Marriage and consummation and impotence

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Bruised_Reed

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I know that Canon 1084 says that a person with permanent, antecedent impotence may not marry in the Church. I haven’t found the 1917 Code in English but it would say the same thing, correct?

So my question is when was this first mentioned in any writings of the church? Code of Canon Law codified laws of the Church but this was always the teaching of the church. Where is the earliest mention of this by the Church Fathers or Doctors of the Church or a Pope?

Thanks.
 
Kielbasi said:
This impediment to marriage was discussed in Aquinas’ Summa, in the 13th Century.

newadvent.org/summa/5058.htm
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Great! Thanks for that. At first glance it appears as though he is contradicting Church teaching but it’s just the format of the writing. I think that will be helpful to the discussion I’m having. That, and the dates the Summa was written.
 
Bruised_Reed said:
I know that Canon 1084 says that a person with permanent, antecedent impotence may not marry in the Church. I haven’t found the 1917 Code in English but it would say the same thing, correct?

So my question is when was this first mentioned in any writings of the church? Code of Canon Law codified laws of the Church but this was always the teaching of the church. Where is the earliest mention of this by the Church Fathers or Doctors of the Church or a Pope?

Thanks.
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From a point of curiosity it is a valid question.

From the point of grave moral obligation ; not so much so

Mt 16:18-19

[18] And I say to YOU: That thou art Peter; and upon this rock I will build my church, and the gates of hell shall not prevail against it. [19] And I will give to YOU the keys of the kingdom of heaven. And whatsoever YOU shalt bind upon earth, it shall be bound also in heaven: and whatsoever YOU shalt loose upon earth, i****t shall be loosed also in heaven

Amen:thumbsup:
 
PJM said:
From a point of curiosity it is a valid question.

From the point of grave moral obligation ; not so much so

Mt 16:18-19

[18] And I say to YOU: That thou art Peter; and upon this rock I will build my church, and the gates of hell shall not prevail against it. [19] And I will give to YOU the keys of the kingdom of heaven. And whatsoever YOU shalt bind upon earth, it shall be bound also in heaven: and whatsoever YOU shalt loose upon earth, i****t shall be loosed also in heaven

Amen:thumbsup:
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I’m sorry, you lost me. Clarify?
 
Bruised_Reed said:
I know that Canon 1084 says that a person with permanent, antecedent impotence may not marry in the Church. I haven’t found the 1917 Code in English but it would say the same thing, correct?

So my question is when was this first mentioned in any writings of the church? Code of Canon Law codified laws of the Church but this was always the teaching of the church. Where is the earliest mention of this by the Church Fathers or Doctors of the Church or a Pope?

Thanks.
Click to expand...
The 1917 Or Pio-Benedictine Code of Canon Law: In English Translation
By Catholic Church, Edward N. Peters:

Can. 1068
.1 Antecedent and perpetual impotence, either on the part of the man or on the part of the woman, whether known or not, whether absolute or relative, impedes marriage by natural law itself.
.2 If the impediment of impotence is doubtful, weather this be a doubt of law or a doubt of fact, marriage should not be impeded.
.3 Sterility neither impedes nor [renders illicit] marriage.
 
Bruised_Reed said:
Great! Thanks for that. At first glance it appears as though he is contradicting Church teaching but it’s just the format of the writing.
Click to expand...
Right. You need to know how to read the form of the Summa for it to be helpful. The presence of ‘objections’ and ‘contraries’ doesn’t mean that Aquinas is advocating for them – just that he’s recognizing that some thinkers bring up these points in their arguments.
 
Vico said:
The 1917 Or Pio-Benedictine Code of Canon Law: In English Translation
By Catholic Church, Edward N. Peters:

Can. 1068
.1 Antecedent and perpetual impotence, either on the part of the man or on the part of the woman, whether known or not, whether absolute or relative, impedes marriage by natural law itself.
.2 If the impediment of impotence is doubtful, weather this be a doubt of law or a doubt of fact, marriage should not be impeded.
.3 Sterility neither impedes nor [renders illicit] marriage.
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THANKS

GREAT reply

GBY
 
Vico said:
The 1917 Or Pio-Benedictine Code of Canon Law: In English Translation
By Catholic Church, Edward N. Peters:

Can. 1068
.1 Antecedent and perpetual impotence, either on the part of the man or on the part of the woman, whether known or not, whether absolute or relative, impedes marriage by natural law itself.
.2 If the impediment of impotence is doubtful, weather this be a doubt of law or a doubt of fact, marriage should not be impeded.
.3 Sterility neither impedes nor [renders illicit] marriage.
Click to expand...
Thanks for the 1917 Code in English. The Summa goes back even to the 1200s and I am looking for the oldest mention of this.
 
Bruised_Reed said:
Thanks for the 1917 Code in English. The Summa goes back even to the 1200s and I am looking for the oldest mention of this.
Click to expand...
Pope Alexander III wrote (~ 1171 A.D.):

But although the Roman church is not accustomed to separate persons that have been lawfully joined together on ground of natural frigidity or other maleficia, nevertheless, if it is the general custom of the Gallican church that marriages of the sort should be dissolved, we shall be patiently tolerant if, in accordance with that custom, you grant the woman the permission to marry whom she wills in the Lord.

How Marriage Became One of the Sacraments: The Sacramental Theology of Marriage from its Medieval Origins to the Council of Trent, By Philip Reynolds
 
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