Just to make sure... was this appropriate thing to do with a priest

[chasingcars]

Today I went to Mass in a convent which is far away from everything. I went there by bus. I was the only lay person who attended and after the Mass when I was leaving the priest told me that he could take me to the railway station which sounded like a good idea for me because like I said, the convent really is middle of nowhere and only one bus line operates in that area. When we were on our way to the railway station (in his car) he asked me if I was busy and if I’d like to go to drink tea with him. Since I was not in a hurry I told him that it’d be ok to go for the tea. So we did.
We spend like one hour drinking tea and then he suggested that we would go to the city. I had time so we went there and ended up spending six hours there. We didn’t do anything weird stuff, we just walked around and talked. It was nice and I didn’t feel bad about it (and still don’t).
However, I started to think that was it really ok to spend the whole day with him? He’s in his 30’s and I’m a woman in my late teens. He also added me on fb and we chatted a bit there when I got home. I’m a new Catholic so I really have no idea if this was ok. Since it was the priest’s idea I guess it is ok because I believe priests know what’s appropriate and what is not but this thing keeps bothering me so I’d like to hear your opinions

 

[CatholicRaven]

If he had that much time available, I’d suspect he was just a little bored and maybe lonely. As long as the talk was only friendly and not at all flirty (even as a “joke”), and there was no inappropriate touch (rubbing shoulders, hand on knee, etc.)… well, I don’t think spending that much time together was exactly appropriate, but I think it was probably innocent. That’s not to say you should make a habit of this, of course.

Be careful not to put yourself in that position again, though. Take a friend or relative with you next time you visit the convent or meet with the priest. Even if it was innocent the first time around, you don’t want to tempt a good priest to think there is something more than friendship… and if by chance it wasn’t innocent (on his part) the first time, you definitely don’t want to put yourself in a vulnerable position where bad things could happen.

Yes, most priests (not all of them) do know what is appropriate and what isn’t. But so should you. You should not be dependent on another person to decide for you what is appropriate. That could leave you very vulnerable to bad people who only appear to be good people until they win your trust and can take advantage, simply because you trust their outward appearance. You’re a new Catholic, and you’re young, so this may take some time and experience to learn, but unfortunately, we cannot assume that a priest will always do what is right or appropriate.

Because here’s the thing: All priests are still men. They are still human beings, and just like us other human beings, they may occasionally slip and need a reminder when they get a little too close to crossing the line. They still make mistakes and they still sin, just like all of us. Even good and holy priests.

So, please just… be careful.

 

[chasingcars]

If he had that much time available, I’d suspect he was just a little bored and maybe lonely. As long as the talk was only friendly and not at all flirty (even as a “joke”), and there was no inappropriate touch (rubbing shoulders, hand on knee, etc.)… well, I don’t think spending that much time together was exactly appropriate, but I think it was probably innocent. That’s not to say you should make a habit of this, of course.

Be careful not to put yourself in that position again, though. Take a friend or relative with you next time you visit the convent or meet with the priest. Even if it was innocent the first time around, you don’t want to tempt a good priest to think there is something more than friendship… and if by chance it wasn’t innocent (on his part) the first time, you definitely don’t want to put yourself in a vulnerable position where bad things could happen.

Yes, most priests (not all of them) do know what is appropriate and what isn’t. But so should you. You should not be dependent on another person to decide for you what is appropriate. That could leave you very vulnerable to bad people who only appear to be good people until they win your trust and can take advantage, simply because you trust their outward appearance. You’re a new Catholic, and you’re young, so this may take some time and experience to learn, but unfortunately, we cannot assume that a priest will always do what is right or appropriate.

Because here’s the thing: All priests are still men. They are still human beings, and just like us other human beings, they may occasionally slip and need a reminder when they get a little too close to crossing the line. They still make mistakes and they still sin, just like all of us. Even good and holy priests.

So, please just… be careful.

Thank you for your kind message and good advice I think the wisest thing to do now is to go to the convent only when I know that he is not there. There wasn’t any inappropriate jokes but he touched me so often that it made me feel a bit uncomfortable. He grabbed my wrist many times because the ground was icy and slippery and he didn’t want me to slip (I was wearing high heels) so I don’t think he meant anything bad but it still feels kinda weird. I’ll really do my very best to avoid such situations in the future

 

[frizzgrig]

You don’t really give enough information for someone to make a sound determination if any “lines were crossed.”

There are a lot of things that would be “red or yellow flags” in such an encounter, such as:

Was the priest wearing clerical attire the entire time, or did he change into secular clothing
Were you both in public places the entire time
Was there any flirtatious behavior
Were the topics of conversation appropriate
Was there any Inappropriate touching
Was the priest behaving as a friend, mentor, etc. or did it seem like he was more a suitor?
Was any behavior you would not have expected from a high school teacher in public and in front of the students

Essentially it boils down to clerics are all people too. We enjoy socializing with people to some extent. Usually clerics remember they are clerics and behave as such. Sometimes, through human failing, we don’t.

Really, you should maybe be having this discussion with the priest (or another priest you trust) and not random people in an internet forum.

My personal analysis of the situation if it were me instead of your priest friend (I am a married permanent deacon if it matters):

I don’t see any problem offering you a ride (especially if the bus was infrequent), I don’t see a problem inviting you to tea in a public place along the way if I was going to stop or decided I wanted some tea. Inviting you to spend some time in the city - that would probably not be something I would do unless it was my day off and I really had nothing else planned and wanted some company (personally I am very used to doing things on my own). I wouldn’t have reached out to you on facebook, but if you had reached out to me I would have friended you and possibly chatted.

Did you objectively do anything “wrong?” It doesn’t seem like it. The fact that you have doubts about it suggests there is more to the story (either in reality, or in your mind). This is perhaps the biggest “red flag” here.

 

[chasingcars]

You don’t really give enough information for someone to make a sound determination if any “lines were crossed.”

There are a lot of things that would be “red or yellow flags” in such an encounter, such as:

Was the priest wearing clerical attire the entire time, or did he change into secular clothing
Were you both in public places the entire time
Was there any flirtatious behavior
Were the topics of conversation appropriate
Was there any Inappropriate touching
Was the priest behaving as a friend, mentor, etc. or did it seem like he was more a suitor?
Was any behavior you would not have expected from a high school teacher in public and in front of the students

Essentially it boils down to clerics are all people too. We enjoy socializing with people to some extent. Usually clerics remember they are clerics and behave as such. Sometimes, through human failing, we don’t.

Really, you should maybe be having this discussion with the priest (or another priest you trust) and not random people in an internet forum.

My personal analysis of the situation if it were me instead of your priest friend (I am a married permanent deacon if it matters):

I don’t see any problem offering you a ride (especially if the bus was infrequent), I don’t see a problem inviting you to tea in a public place along the way if I was going to stop or decided I wanted some tea. Inviting you to spend some time in the city - that would probably not be something I would do unless it was my day off and I really had nothing else planned and wanted some company (personally I am very used to doing things on my own). I wouldn’t have reached out to you on facebook, but if you had reached out to me I would have friended you and possibly chatted.

Did you objectively do anything “wrong?” It doesn’t seem like it. The fact that you have doubts about it suggests there is more to the story (either in reality, or in your mind). This is perhaps the biggest “red flag” here.

He was wearing secular clothing, we were in public place all of the time if being in his car doesn’t count and there wasn’t any flirtatious behaviour. Topics of conversations were appropriate but I’m not sure about the touching. I did not touch him at all but he touched me quite many times (wrist, back and hand) and do not think that a high school teacher would had acted in the exact same way in front of students. We are from different cultures so I don’t know if that has probably something to do with the way he acted. In my culture it’s not very common to touch others if they’re not close friends or family members so I wonder if that’s the reason why I felt uncomfortable or was there something else…

//edit: I mean that if he was from the same culture as I then I’d say that at least some lines were crossed but since there might be some significant cultural differences between us I can’t say for sure that what his intentions were and was his behaviour normal.

 

[PaulfromIowa]

I think that you are correct that you should avoid seeing him again anytime soon.

 

[808Catholic]

Today I went to Mass in a convent which is far away from everything. I went there by bus. I was the only lay person who attended and after the Mass when I was leaving the priest told me that he could take me to the railway station which sounded like a good idea for me because like I said, the convent really is middle of nowhere and only one bus line operates in that area. When we were on our way to the railway station (in his car) he asked me if I was busy and if I’d like to go to drink tea with him. Since I was not in a hurry I told him that it’d be ok to go for the tea. So we did.
We spend like one hour drinking tea and then he suggested that we would go to the city. I had time so we went there and ended up spending six hours there. We didn’t do anything weird stuff, we just walked around and talked. It was nice and I didn’t feel bad about it (and still don’t).
However, I started to think that was it really ok to spend the whole day with him? He’s in his 30’s and I’m a woman in my late teens. He also added me on fb and we chatted a bit there when I got home. I’m a new Catholic so I really have no idea if this was ok. Since it was the priest’s idea I guess it is ok because I believe priests know what’s appropriate and what is not but this thing keeps bothering me so I’d like to hear your opinions

I do not want to even hint at inappropriateness in this case. You made quite an effort to find and attend Mass. I commend you for your determination and faithfulness. The priest has made and, as far as anyone outside of himself knows, is keeping his vow of chastity. Done with that.

I would like to offer this perspective: to help the priest keep his vow intact, you could befriend him but not spend so much time physically with him. Not because you don’t trust him or like him but because you respect his position and vow so much. He may be a bit lonely; I presume he’s a chaplain for the convent and does not have many opportunities to talk to “outsiders” let alone one who’s willing to go to tea and spend time just conversing. I imagine that it must be so tempting to just socialize with someone! But on the other hand, the priest holds a very special position not only in the church but in the community so any chance to avoid scandal is probably the best way to go. Be friends with him; God knows our clergy could use friends! But be wary of how the visual of a young priest and young woman walking about town might be misconstrued.

God bless and have a great Lent!

 

[AnneElizabeth]

If he had that much time available, I’d suspect he was just a little bored and maybe lonely. As long as the talk was only friendly and not at all flirty (even as a “joke”), and there was no inappropriate touch (rubbing shoulders, hand on knee, etc.)… well, I don’t think spending that much time together was exactly appropriate, but I think it was probably innocent. That’s not to say you should make a habit of this, of course.

Be careful not to put yourself in that position again, though. Take a friend or relative with you next time you visit the convent or meet with the priest. Even if it was innocent the first time around, you don’t want to tempt a good priest to think there is something more than friendship… and if by chance it wasn’t innocent (on his part) the first time, you definitely don’t want to put yourself in a vulnerable position where bad things could happen.

Yes, most priests (not all of them) do know what is appropriate and what isn’t. But so should you. You should not be dependent on another person to decide for you what is appropriate. That could leave you very vulnerable to bad people who only appear to be good people until they win your trust and can take advantage, simply because you trust their outward appearance. You’re a new Catholic, and you’re young, so this may take some time and experience to learn, but unfortunately, we cannot assume that a priest will always do what is right or appropriate.

Because here’s the thing: All priests are still men. They are still human beings, and just like us other human beings, they may occasionally slip and need a reminder when they get a little too close to crossing the line. They still make mistakes and they still sin, just like all of us. Even good and holy priests.

So, please just… be careful.

^ Extremely good advice.

 

[chasingcars]

Thanks for good advice. And 808Catholic, happy Lent for you too

 

[CuriousMike]

I’ve found some people are more ‘touchy’ than others. They don’t just speak and nod heads, but will give more physical affirmations of body language.
A “pat on the back” generally isn’t bad, unless it was a move to drag you closer.
Hand squeezing isn’t bad either, but again, if it was a romantic move I might have questions.

In these situations, you must try and gauge what is happening before concerning yourself with what he is thinking.

Without giving away too much detail, I have spent time with an Order I am familiar with for periods of reflection. Due to travel arrangements, this necessitated staying an additional couple of days.
All the different priests I encountered each made different gestures to make me feel welcomed. Two invited me to join them for some recreation (light sports). Another invited me for evening prayer and Eucharist. Some spoke a lot (I spent 4-5hrs one day discussing the faith), others didn’t. Some were happy for us to “go our separate ways” and reconvene at a later time.

Now that I’ve moved into the city, I’ve attended several Catholic youth groups. A lot of people say that my personality suggests I have “an old soul.” So naturally, I tend to seek people older than me for friendship. It seems the priests and also youth leaders recognise this, so I spend more time befriending them than the other youth
However, by acquainting myself with several different priests, I have found new groups I can participate in and have been able to meet with them to discuss my any vocation I have. So really being able to communicate with the priests, and making sure I can just squeeze in a “G’Day!” can go a long way.

My anecdotes aren’t really all that relevant, but show different types of outreach, and just examples of how Priests may or may not try to relate to the people their minister to. See below for some more.

So to reiterate quickly:

• Try to understand what the Priest was doing. I doubt it was anything dubious. If you have reason to believe it was, either don’t allow yourself to be alone or perhaps avoid social contact outside of Church.
• Also understand some Priests will have issues with isolation. As a “socially awkward” person myself, sometimes when people aren’t acknowledging me much, I tend to worry that I “smothered” them. If he hasn’t had a lot of social contact, he too might be in this position, and just need someone from the secular world to detune a little bit (<- in a GOOD way, nothing weird).
• Continuing from above: One of the biggest reasons for men leaving the priesthood is lack of fraternity/community aspect of the life. You can say all the right prayers and lead a good spiritual life, but if there is no-one to support you, it can feel very discouraging. (Obviously this point has been invalid for those who decided to break their vows, and were the ones who were left over. A sad point, but worth noting).
• The Priest noticed you were the “odd one out,” and wanted to reach out to help you. You attended a Convent. Naturally, being a woman, he might think you had visited to “check things out,” and wanted to make a step to get to know you, if you should decide to pursue that kind of lifestyle.