Jesus was an only son.. Mary did not have more children!!

  • Thread starter Thread starter Brooke
  • Start date Start date
Status
Not open for further replies.
B

Brooke

Guest
many say jesus had more brothers because on the cross, “When Jesus therefore saw his mother, and the disciple standing by, whom he loved, he saith unto his mother, Woman, behold thy son!” John wasnt marys son! ?? anyone care to elaborate on these beliefs…

would love to hear from anyone! =]
 
Jesus said to John the apostle, “Behold your mother.” then he said to Mary, “Behold your son.”

Theologians have interpreted this as Jesus Giving Mary to Humanity as its mother.

Also Later John took care of Mary until the Assumption. Mary was and remains a Virgin.

I Hope this Helps 🙂

HickmanJosh
 
That passage generally isn’t used to claim that Mary had other children. There are others, discussed in a few other threads in this forum.
 
That passage generally isn’t used to claim that Mary had other children. There are others, discussed in a few other threads in this forum.
hi
i was wondering, so do you believe this?? i would love to hear your point of view on things… =]
 
many say jesus had more brothers because on the cross, “When Jesus therefore saw his mother, and the disciple standing by, whom he loved, he saith unto his mother, Woman, behold thy son!” John wasnt marys son! ?? anyone care to elaborate on these beliefs…

would love to hear from anyone! =]
Somehow I doubt that Zebedee had two wives and that Mary was one of them, since elsewhere the gospels refer to “the mother of the sons of Zebedee,” and she obviously isn’t Mary. Catholics interpret this to mean that Jesus was giving Mary into the care of John in part because he (Jesus) had no other siblings who could take care of her. There is also evidence to suggest that John was Mary’s nephew, the son of her sister Salome.
 
Somehow I doubt that Zebedee had two wives and that Mary was one of them, since elsewhere the gospels refer to “the mother of the sons of Zebedee,” and she obviously isn’t Mary. Catholics interpret this to mean that Jesus was giving Mary into the care of John in part because he (Jesus) had no other siblings who could take care of her. There is also evidence to suggest that John was Mary’s nephew, the son of her sister Salome.
thankyou for ur (name removed by moderator)ut… and i understand what u mean. it seems so clear yet many dont believe this…😦
 
thankyou for ur (name removed by moderator)ut… and i understand what u mean. it seems so clear yet many dont believe this…😦
To be perfectly honest, I’ve never heard any non-Catholics claim this scene as proof that Mary had other children, since like I said it’s pretty obvious to everyone who knows anything about the Bible that Mary is definitely not Zebedee’s wife. Usually it’s us Catholics who point to this as proof that Mary didn’t have any children.
 
To be perfectly honest, I’ve never heard any non-Catholics claim this scene as proof that Mary had other children, since like I said it’s pretty obvious to everyone who knows anything about the Bible that Mary is definitely not Zebedee’s wife. Usually it’s us Catholics who point to this as proof that Mary didn’t have any children.
o well i actually have… that is why i provided this example… but i know of other passages that prove jesus had no actual brother or sister siblings…

which passages are the ones you know of? that others use to say mary had more children?
not the absurd one… that says she was a virgin until… ??
 
o well i actually have… that is why i provided this example… but i know of other passages that prove jesus had no actual brother or sister siblings…

which passages are the ones you know of? that others use to say mary had more children?
not the absurd one… that says she was a virgin until… ??
Well, I’ve heard that one before, but the passages I think are the most common are the ones that mention Jesus’ “brothers and sisters,” especially when the word “brothers” occurs in the same sentence as the word “mother.”
 
hi
i was wondering, so do you believe this?? i would love to hear your point of view on things… =]
I don’t have a point of view on this question; I’m not a Christian, so I don’t believe in Biblical inerrancy and I don’t have any reason to affirm Marian dogmas. The passages I was referring to I think have now been mentioned in this thread. For what it’s worth, I agree with the Catholic defense that the Scriptures do not point to literal brothers and sisters, and I think that the lack of authority claimed by James as the half-brother of the Lord is suggestive, but I don’t see any other evidence on this matter outside Tradition.
 
many say jesus had more brothers because on the cross, “When Jesus therefore saw his mother, and the disciple standing by, whom he loved, he saith unto his mother, Woman, behold thy son!” John wasnt marys son! ?? anyone care to elaborate on these beliefs…

would love to hear from anyone! =]
This is what I find in the Bible other than the cross.
Matthew 13:55 He’s just a carpenter’s son, and we know Mary, his mother, and his brothers—James, Joseph, Simon and Judas. v56- all his sisters live right here among us.
Mark says the same thing.
 
This is what I find in the Bible other than the cross.
Matthew 13:55 He’s just a carpenter’s son, and we know Mary, his mother, and his brothers—James, Joseph, Simon and Judas. v56- all his sisters live right here among us.
Mark says the same thing.
I’m not convinced, rev kevin, that this indicates they were all children of Mary. I had a pastor once who, at the beginning of our order of public confession would say: “Brothers and sisters in Christ, if we claim we have no sin…” Brothers and sisters can and certainly was in scripture, be used in ways not meaning blood siblings.

The scripture you quote names four men, and when one sees the phrase, “all his sisters”, one would assume to mean more than two. It just seems to me that if Jesus had at least seven blood siblings, and if you take brothers and sisters here as blood siblings you must claim he had at least 7 of them, we would have heard more about them in scripture.

Jon
 
I’m not convinced, rev kevin, that this indicates they were all children of Mary. I had a pastor once who, at the beginning of our order of public confession would say: “Brothers and sisters in Christ, if we claim we have no sin…” Brothers and sisters can and certainly was in scripture, be used in ways not meaning blood siblings.

The scripture you quote names four men, and when one sees the phrase, “all his sisters”, one would assume to mean more than two. It just seems to me that if Jesus had at least seven blood siblings, and if you take brothers and sisters here as blood siblings you must claim he had at least 7 of them, we would have heard more about them in scripture.

Jon
Well Brooke asked the question. I’m not trying to convince you or anyone just pointing out what I found. After Jesus was in the temple at the age of 12 we heard nothing about Joseph, you would think we would have heard how he died or more about him also.
Matthew 12:46 See here Jesus was not denying his responsibility to his earthly family. He critized the religious leaders for not following the OT command to honor you parents. His mother and brothers were present in the upper room at Pentecost. Acts 1:14.
Why wouldn’t he have sibblings? History proves that it was common to have large families back then, so why would Mary and Joseph be any different. Doesn’t the bible say to be fruitful and multiply or does that not apply to Mary and Joseph.
 
rev kevin:
History proves that it was common to have large families back then
Was it common back then to give birth to and raise God? I am just curious how common this family was.

If it wasn’t common:
rev kevin:
why would Mary and Joseph be any different
God bless
 
What a coincidence (or is it) that I heard a protestant preacher preaching on this very verse on the radio this morning. It pained me when he said “Now why did Jesus give his Mother to the disciple John, whenever Jesus had many brothers and sisters of his own to take care of her? The answer is because his own brothers and sisters were not Christians yet, so Jesus had to give Mary to someone he trusted, and that was his disciple, John.” What a disgustingly abhorrent thing to say… I wish I were in that studio to set him straight (Lord, give me a right attitude…)

First, Scripture doesn’t say that Jesus’ “brothers” or “brethren” were born of Mary. In fact, if you’re going to only look at Scripture and not the rest of the revelation given to the Apostles (“Tradition”), then you must first acknowledge that Scripture never mentions Mary giving birth again after Jesus, and never mentions Mary’s other sons. It only talks about Jesus’ brethren. So the real question is who are Jesus’ brethren, and one answer is that they could be his cousins.

In ancient Hebrew, there was no such thing as “cousin.” To a Jew of Jesus’ time, one’s cousin was one’s “brother.” conceptually. This is also true linguistically, as Aramaic and all of the other Semitic languages of the time had no word for “cousin.” Because “cousin” did not exist, the word for “cousin” did not exist.

Some examples from Scripture: Lot is called Abraham’s “brother” (Gen. 14:14), even though, being the son of Haran, Abraham’s brother (Gen. 11:26–28), he was actually Abraham’s nephew. Similarly, Jacob is called the “brother” of his uncle Laban (Gen. 29:15). Kish and Eleazar were the sons of Mahli. Kish had sons of his own, but Eleazar had no sons, only daughters, who married their “brethren,” the sons of Kish. These “brethren” were really their cousins (1 Chr. 23:21–22).
 
Well Brooke asked the question. I’m not trying to convince you or anyone just pointing out what I found. After Jesus was in the temple at the age of 12 we heard nothing about Joseph, you would think we would have heard how he died or more about him also.
Matthew 12:46 See here Jesus was not denying his responsibility to his earthly family. He critized the religious leaders for not following the OT command to honor you parents. His mother and brothers were present in the upper room at Pentecost. Acts 1:14.
Why wouldn’t he have sibblings? History proves that it was common to have large families back then, so why would Mary and Joseph be any different. Doesn’t the bible say to be fruitful and multiply or does that not apply to Mary and Joseph.
Funny you should mention Jesus at the temple.

When Jesus was found in the Temple at age twelve, the context suggests that he was the only son of Mary and Joseph. There is no hint in this episode of any other children in the family (Luke 2:41–51). Jesus grew up in Nazareth, and the people of Nazareth referred to him as “the son of Mary” (Mark 6:3), not as a son of Mary. Others in the Gospels are never referred to as Mary’s sons, not even when they are called Jesus’ “brethren.” As the OP mentions, t the foot of the cross, when Jesus was dying, he entrusted his mother to the apostle John (John 19:26–27). The Gospels mention four of his “brethren”: James, Joseph, Simon, and Jude. It is hard to imagine why Jesus would have disregarded family ties and made this provision for his mother if these four were also her sons. If they were her sons, they would have an obligation to her.

Why is Mary’s family any different than a normal Jewish family of the time? Wow, where to begin… Besides the fact that she gave birth to God, who came down from heaven? Maybe the fact that her family started just after an angel came to her and told her she would conceive by means of the Holy Spirit?

Speaking of… let me just say that it is the proposition that Mary took a lifelong vow of virginity that makes her question at the Annunciation make sense. When the angel Gabriel appeared to Mary and told her that she would conceive a son, she asked, “How can this be since I have no relations with a man?” (Luke 1:34). From the Church’s earliest days, Mary’s question was taken to mean that she had made a vow of lifelong virginity, even in marriage. (Do a search for “the protoevangelium of James”) If she had not taken such a vow, the question would make no sense.

Why is that? Well, Mary knew how babies are made (otherwise she wouldn’t have asked the question she did). If she had anticipated having children by having sex, she would hardly have to ask “how” she was to have a child, since conceiving a child in the “normal” way would be expected by a newlywed wife. Her question makes sense only if there was an apparent (but not a real) conflict between keeping a vow of virginity and agreeing to the angel’s request.
 
Well Brooke asked the question. I’m not trying to convince you or anyone just pointing out what I found. After Jesus was in the temple at the age of 12 we heard nothing about Joseph, you would think we would have heard how he died or more about him also.
Matthew 12:46 See here Jesus was not denying his responsibility to his earthly family. He critized the religious leaders for not following the OT command to honor you parents. His mother and brothers were present in the upper room at Pentecost. Acts 1:14.
Why wouldn’t he have sibblings? History proves that it was common to have large families back then, so why would Mary and Joseph be any different. Doesn’t the bible say to be fruitful and multiply or does that not apply to Mary and Joseph.
Hi rev kevin,
I wasn’t trying to butt into your conversation with Brooke, just adding what I thought to the conversation. I’m not condemning what you believe, as this, to me, is not an article of faith. I think, though, there is plenty of evidence, plus long standing belief within the Church, that Mary was ever-virgin. Scriptural use of the word brother or sister is not evidence of blood sibling. I’m probably wrong, but I know of no scriptural evidence, other than the general use of brother and sister, that the Mary had other children.

Jon
 
To the OP, if you are encountering someone who is challenging the perpetual virginity of Mary, I would direct them here:

newadvent.org/fathers/3007.htm

Jerome, a father of the Church in the 4th century, wrote this tract around the year 383, defending Mary’s perpetual virginity against a guy named Helvidius, who was trying to disprove it. You can see that this Helvidius guy was trying to read Scripture in light of his own interpretation, instead of in light of the “Faith once delivered to the Saints” (Jude 3) 300 years prior.

It’s a powerful read. Jerome calls the denial of Mary’s perpetual virginity blasphemous. A strong word, but in light of Mary being the Ark of the New Covenant, literally bearing God, I don’t think it’s too strong. But it bears good testimony that the Catholic Church was not “hiding” the Bible from folks prior to the Protestant Reformation like you hear in popular folklore. Jerome’s tract is a beautiful example of how the Church fathers dispelled the arguments about Mary’s virginity in the 4th century using scripture. There’s nothing new under the sun…
 
Funny you should mention Jesus at the temple.

When Jesus was found in the Temple at age twelve, the context suggests that he was the only son of Mary and Joseph. There is no hint in this episode of any other children in the family (Luke 2:41–51). Jesus grew up in Nazareth, and the people of Nazareth referred to him as “the son of Mary” (Mark 6:3), not as a son of Mary. Others in the Gospels are never referred to as Mary’s sons, not even when they are called Jesus’ “brethren.” As the OP mentions, t the foot of the cross, when Jesus was dying, he entrusted his mother to the apostle John (John 19:26–27). The Gospels mention four of his “brethren”: James, Joseph, Simon, and Jude. It is hard to imagine why Jesus would have disregarded family ties and made this provision for his mother if these four were also her sons. If they were her sons, they would have an obligation to her.

Why is Mary’s family any different than a normal Jewish family of the time? Wow, where to begin… Besides the fact that she gave birth to God, who came down from heaven? Maybe the fact that her family started just after an angel came to her and told her she would conceive by means of the Holy Spirit?

Speaking of… let me just say that it is the proposition that Mary took a lifelong vow of virginity that makes her question at the Annunciation make sense. When the angel Gabriel appeared to Mary and told her that she would conceive a son, she asked, “How can this be since I have no relations with a man?” (Luke 1:34). From the Church’s earliest days, Mary’s question was taken to mean that she had made a vow of lifelong virginity, even in marriage. (Do a search for “the protoevangelium of James”) If she had not taken such a vow, the question would make no sense.

Why is that? Well, Mary knew how babies are made (otherwise she wouldn’t have asked the question she did). If she had anticipated having children by having sex, she would hardly have to ask “how” she was to have a child, since conceiving a child in the “normal” way would be expected by a newlywed wife. Her question makes sense only if there was an apparent (but not a real) conflict between keeping a vow of virginity and agreeing to the angel’s request.
1 Corinthians 7:3 The husband should not deprive his wife of sexual intimancy which is her right as a married woman nor should the wife deprive her husband. The wife gives authority over her body to her husband and the husband also gives authority over his body to his wife. So do not deprive each other of sexual relations. The only exception to this rule would be the agreement of both husband and wife to refrain from sexual intimacy for a limiten time so they can give thenselves more completely to prayer. Afterwaed they should come together again so that Satan won’t be able to tempt them becaues of their lack of self-control.
Mary and Joseph were human right. With human emotions right. With human feelings right. With human love right. Now Jesus came here in human form right. He had human emotions right. He felt the things humans feel right. Mary was born a human in the same way all of us were born nothing special about that. Jesus was born just like we all were right. The only differance is there was not sex involved in his conception. Mary was the vesal for Jesus to be born. After that she was still human with the same thing humans enjoy and have so why is having sex any different. Sex came from God didn’t it so there is nothing wrong for a married man and woman to have sex, its normal and approved by God. If he disapproved of it he would never created it to begin with right.
You probably will disagree but I don’t care thats my view. I may disagree with your view but at least I respect and accept your veiws.
 
Status
Not open for further replies.
Back
Top