Lament over Jerusalem

[wiggbuggie]

“O Jerusalem, Jerusalem, the city that kills the prophets and stones those who are sent to it! How often would I have gathered your children together as a hen gathers her brood under her wings, and you were not willing! See, your house is left to you desolate. ** For I tell you, you will not see me again, until you say, ‘Blessed is he who comes in the name of the Lord.’”**

Is this passage pointing to Jesus return? Jesus won’t return until the nation of Isreal will see him as the massiah? I think thats one of the signs of the second coming is conversion of the jewish people and there are messianic jews and groups like jews for jesus that minister to them.

On the other hand it could refer to Jesus entry into Jerusalem. Luke has it in a different order were that passage is placed before he entered into Jerusalem on palm sunday were the crowds cried out “Blessed is he who comes in the name of the Lord” Matthews gospel placed it after. It could be an ordering thing how the gospels are out of order and opening in lukes gospel said he researched everything anew and write an orderly account for you

 

[SAVINGRACE]

“O Jerusalem, Jerusalem, the city that kills the prophets and stones those who are sent to it! How often would I have gathered your children together as a hen gathers her brood under her wings, and you were not willing! See, your house is left to you desolate. For I tell you, you will not see me again, until you say, ‘Blessed is he who comes in the name of the Lord.’
**
Is this passage pointing to Jesus return? Jesus won’t return until the nation of Isreal will see him as the massiah? I think thats one of the signs of the second coming is conversion of the jewish people and there are messianic jews and groups like jews for jesus that minister to them.**

On the other hand it could refer to Jesus entry into Jerusalem. Luke has it in a different order were that passage is placed before he entered into Jerusalem on palm sunday were the crowds cried out “Blessed is he who comes in the name of the Lord” Matthews gospel placed it after. It could be an ordering thing how the gospels are out of order and opening in lukes gospel said he researched everything anew and write an orderly account for you

There are several signs including the rebuilding of the Temple at Temple Mount.

The United Nations body responsible for World Heritage sites (UNESCO) is poised to adopt a proposal condemning and limiting Jewish and Israeli activity in and around the site of the Temple Mount. With the potentially explosive decision, proposed by Jordan likely to pass this week, the decision will aggravate existing national and religious tensions in the Old City of Jerusalem.

Effectively that means no Jewish religious activity allowed on the site. It’s not a good sign.

 

[thistle]

“O Jerusalem, Jerusalem, the city that kills the prophets and stones those who are sent to it! How often would I have gathered your children together as a hen gathers her brood under her wings, and you were not willing! See, your house is left to you desolate. ** For I tell you, you will not see me again, until you say, ‘Blessed is he who comes in the name of the Lord.’”**

Is this passage pointing to Jesus return? Jesus won’t return until the nation of Isreal will see him as the massiah? I think thats one of the signs of the second coming is conversion of the jewish people and there are messianic jews and groups like jews for jesus that minister to them.

On the other hand it could refer to Jesus entry into Jerusalem. Luke has it in a different order were that passage is placed before he entered into Jerusalem on palm sunday were the crowds cried out “Blessed is he who comes in the name of the Lord” Matthews gospel placed it after. It could be an ordering thing how the gospels are out of order and opening in lukes gospel said he researched everything anew and write an orderly account for you

D-R Bible, Haydock Commentary:

Ver. 39. Till you say, blessed is he that cometh. Hereafter you shall own me for your Messias, and the world’s Redeemer, at least at the day of judgment. (Witham) — The time here foretold, when they should say: Blessed is he that cometh in the name of the Lord, is the day of general judgment. When our Saviour says, henceforth, we must understand it of all that time, which intervened between the time of his speaking and his passion. (St. Chrysostom, hom. lxxv.) — It may also be understood of the Jews, who are to be converted to the faith of Jesus Christ towards the end of the world. (Menochius)

 

[Gorgias]

Is this passage pointing to Jesus return? …

On the other hand it could refer to Jesus entry into Jerusalem. Luke has it in a different order were that passage is placed before he entered into Jerusalem on palm sunday were the crowds cried out “Blessed is he who comes in the name of the Lord”

Notice in your Bible that there’s a cross-reference at Luke 13:35 (the verse you quoted) to Luke 19:38 – Christ’s triumphal entry into Jerusalem, at which point (as you note) they said exactly this to Him.

 

[wiggbuggie]

There are several signs including the rebuilding of the Temple at Temple Mount.

The United Nations body responsible for World Heritage sites (UNESCO) is poised to adopt a proposal condemning and limiting Jewish and Israeli activity in and around the site of the Temple Mount. With the potentially explosive decision, proposed by Jordan likely to pass this week, the decision will aggravate existing national and religious tensions in the Old City of Jerusalem.

Effectively that means no Jewish religious activity allowed on the site. It’s not a good sign.

I know orthadox jews have been wanting to rebuild a third temple even setting up the sanhendrin again. Thing is muslims also control part of the land and build a dome on the location but most importantly we have to remember that Jesus is the third temple and we have to pray and minister to the nation of Isreal for the conversion.

 

[wiggbuggie]

Notice in your Bible that there’s a cross-reference at Luke 13:35 (the verse you quoted) to Luke 19:38 – Christ’s triumphal entry into Jerusalem, at which point (as you note) they said exactly this to Him.

so matthews gospel is out of order and that passage refers to Jesus truimphant entry into Jerusalem rather than end of times?

 

[Darryl_B]

“O Jerusalem, Jerusalem, the city that kills the prophets and stones those who are sent to it! How often would I have gathered your children together as a hen gathers her brood under her wings, and you were not willing! See, your house is left to you desolate. ** For I tell you, you will not see me again, until you say, ‘Blessed is he who comes in the name of the Lord.’”**

Is this passage pointing to Jesus return? Jesus won’t return until the nation of Isreal will see him as the massiah? I think thats one of the signs of the second coming is conversion of the jewish people and there are messianic jews and groups like jews for jesus that minister to them.

On the other hand it could refer to Jesus entry into Jerusalem. Luke has it in a different order were that passage is placed before he entered into Jerusalem on palm sunday were the crowds cried out “Blessed is he who comes in the name of the Lord” Matthews gospel placed it after. It could be an ordering thing how the gospels are out of order and opening in lukes gospel said he researched everything anew and write an orderly account for you

Do you mean Matthew 23:35 which is after Matthew 21:9? Matthew 23:35 was spoken in the Temple after entering Jerusalem, whereas Luke 13:35 was spoken before entry into Jerusalem.

I think the entry into Jerusalem is a fulfillment but it is not a complete fulfillment. I think it would be fulfilled by his resurrection. Reference to Psalm 118:26. Psalm 118:17 I shall not die, but I shall live and recount the deeds of the Lord. Psalm 118:22 The stone which the builders rejected has become the head of the corner. This is the day which the Lord has made; let us rejoice and be glad in it (Resurrection Sunday).

I think the procession of people into Jerusalem refers to the procession of souls into the Church.

 

[Telstar]

There are several signs including the rebuilding of the Temple at Temple Mount.

The United Nations body responsible for World Heritage sites (UNESCO) is poised to adopt a proposal condemning and limiting Jewish and Israeli activity in and around the site of the Temple Mount. With the potentially explosive decision, proposed by Jordan likely to pass this week, the decision will aggravate existing national and religious tensions in the Old City of Jerusalem.

Effectively that means no Jewish religious activity allowed on the site. It’s not a good sign.

I think one of the greatest misconceptions about things that are supposed to be ‘signs’ of the Second Coming of Jesus, is that the Temple of Jerusalem will be rebuilt before He comes. IMHO, all of the passages of scripture that mention the rebuilding “of the Temple”, or “the tabernacle of David”, are prophesies that refer to the Resurrection of Jesus and the building of His Church, instead. They have nothing to do with the Temple of Jerusalem being rebuilt at all. I think they prophesy the fulfillment of the Old Covenant, and the beginning of the New Covenant of Christ.

“Tobias (Tobit) 13:[11] Jerusalem, city of God, the Lord hath chastised thee for the works of thy hands. Give glory to the Lord for thy good things, and bless the God eternal, that he may rebuild his tabernacle in thee, and may call back all the captives to thee, and thou mayst rejoice for ever and ever.”
When He “descended to the dead” after He died on the cross, Jesus released “all the captives” who had died with the hope that the Messiah would release them, so they could finally enter Heaven.
“Amos 9:11 In that day** I will raise up the tabernacle of David, that is fallen**: and I will close up the breaches of the walls thereof, and repair what was fallen: and I will rebuild it as in the days of old.”
Jesus was from the house of David. This passage can easily be seen as a description of Jesus’ Resurrection.

Even Jesus said it, Himself, when He was throwing the moneychangers out of the Temple:
“John 2:[19] Jesus answered, and said to them: Destroy this temple, and in three days I will raise it up.”

He was speaking of Himself as the living Temple of God, Who would raise Himself from the dead on the third day.

 

[Gorgias]

so matthews gospel is out of order and that passage refers to Jesus truimphant entry into Jerusalem rather than end of times?

I don’t think that I’d call Matthew’s account “out of order”. Instead, it seems that Matthew is using this material in a different way in his recounting of Jesus’ story. Yes, given that the quote immediately precedes the discussion of the destruction of Jerusalem and predictions of the end times, it would seem that Matthew views these words of Jesus as having eschatological impact. That doesn’t make Matthew’s use of them – or Luke’s – as ‘wrong’…

 

[Darryl_B]

I don’t think that I’d call Matthew’s account “out of order”

In all probability Jesus would have given the same message to multiple groups of audiences. He had a message to give, an important message that was for multiple listeners, not just a select few.

Speaking the same message multiple times to multiple audiences is something apologists are all too familiar with. And how many times does the Church have to reiterate it’s position on certain moral issues.

The message is important because it is switching the perception of the followers from an expectation of a materially restored Davidic Zionist Messianic Kingdom complete with brick and stone temple (the entry into Jerusalem which went no further), into the Spiritually raised up and established Messianic Kingdom (the New Jerusalem the Church the Heaven).