “He was a Jew and became a Muslim and then reverted back to Judaism.” Then Abu Muisa requested Mu’adh to sit down but Mu’adh said, “I will not sit down till he has been killed. This is the judgment of Allah and His Apostle (for such cases) *and repeated it thrice. Then Abu Musa ordered that the man be killed, and he was killed…”
(E) (A)

Sahih Muslim, Book 016, Number 4152:
“'Abdullah (b. Mas’ud) reported Allah’s Messenger (may peace be upon him) as saying: It is not permissible to take the life of a Muslim who bears testimony (to the fact that there is no god but Allah, and I am the Messenger of Allah, but in one of the three cases: the married adulterer, a life for life, and the deserter of his Din (Islam), abandoning the community.”
(E) (A)
However, the solace is no better than Lord Jesus words:
“Blessed are those who are persecuted because of righteousness, for theirs is the kingdom of heaven.” Matthew 5:10

This religion is dangerous! For veryone has a right to self defense. No wonder war in Mindanao does not stop.