Luke 17:21

[SeanF1989]

“Neither shall they say: Behold here, or behold there. For lo, the kingdom of God is within you”

I was having a discussion with a relative of mine and she told me that what Jesus meant by this is he was telling us you don’t have to go to Church to be with God.

I am a lapsed Catholic (who is finding his way home) so I really don’t know how to respond to this. Any help would be welcomed

 

[Todd_Easton]

In a sense, your friend is correct; God is indeed everywhere (omnipresent) and we don’t have to go to a church to be with him. However, for our benefit God chose to become specially present to us in the person of Jesus Christ during his earthly life to which Luke 17:21 refers.

Even today, God’s special presence in the person of Jesus Christ continues substantially in the Eucharist, which is confected by Catholic priests at Mass and often reserved in Catholic churches. To a lesser degree, God is also specially present in Christians in general and in Catholic priests in particular.

In 1 Corinthians 11:18-22, St. Paul gives the impression that Christians regularly assembled together as a Church to eat the Lord’s Supper (the Eucharist). And the author of Hebrews (Hebrews 10:25) directs Christians not to neglect to meet together.

 

[Gorgias]

Well, that’s a somewhat creative interpretation of that verse. After all, the subject is the coming of the Kingdom, not how to live in the era of the Kingdom. The Pharisees are asking, “when will the Kingdom come?” and Jesus essentially answers, “look guys, if you think you’re gonna see the Kingdom arrive, you’ve already missed the boat… look around – it’s already here!”

Does that help?

 

[fred_conty]

In the letters of St Paul, he mentions how they gathered together to receive the Body and Blood of Jesus. That is only possible by comming together not by being alone.
Jesus said to the Apostles at the Last Supper, “As often as you do this , do this in rememberance of me.”

And again Jesus said, “where two or three of you are gathered together, there I am in the midst.”

Jesus said again, “love one another”, which can not be done by being alone as demonstrated by the beautitudes.

 

[SeanF1989]

Well, that’s a somewhat creative interpretation of that verse. After all, the subject is the coming of the Kingdom, not how to live in the era of the Kingdom. The Pharisees are asking, “when will the Kingdom come?” and Jesus essentially answers, “look guys, if you think you’re gonna see the Kingdom arrive, you’ve already missed the boat… look around – it’s already here!”

Does that help?

Yes that helps. Thanks

But I guess I have should have mentioned that my relative said we shouldn’t go to Church at all.

 

[De_Maria]

Yes that helps. Thanks

But I guess I have should have mentioned that my relative said we shouldn’t go to Church at all.

Your relative would be wrong. Scripture says that those who miss the assembly of Jesus Christ are those who are His enemies. Let me show you:
Heb 10:
24And let us consider one another to provoke unto love and to good works:

** 25Not forsaking the assembling of ourselves together, as the manner of some is; but exhorting one another: and so much the more, as ye see the day approaching.**

** 26For if we sin wilfully after that we have received the knowledge of the truth, there remaineth no more sacrifice for sins,**

**27But a certain fearful looking for of judgment and fiery indignation, which shall devour the adversaries.

28He that despised Moses’ law died without mercy under two or three witnesses:

29Of how much sorer punishment, suppose ye, shall he be thought worthy, who hath trodden under foot the Son of God, and hath counted the blood of the covenant, wherewith he was sanctified, an unholy thing, and hath done despite unto the Spirit of grace?**

30For we know him that hath said, Vengeance belongeth unto me, I will recompense, saith the Lord. And again, The Lord shall judge his people.

Note how those who do not attend the Christian assembly, that is to say, the Mass, are those who walk upon the Body of Christ and the Blood of the New Covenant. In other words, they deny the Eucharist and cast it underfoot as an unholy thing.

Now, read some more:
and hath done despite unto the Spirit of grace

This is the blaspheme of the Holy Spirit.

Therefore, those who do not attend the Mass commit a mortal sin.

And those who never attend the Mass, commit the blasphemy of the Holy Spirit:
Matthew 12:31
King James Version (KJV)
31Wherefore I say unto you, All manner of sin and blasphemy shall be forgiven unto men: but the blasphemy against the Holy Ghost shall not be forgiven unto men.

Sincerely,

De Maria

 

[Gorgias]

Yes that helps. Thanks

But I guess I have should have mentioned that my relative said we shouldn’t go to Church at all.

Right. I thought that’s what you were getting at. But, the passage they chose to use to prove their point, doesn’t speak to the argument they’re making – it doesn’t say what they want it to say. You’re not gonna get them to abandon the idea of “no Church attendence” by pointing this out, but you would at least validly be able to assert that they haven’t proven their point and be able to ask them if there’s any other justification for their assertion…

 

[rhiannonh]

prove their point aspect

well nothing will in that sense. The main thing is that you know where you are at and if they want to argue all night, then let them. You know God is everywhere.

We go to church to worship and learn about God together as ‘a family’. Last Advent we discussed about the church being like the Desert in that in the Desert one learns about faith etc. We go to church because we love God.

But as said, God is everywhere and you can pray any time anywhere with any words you like. Many will tell you rules to prayer but the only rule, if its a rule there is, is that you talk to God. How and when etc is entirely what you are comfortable with when you are at home. In church we join in with each other.

Don’t get bogged down with all the rules and trying to argue concepts. Allow God to be your Guide